Anti-Islam filmmaker in hiding after protests

[USAgirl]

I don't see the US as "the bad guy". Far from it.

Just seems these religious nutters in the US have a free reign?

When was the last time some from the UK posted some sort of anti Islam stuff on the Internet, resulting in the stuff we're seeing today?

The US aren't helped by the fact that the middle east despise them due to the recent wars.

Hmmm, I am thinking the key word there is "free"

But to your point, I have just spend 6 years living in England so I can speak a little of what I noticed while living there too, fair?

I would say in general you are a more socialist society, yes or no?

And I remember watching many shows that had to deal with the Muslim population and its issues that the community was experiencing. Mostly the morning shows on the weekend.

One issue was with the burka and if they should or should not be allowed to wear them as it was making some Brits uneasy, in addition, there were also security issues associated with them at the time.

You have to remember, I came to live there shortly after 9/11 and I was living two blocks away from the London bombing of the underground and double decker bus, can you say scared of my own shadow?

I was also living there when they rounded up those guys that were making bombs and planning an attack on London, remember they were testing them out in the fields and had them buried?

I was there when the car drove into the airport with a Muslim driver but the bomb didn't go off. I was there when the night club had a Muslim bomb threat etc etc etc

You have a huge Muslim population in England now and a lot of money that comes through the banks are said to have questionable connections ..

as in ....."you Brits just let our Muslim people in, don't questioin our expansion even to the domination of your own culture and do what we say and we will not create violence in your country and will keep the money coming into your banks and buy your property...

but....when the Islam extremist told you to drop America and Bush and get out of the fight of war on terror and Blair did not fold to their demands, they bombed your behind in a heart beat right along with the US.

I know most of the Brits don't like Blair but I don't think you took kindly to having your country attacked by radical Islamist right?

And I am not sure if you are less religeous in general as a society and so you don't have as many issues as you did in past times or not.

I think one of the reasons America came to be is because we wanted out of England to be free to worship, yes?

And I think you had religeous issues within your own country between the royals, yes? Queen Mary vs Queen Elizabeth?

And wasn't the big issue with Ireland over religon and land?

My husband and I loved our time in England and abroad and made great friends in England, France and Spain of all cultures and faith. I think we were very respectful of other cultures while living there and were good representatives for America, we always look forward to our return visits.

PS...Capt, thanks for not thinking totally bad of us and having us be the "bad guy" human yes, bad or evil, no way.

 

[03USMC]

Now we are going to amend our constitution to protect the killers?

Mind you, the killers didn't even kill the person who "inflamed" them!

So what is next, I am at a coffee house and say something that offends or inflames someone and they can go out, get in their car and run people down?

Bad bad bad thinking there.

Read it again and attempt to comprehend what I wrote in the context it was written in.

 

[USAgirl]

Read it again and attempt to comprehend what I wrote in the context it was written in.

Alright then USMC, I get what you were saying, the legal part of it all without emotion, but heck, I am emotional about this and passionate about what our founding fathers put in place , I always think the suits are trying to manipulate our laws to protect the guilty and I don't like it one darn bit.

 

[senojekips]

]
The Law no doubt pertains to direct incitement, or should be. It's a bit outragious to say people in the West can't offer a negative thought about Islam because a hyper-sensitive crowd somewhere might start a riot.

No doubt? What law do you know of where there is no doubt? If that were even vaguely true we would not need lawyers.

Personally I see a lot of doubt, and I also have deep suspicions that it was in all probability done deliberately with the intent of inciting Muslims in general, bearing in mind the reactions to the two previous similar cases I quoted.

If there is a movie you have two choices. ---snip---

I wonder what they would say if we removed the burkas and nikabs from the women because it offends us!

I don't agree with you on much, but I do believe you are very near the mark in this case.

 

[USAgirl]

No doubt? What law do you know of where there is no doubt? If that were even vaguely true we would not need lawyers.

Personally I see a lot of doubt, and I also have deep suspicions that it was in all probability done deliberately with the intent of inciting Muslims in general, bearing in mind the reactions to the two previous similar cases I quoted.

I don't agree with you on much, but I do believe you are very near the mark in this case.

Turns out your are right senojekips, the guy is not Isreali, he is a crypto Christian and Egyptian according to CNN.

I am going to have to look into what exactly a crypto Christian is and will get back to you.

