Bin Laden Killed in US ground operation outside Islamabad

[Del Boy]

Sorry DB .....

Just to abuse you of the thought that American Forces did ANYTHING to Osama Bin Laden's body (other than cleaning him up and wrapping his body following Muslim tradition, and then burying him at sea) ... TO THINK OTHERWISE IS SO MUCH MUSH-HEADED THINKING ON YOUR PART. Americans do NOT desecrate people's bodies ... NOT EVEN THOSE WHO ARE OUR WORST ENEMIES.

He was handled and treated much kindlier amd with more respect than any American's body that was in the hands of Muslin extremist enemies. We have NEVER beheaded a prisoner nor have we EVER desecrated a body by hanging it up in public view (which is the USUAL treatment of Americans or prisoners held by extremist terrorists).

As far as I am concerned, Bin Laden received no more than what he deserved ... a bullet to the head, and then a burial at sea (to keep anyone from using his body to create a martyr's grave site).

MAY HE ROT FOREVER IN HELL.

WHOA Chief - you got me wrong there; I'm with you on this one. Take a long look at the preceding posts and all will become clear. Simpy a joke about what he truly deserved from the Americans, having so fatefully fallen into their hands.

My first post stated simply:-

'Method of disposal was well chosen, militarily and politically, IMHO.'

And on another thread here I posted ' Lo and Behold, Justice'.

No accusations of American justice from me.

 

[senojekips]

Sorry DB .....

Just to abuse you of the thought that American Forces did ANYTHING to Osama Bin Laden's body (other than cleaning him up and wrapping his body following Muslim tradition, and then burying him at sea) ... TO THINK OTHERWISE IS SO MUCH MUSH-HEADED THINKING ON YOUR PART. Americans do NOT desecrate people's bodies ... NOT EVEN THOSE WHO ARE OUR WORST ENEMIES.

He was handled and treated much kindlier amd with more respect than any American's body that was in the hands of Muslin extremist enemies. We have NEVER beheaded a prisoner nor have we EVER desecrated a body by hanging it up in public view (which is the USUAL treatment of Americans or prisoners held by extremist terrorists).

As far as I am concerned, Bin Laden received no more than what he deserved ... a bullet to the head, and then a burial at sea (to keep anyone from using his body to create a martyr's grave site).

MAY HE ROT FOREVER IN HELL.

Exactly what planet do you live on Chief? Obviously you don't remember some of this:-

2005: U.S. soldiers videotaped desecrating Taliban corpses. The bodies were positioned to face Mecca and burned -- an act of desecration that violates Islamic burial rites and the Geneva Conventions. A U.S. PsyOps specialist broadcast an inflammatory message to the nearby town in order to incite an attack. "Attention, Taliban, you are all cowardly dogs. You allowed your fighters to be laid down facing west and burned. You are too scared to come down and retrieve their bodies. This just proves you are the lady boys we always believed you to be." www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/oct/20/usa.afghanistan

2010 US army apologises for desecrating corpse Source; http://www.dawn.com/2011/03/22/us-army-apologises-for-desecrating-corpse.html

No,... I'm not saying that his body was desecrated, nor would I particularly care on a personal level, if it were. I'm just pointing out that it's far better to keep your mouth shut, than to confirm the very thing you are trying to deny.

 

[A Can of Man]

My thoughts exactly. We are dancing in the streets while the nettles grow in the garden.

It's the first bit of good news in a world gone to s**t. Let us celebrate for once.

 

[Chief Bones]

Let the celebrating begin .....

Keep my mouth shut ..... B U L L S H ! T .....

I want to scream from roof top to roof top ..........

OSAMA BIN LADEN IS DEAD ...

HE HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM THE FACE OF THE EARTH ...

LONG MAY HE ROT IN HELL.


Let the celebrations begin .....

 

[senojekips]

It's the first bit of good news in a world gone to s**t. Let us celebrate for once.

What good news?

One of our major failings seems to be that we are all too willing to count our chickens before they hatch, we may well find that have in fact, bitten off our nose to spite our face.

As I have said several times, he was merely a figurehead of no "tactical" use to them, and now we have made him into a martyr, plus there is a good chance that he might be replaced by a far more dangerous man, and there are plenty of them out there.

 

[Chief Bones]

NOT A MARTYR .....

Seno ...

Must I repeat myself .....

B U L L S H ! T .....

Osama is NOT more of a martyr now, than he was to start with ...

The fact that his body was removed, prepared for burial and then buried at sea .. stops any possibility of his burial site being consecrated as a "Martyr's Memorial" by extremist Muslim forces.