I guess this guy is a shady character and is in deep hiding. He has been in to cooking meth (drugs) fraud (checks) etc etc

 

[senojekips]

Come on senojekips, ---snip---.

You are telling us what happens in America, did you stop for one minute to consider that although the film may have been made in America, the fall out from it could involve many other countries. Countries that do not have either US laws or US beliefs, these countries are not interested in what America does or thinks, and the fact that they are sometimes inhabited by religious nut cases should make people think a little bit more what they say and do.

If you insist upon teasing the bear, don't whine when you, or some other innocent person gets bitten.

What happened is a tragedy, but it was not unforeseeable.

Turns out your are right senojekips, the guy is not Isreali, he is a crypto Christian and Egyptian according to CNN.

I am going to have to look into what exactly a crypto Christian is and will get back to you.

I guess this guy is a shady character and is in deep hiding. He has been in to cooking meth (drugs) fraud (checks) etc etc

Really, the religion of the film maker is not important to me, what I see as important was either, his lack of forethought before doing what he did, or was it done with the intent of inciting an already very volatile situation, and what was his intent if that were the case.

 

[George]

You are telling us what happens in America, did you stop for one minute to consider that although the film may have been made in America, the fall out from it could involve many other countries. Countries that do not have either US laws or US beliefs, these countries are not interested in what America does or thinks, and the fact that they are sometimes inhabited by religious nut cases should make people think a little bit more what they say and do.

If you insist upon teasing the bear, don't whine when you, or some other innocent person gets bitten.

What happened is a tragedy, but it was not unforeseeable.

Really, the religion of the film maker is not important to me, what I see as important was either, his lack of forethought before doing what he did, or was it done with the intent of inciting an already very volatile situation, and what was his intent if that were the case.

Should we be self-limited by the fact that certain groups act like rabid dogs?

No doubt? What law do you know of where there is no doubt? If that were even vaguely true we would not need lawyers.

Personally I see a lot of doubt, and I also have deep suspicions that it was in all probability done deliberately with the intent of inciting Muslims in general, bearing in mind the reactions to the two previous similar cases I quoted.

seems that The Riot Act dates from @ least a Century ago, so I don't think they had filmakers as a target of the Law, just those directly stirring up a crowd.

Latest news reports said that the filmaker dliberatly misled the people in the film as to what it was about & overdubbed the voices to completely different content.

 

[senojekips]

Should we be self-limited by the fact that certain groups act like rabid dogs?

I'm sure if you could ask that question of the victims, they would have a very strong views on the matter.

We can be as irresponsible and uncaring as we like, what we must realise though, is that if we choose to go down that path, we can't whine about the outcome and expect sympathy, when it all goes pear shaped and someone is injured or killed. Risk assessment and accepting responsibility are several of the basic skills we are expected to develop as we grow into adulthood, in fact, one's ability to assess risk to oneself and others, is often used as a gauge of maturity

seems that The Riot Act dates from @ least a Century ago, so I don't think they had filmakers as a target of the Law, just those directly stirring up a crowd.

Very true, many laws are based on principles 400 or more years old, but that in no way makes them less applicable to today's situation. To deliberately incite someone to violence has the same outcome today as it did then, someone is liable to suffer as a result, and unfortunately it is often a totally innocent third party.

 

[pixiedustboo]

I have to admit my head and my heart and taking me in two directions, one of CF and one of USMC. My head says we should abide by the 1st amendment, but my heart wishes that people like this film maker be held responsible for the things they set in motion.

In the end I side with USMC. The film maker did not personally kill anyone, the blood is on the hands of those who cannot control their temper and let blind rage rule them.

And all for what?

Religion is an evil tool of death.

Just seems these religious nutters in the US have a free reign?

I can't agree with this enough. While I support the 1st amendment I am sickened by some of the things that it protects. KKK speeches, WBC.... Is there a line? Should their be a line? I don't know. My heart says their should be a line. When you have military men coming home in a coffin to be greeted by hate speeches...it's digusting and it is not something we should tolerate as a nation in my opinion. Again though, that brings the question, where is the line? I don't think WBC should picket children's funerals either...who's call is it what can be said and what can not be said?

 

[O.W.E.G.]