Not only are Americans celebrating his death everywhere, even Muslims in the Middls East are celebrating his death ..... the Pakistani Ambassador stated he was 'imminently' happy that Bin Laden was dead. Bin Laden was an enemy of all Pakistanis and mainstream Muslims .. he was a terrorist who was as liable to attack his own people, as to attack a foreign country.

While I don't really like to celebrate ANY person's death, in Bin Laden's case, I am making an exception .....

MAIN STREET FOLKS DOING THE TEXAS TWO-STEP IN CELEBRATION.


While you are probably right about Bin Laden's replacement, we will also take care of him when the time arises.

 

[senojekips]

Seno ...

Must I repeat myself .....

B U L L S H ! T .....

Osama is NOT more of a martyr now, than he was to start with ...

The fact that his body was removed, prepared for burial and then buried at sea .. stops any possibility of his burial site being consecrated as a "Martyr's Memorial" by extremist Muslim forces.

Not only are Americans celebrating his death everywhere, even Muslims in the Middls East are celebrating his death ..... the Pakistani Ambassador stated he was 'imminently' happy that Bin Laden was dead. Bin Laden was an enemy of all Pakistanis and mainstream Muslims .. he was a terrorist who was as liable to attack his own people, as to attack a foreign country.

While I don't really like to celebrate ANY person's death, in Bin Laden's case, I am making an exception .....

While you are probably right about Bin Laden's replacement, we will also take care of him when the time arises.

It has been said that there are only two things that are infinite,.... the bounds of the universe, and the stupidity of some people. I now know that the second statement is definitely true.

Would you care to explain how you came to the mind blowing conclusion that he is no more a martyr now "than he was to start with",... Just in case you didn't realise, You have to be dead before you can become a martyr.

Your childishly simplistic overconfidence in your new found abilities is also really hard to understand. We took TEN YEARS just to find and kill one man, and you are blathering on as if we have just won the damned war. I think yesterday's "success" has adled your brain either that or your celebratory drinks have been taken to excess. I have also noted that you have changed the subject from my original post about your totally unthought comment regarding the "impossiblity" of desecration of bodies by US forces, to the celebration or otherwise of OBLs demise whic I never mentioned.

 

[Chief Bones]

Seno ...

I am unable to say exactly what I think of you and your condescending comments. If I were to do so, I would AGAIN draw an unearned and undeserved reprimand from the MODS.

In order to protect myself from your continuing asinine comments and disrespect .. and .. in order to head off the possibility of getting crosswise of the MODS, I am placing you on my ignore list.

Have fun belittling the rest of the fine soldiers and ex-soldiers who have earned MY undying respect and admiration.

In YOUR case, there is absolutely NO respect .. only my complete and utter disdain and dislike. May you soon join your hero.

 

[MontyB]

I think the point here is that by all means be happy Bin Laden is dead but remember al Qaeda is not a single headed snake it is a hydra chopping one head off just pisses the others off and one of those remaining heads is a man that is probably more dangerous than Bin Laden in the form of Ayman al-Zawahiri.

 

[Seehund]

Osama bin Laden through his choices and actions attracted a backlash that had to be triggered before or since. His death has symbolic significance and may seem encouraging for the many that are personally involved and affected by terrorism and fundamentalism. But it is and remains a short-sighted and bittersweet consolation if it stands alone because it does not in itself make the world a better place. Set within a narrow perspective, it's simply a moment in a chain reaction that can seem endless. The only thing that can lead to such action-reaction chain termination is a profound understanding. Removal of threats, in the form of equipment or people, may be needed as a defense of life, and blind pacifism is no solution.

But the challenge is and remains whether we can reduce the root of the hatred and self-righteous fanaticism that leads to such acts and that we prospectively can prevent new hatred, new divisions and new conflicts that are stimulated and allowed to damage our lives.

Although Osama bin Laden has played a withdrawn role in al-Qaida in recent years, his symbolic importance as head of global militant Islamism has been great. The fact that he for many years has been able to avoid apprehension has given him status and probably increased his charismatic appeal among supporters. It's over now, but the creation of Osama bin Laden as an icon will as a result of his death be strengthened. Osama bin Laden's propaganda value for the militant Islamists has become markedly increased with his death. In the short term, Osama bin Laden's death mean that individuals or small groups will step up the attack planning, especially outside Europe, and Osama bin Laden's death can intensify the threat of militant Islamist attack particularly in Pakistan and possibly Afghanistan. It is possible that al-Qaida and related organizations will advance the existing planning attacks to avenge Osama bin Laden's death. There will for the militant Islamists be prestige in being the first to avenge him and demonstrate that Islamic militants continue to operate.