Again, I might be sad or not pleased with you for burning a bunch of bibles or my flag for that matter but I wouldn't then go and kill four innocent people OWEG

I'm not saying that its an excuse for killing people though. the ambassador had nothing to do with the actions and killing him was a stupid act from stupid individuals.

Wow u need glasses ,don't you ?
And are extremists only in Islam ? you want to tell me there are only radical Islamists out there?
Moreover I did a little research about the makers of this film they are Egyptians yes, but on many occasions they have asked America and Israel to enter Egypt and "save" the Christians over here from us Muslims .
Spike they did it to provoke the radical Muslims and what most of you don't know is that here we believe in God and we love god and we are willing to die for god because we are 100% sure that what we do for god will not only be repaid , but also given in return a lot more than what we gave .
We may disobey god but we are 100% sure that god will forgive us if we stop doing sins and ask for forgiveness.
Anyway its extremely prohibited and i mean EXTREMELY to show our prophet in any form(even the most handsome man living atm) let alone the form they showed him [PBUH] in; I cant even describe it .
While killing 4 innocent men is an act of stupidity from stupid individuals who aren't smart enough to know that they were used .
If you're going to say why would they do that then Google world fastest growing religion.
If your saying its not from conversions then see the Guinness Book of World Records.

 

[VDKMS]

I don't care what type of movie he made. If we are going to forbid movies that offend people we'll propably have no movies anymore.

People have the right to show they are offended as long as it is peaceful. Did Christians killed innocent people when the movie "Life of Brian" or "The Passion of Christ" came out? Or all those cartoons of pedophile priests?

When we look at where the violent protests are we see there are also conflicts with fanatical islamists. And without knowing who really shot the movie the usual suspects were attacked and they were dead wrong. Are they going to apologise or was it merely a sophism to attack the US.

 

[O.W.E.G.]

I don't care what type of movie he made. If we are going to forbid movies that offend people we'll propably have no movies anymore.

People have the right to show they are offended as long as it is peaceful. Did Christians killed innocent people when the movie "Life of Brian" or "The Passion of Christ" came out? Or all those cartoons of pedophile priests?

When we look at where the violent protests are we see there are also conflicts with fanatical islamists. And without knowing who really shot the movie the usual suspects were attacked and they were dead wrong. Are they going to apologise or was it merely a sophism to attack the US.

You sure don't have the brightest of brains.
No one defended the guys who killed 4 in the embassy and its a stupid act from stupid individuals as i stated before.
You can fight with your ghosts all day as no one defended murders, and you are insisting that we are defending their act.
Do you always do that when you're out of arguments?

 

[VDKMS]

You sure don't have the brightest of brains.
No one defended the guys who killed 4 in the embassy and its a stupid act from stupid individuals as i stated before.
You can fight with your ghosts all day as no one defended murders, and you are insisting that we are defending their act.
Do you always do that when you're out of arguments?

How can you know that it was a stupid act from stupid individuals when you do not even know who they are? If you do please call the Lybian and US embassy in your country ASAP.
You have the same reaction as the protesters : accusing someone without proof.

 

[NP8901]

Wow u need glasses ,don't you ?
And are extremists only in Islam ? you want to tell me there are only radical Islamists out there?
Moreover I did a little research about the makers of this film they are Egyptians yes, but on many occasions they have asked America and Israel to enter Egypt and "save" the Christians over here from us Muslims .
Spike they did it to provoke the radical Muslims and what most of you don't know is that here we believe in God and we love god and we are willing to die for god because we are 100% sure that what we do for god will not only be repaid , but also given in return a lot more than what we gave .
We may disobey god but we are 100% sure that god will forgive us if we stop doing sins and ask for forgiveness.
Anyway its extremely prohibited and i mean EXTREMELY to show our prophet in any form(even the most handsome man living atm) let alone the form they showed him [PBUH] in; I cant even describe it .
While killing 4 innocent men is an act of stupidity from stupid individuals who aren't smart enough to know that they were used .
If you're going to say why would they do that then Google world fastest growing religion.
If your saying its not from conversions then see the Guinness Book of World Records.

How do you know your God is the right one? For all you know, God could have lied, or he could have said something, and someone thought it meant something completely different, or, someone could have written it a long time ago as a means of controlling hundreds and thousands of people, and it could all be a lie made up by some random stranger.

Extremely prohibited. Yes, in your world - not ours. Live with it.

Islam is growing at a rate of 2.9% and Christianity is growing at a rate of 2.3%. From there it is easy to throw a projection out into the future and show that if the rates of growth remain the same that Islam will surpass Christianity at some point. But this is really not a helpful way to look at things. In terms of numbers, Christians add more to their numbers every year than Islam. Multiply 2.9% times the total number of Muslims (1.3Billion) and multiply 2.3% times the total number of Christians (2.1 Billion) and you will see that every year Christians add about 11 million more people to our ranks than Islam does. Third grade math - sunshine

 

[USAgirl]

You are telling us what happens in America, did you stop for one minute to consider that although the film may have been made in America, the fall out from it could involve many other countries. Countries that do not have either US laws or US beliefs, these countries are not interested in what America does or thinks, and the fact that they are sometimes inhabited by religious nut cases should make people think a little bit more what they say and do.

If you insist upon teasing the bear, don't whine when you, or some other innocent person gets bitten.

What happened is a tragedy, but it was not unforeseeable.

Really, the religion of the film maker is not important to me, what I see as important was either, his lack of forethought before doing what he did, or was it done with the intent of inciting an already very volatile situation, and what was his intent if that were the case.

LOL@snip that cracks me up



I guess I am telling you about what is happening in America because it is happening in America and I am an American.

The other countries lost any sympathy I might have had over the making of the film when they killed innocent Americans and you know darn well what they did to that man before they killed him.

Those countries are not interested in our laws or belief but have no issue with taking financial support? Have no issue when they want us to help them to fight for their freedom over brutal dictators?

Not all the countries and people in the street are killing innocent Americans. In fact, I saw one sign that said "don't hate us America, this is not our people"

How is it you jump to protect their religion and country and rights or freedom of religion but you don't understand my countries right for freedom of speech and religion?

That teasing the bear comment is going to come back and bite, trust me, we are the only bear being teased right now, killing innocent Americans, raping them, burning our flags, manipulating our laws and attacking on our own soil.

And the bottom line is that no world is going to walk on egg shells in fear of their life over one group or religion.

 

[USAgirl]

I'm sure if you could ask that question of the victims, they would have a very strong views on the matter.

We can be as irresponsible and uncaring as we like, what we must realise though, is that if we choose to go down that path, we can't whine about the outcome and expect sympathy, when it all goes pear shaped and someone is injured or killed. Risk assessment and accepting responsibility are several of the basic skills we are expected to develop as we grow into adulthood, in fact, one's ability to assess risk to oneself and others, is often used as a gauge of maturity

Very true, many laws are based on principles 400 or more years old, but that in no way makes them less applicable to today's situation. To deliberately incite someone to violence has the same outcome today as it did then, someone is liable to suffer as a result, and unfortunately it is often a totally innocent third party.

Are you kidding me with this stuff seno???

At very best it was a bit of poking fun of and name calling by a no talent that most people didn't even know about much less agree with and that in your mind is inciting violence and a call for killing and raping?

Give me a frigging break.

Which of the two actions are mature? Poking fun, name calling or killing and raping?

Are you trying to make my head explode and incite me to violence?

Can't you see how crazy that sounds to me? I can't even meet you half way with that thought process.

 

[USAgirl]

I have to admit my head and my heart and taking me in two directions, one of CF and one of USMC. My head says we should abide by the 1st amendment, but my heart wishes that people like this film maker be held responsible for the things they set in motion.

In the end I side with USMC. The film maker did not personally kill anyone, the blood is on the hands of those who cannot control their temper and let blind rage rule them.

And all for what?

Religion is an evil tool of death.


I can't agree with this enough. While I support the 1st amendment I am sickened by some of the things that it protects. KKK speeches, WBC.... Is there a line? Should their be a line? I don't know. My heart says their should be a line. When you have military men coming home in a coffin to be greeted by hate speeches...it's digusting and it is not something we should tolerate as a nation in my opinion. Again though, that brings the question, where is the line? I don't think WBC should picket children's funerals either...who's call is it what can be said and what can not be said?

OH Pixie, i was soooooooooooooooooooooo with you and then you made a hard left on me

It is not the gun or religion that are evil, it is the people who abuse them.

I get your feelings between your head and heart but you can sue a person who you feel had caused harm right?

Those men and women who come home in a coffin are fighting for freedom, freedom of speech and religion, the things this country was founded on, the reason people want to come here from other countries today, from countries where they don't have those basic rights.