Al-Qaida management's ideological role has had a central importance for the overall terrorist threat against the West. Osama bin Laden's death could eventually lead to a fragmentation of al-Qaida leadership. This could lead to heart of al-Qaeda no longer can function as a cohesive organization by infighting and the lack of a unifying charismatic leader. Fragmentation can lead to a more complex threat with more and possibly new terrorist organizations willing to attack Western interests.

The vacuum after Osama bin Laden's could likely, in the longer term, be exploited by other al-Qaida-related terrorist groups that could take a more dominant role. Especially al-Qaida on the Arabian Peninsula may take an even more dominant role in propaganda production and execution of terrorist attacks. Likewise, the terrorist threat from other terrorist groups such as al-Shabaab, Lashkar-e-Tayyiba and Pakistani Taliban is unchanged. It is my belief that the ideological message of global militant Islamist struggle against the West will survive Osama bin Laden's death and continue to inspire other terrorist groups and networks, and individuals to continue the armed struggle.

 

[Chief Bones]

I think the point here is that by all means be happy Bin Laden is dead but remember al Qaeda is not a single headed snake it is a hydra chopping one head off just pisses the others off and one of those remaining heads is a man that is probably more dangerous than Bin Laden in the form of Ayman al-Zawahiri.

Monty ...

I have to agree with the way you put that. (And I AM happy that justice has finally been meted out to Osama Bin Laden). I am NOT dancing in the street .. but, I am happy that justice has been served .. even though it took almost ten years.


There is every possibility that the new AlQaeda leader will be more poisonois and dangerous that Osama Bin Laden was ... H O W E V E R ... the new leader is NOT the leader that was responsible for the deaths of so many people on 9/11. That leader was Bin Laden ... and ... justice was administered at the pointed end of a bullet to the head. That IS one snake that has been removed from the face of the earth ... one snake that we will no longer have to shake the bushes to find. We know exactly where he is ... at the bottom of the sea where he will NEVER be enshrined as a martyr.

Is the war on terror won and over with because of his death??? The answer is emphatically NO ... we will have to continue to route out terrorists wherever we find them ... and, I hope that we can administer the same kind of justice to them, as was administered to Osama Bin Laden.

MAY HE (and they) FOREVER ROT IN HELL.

 

[mmarsh]

I think the point here is that by all means be happy Bin Laden is dead but remember al Qaeda is not a single headed snake it is a hydra chopping one head off just pisses the others off and one of those remaining heads is a man that is probably more dangerous than Bin Laden in the form of Ayman al-Zawahiri.

The snakes were always pissed off, these are radicals they wont stop no matter what. You are right Killing bin Laden wont stop them, but it will unnerve them and remind them of two basic facts:

1. Their safety is an illusion, there is no safe haven anywhere, not even with his obvious friends in the ISI. One little mistake, can be fatal. In bin Laden's case, it was relying a little too much on his faithful courier.

2. Only dead will they be free of us. Allah may be merciful, we won't be. And don't believe the propaganda of them wanting to be a martyr. If bin Laden wanted to be a Martyr he would have strolled into a checkpoint with a bomb strapped to his chest years ago. The fact he used his own wife as a human shield shows how much he wanted to live.

And killing someone like bin laden does disrupt them. Right Now I guarantee you that Ayman al-Zawahri is making changes to his operations and security systems.

 

[senojekips]

Seno ...

I am unable to say exactly what I think of you and your condescending comments. If I were to do so, I would AGAIN draw an unearned and undeserved reprimand from the MODS.

In order to protect myself from your continuing asinine comments and disrespect .. and .. in order to head off the possibility of getting crosswise of the MODS, I am placing you on my ignore list.

Have fun belittling the rest of the fine soldiers and ex-soldiers who have earned MY undying respect and admiration.

In YOUR case, there is absolutely NO respect .. only my complete and utter disdain and dislike. May you soon join your hero.

Now that is about the level of intelligence I would expect of a man who made the earlier highly uninformed comments. Personally i think you are more miffed at the fact that i caught you out both making a stupid assumption and trying to derail the debate to excuse yourself.

Yes, I realise that no one likes someone "p!ssing on their parade" but in cases where obvious false statements have been made it needs to be done. Whether you read this or not, does not concern me. For me it is far more important that others know my reasoning, and that I'm not fooled by your previous incorrect statements.

Nowhere have I belittled anyone, but it was a nice try by you anyway. I think you need to grow up a bit.

 

[Del Boy]

WHOA Chief - you got me wrong there; I'm with you on this one. Take a long look at the preceding posts and all will become clear. Simpy a joke about what he truly deserved from the Americans, having so fatefully fallen into their hands.

My first post stated simply:-

'Method of disposal was well chosen, militarily and politically, IMHO.'

And on another thread here I posted ' Lo and Behold, Justice'. BRAVO.

No accusations of American justice from me.

C'mon Chief - read my posts and at least withdraw the accusations you hurled at me. That was incorrect and needs to be put right, don't you think, avoids any hard feelings.

 

[Chief Bones]

Sorry ...

C'mon Chief - read my posts and at least withdraw the accusations you hurled at me. That was incorrect and needs to be put right, don't you think, avoids any hard feelings.

DB ...

In this one case I don't appreciate your jokes. On 9/11 thousands of Americans were murdered by this louse and the operations that were carried out that placed a bullet in his brain is simple justice as far as I am concerned.

The wording of your post hinted that you agreed with Seno's comment that Americans would even consider putting Bin Laden's body through a woodchipper .. a comment that raised the hackles on the back of my neck (considering the fact that Americans cleaned his body, wrapped him in a sheet in accordance with Muslim doctrine, held a service (where they read from the Koran), and then buried him at sea). While there have been very infrequent cases of American troops violating basic human rights and desecrating human remains, the American military and the American people DO NOT PRACTICE THE DESECRATION OF BODIES ... EVEN WHEN IT IS AN ENEMY - something that is done on a regular basis by our terrorist enemies. Bin Laden (Enemy Number One), was handled with respect, was prepared for burial with respect, and buried with the normal respect and reverence that we would give one of our own.

I guess that I am tired of seing disrespect for America and for America's military. When disrespectful comments appear on a military forum where the majority of the members are military and ex-military ... then my funny-bone loses all of it's humor. I put up with that crappola when I came home from Vietnam. To see that crap aimed at our brave forces today, causes me to have a violent reaction towards those whose comments are in anyway disrespectful.

I may have over-reacted to your and Seno's comments .. HOWEVER, I had good cause. There are thousands of Osama Bin Laden's victims who aren't around to celebrate the louse's demise. What they would do to Bin Laden's remains is moot ... they are NOT around to make their feelings known.

 

[KJ]

F*ck that piece of rubbish, he got his.

Today I don´t drink in celebration of his death.
I drink in remembrance of the men who payed the ultimate price, uprooting, sending him on his way and finally caught up with and killed him.

Keep you eye on the ball here people.
Good men have sweated, bled and died hunting this bastard over a decade, while at the same time keeping the AOO some sort of safe for ordinary civilians.

To the fallen..

 

[Del Boy]

CHIEF BONES

You are insisting upon putting words into my mouth and disrespecting me in continuing to do so, having been warned. Show me anywhere on this forum where i have been anything but the best friend USA could have. Show me one item.

Don't smear me with your dodgy scenario. I have shown you my posts on this subject, which were there to be read, you should follow the narrative. I have been very patient.

As far as I was concerned Seno was making the point that his description was the fate OBL truly deserved. My mild joke was not that USA had done that, but that they certainly owed him it.

I have already told you you have me competely wrong and you have continued to point the finger.

Withdraw and apologise.

 

[senojekips]

Well, at least you got my joke Delboy.

I fully understood that your earlier statement indicated no more than the fact that OBL got his just desserts, and you might point out to Chiefy that you made your statement before I made mine, and therefore could not have been agreeing with my joke about the woodchipper. It would appear that he's desperate to cover his rather stupid and oversensitive statements by trying to put words in your mouth.

Having said that, I will freely admit without any pangs of conscience whatsoever, as I did in the original post, that had his body been treated as I stated, I would not have been incensed on a personal level, but would have thought it to be a public relations and propaganda disaster, not to mention contravening the ICHR and a dozen other International conventions.

As for myself, all I did was point out to him the stupidity of his remarks that persons within the US forces would never desecrate a body. They have done it before, and I have little doubt that it has probably occured with Australian troops as well. I'm not proud of the fact, but I wouldn't get all upset if it were pointed out to me.

 

[Del Boy]

Well Seno - I thought that we dealt with the joke very well, a nice light touch in the circumstances and that my response to you was a cool unwritten compliment to the Americans having got their hands on him.

I respected how quickly you took up the cudgels re. authorship. I would not have hid behind that of course - but it was a pleasure to see how readily you inervened nevertheless. Just like old times.

Meanwhile I await a response from Chief Bones.

 

[perseus]

Reports are that Bin Laden was not armed when killed and the 'human shield' was actually someone caught in the crossfire. Now I recognise few will be concerned about him being dead. However, I might have expected some would have preferred him to be brought to trial and punishment. Shooting him is no different than giving Goering cyanide to escape the hangman's noose.

It makes me wonder if it was the official policy to kill and not capture him since it may have antagonised militants even more to see him ridiculed. Bin Laden had most to benefit from his own death anyway, it wouldn't have been a pleasant experience for him.