I agree there are ugly things done in the name of freedom of speech but you have the freedom to disagree and not be apart of it and I will take that any day over a life without those freedoms.

My heart breaks for the innocent people who will suffer.

Interesting side note after watching the film, whatever drove this guy to make the film we might never know, but it appears he wanted to show that faith in a bad light showing it and the people who follow it as radical and barbaric and after the raping , killing, protest of burning American flags and calling for death to America exposes the faith to its manipulation and supports that a group of people too large for my comfort in fact are barbaric and dangerous.

 

[USAgirl]

Wow u need glasses ,don't you ?
And are extremists only in Islam ? you want to tell me there are only radical Islamists out there?
Moreover I did a little research about the makers of this film they are Egyptians yes, but on many occasions they have asked America and Israel to enter Egypt and "save" the Christians over here from us Muslims .
Spike they did it to provoke the radical Muslims and what most of you don't know is that here we believe in God and we love god and we are willing to die for god because we are 100% sure that what we do for god will not only be repaid , but also given in return a lot more than what we gave .
We may disobey god but we are 100% sure that god will forgive us if we stop doing sins and ask for forgiveness.
Anyway its extremely prohibited and i mean EXTREMELY to show our prophet in any form(even the most handsome man living atm) let alone the form they showed him [PBUH] in; I cant even describe it .
While killing 4 innocent men is an act of stupidity from stupid individuals who aren't smart enough to know that they were used .
If you're going to say why would they do that then Google world fastest growing religion.
If your saying its not from conversions then see the Guinness Book of World Records.

No OWEG, I don't need glasses and where did I ever say "only one group have extremist?" Don't play me like that.

I get if you are Muslim you are defensive of your faith as anyone is with their faith.

Hopefully you don't support the actions of those who have hi jacked the Muslim faith and use it as a form of terror (again, too many for my comfort)

Personally, I wish more of the Muslim faith would come out and speak against these violent acts being done in the name of Allah but that is me and I would feel the same if violent acts were being done in the name of another faith or by people who have no faith.

I too looked into the Cypto Christains and it basically says they are people that are living in places where being a Christain is not allowed and so they live under ground and sometimes even pretend to be of another faith as to not be persecuted and then it went on to list the places where this has happened and it blew my mind that it has gone on in many places for a very long time such as Rome, Japan, and Turkey just to name a few.

You can't discribe an actor who played a false part in a movie because it is so offensive but you can accept 1 man being raped and killed and three others killed?

And I think homosexuality and raping a man is not allowed in the Muslim faith but that act was forgiven and yet an action of one man who made a comment and movie about the prophet is not to be forgiven?

I have actually read the Bible, Torah and Koran in an attempt to understand where they differ and try to learn about all faith or lack there of to better understand people and do you know in some places I would be killed or stoned to death just for having this conversation, not cool and I am grateful my God does not support that.

Anyway OWEG, I don't hate you or ALL Muslims because these people have done this terrible barbaric act, but I do hold your people and the faith responsible for standing up against these acts and holding your own people and faith accountable for their actions as I would of all people and all faith or lack there of.

 

[USAgirl]

I don't care what type of movie he made. If we are going to forbid movies that offend people we'll propably have no movies anymore.

People have the right to show they are offended as long as it is peaceful. Did Christians killed innocent people when the movie "Life of Brian" or "The Passion of Christ" came out? Or all those cartoons of pedophile priests?

When we look at where the violent protests are we see there are also conflicts with fanatical islamists. And without knowing who really shot the movie the usual suspects were attacked and they were dead wrong. Are they going to apologise or was it merely a sophism to attack the US.

Good points VDKMS.

I think we will find out more about who this movie came from and why.

The fact that it happen on 9/11 and that so many organised protest in several countries are taking place makes me highly suspicious.

Let's say this guy is really Cryptic Christian from Egypt and he made the movie because he is sick and tired of how Christains are being treated in other parts of the world, the way these people killing raping and rioting over there make him look like he was not far off.

Or was he really just a plant withint the Cryptic Christian faith by the Isamist terrorist as a way to start the violence?

 

[USAgirl]

You sure don't have the brightest of brains.
No one defended the guys who killed 4 in the embassy and its a stupid act from stupid individuals as i stated before.
You can fight with your ghosts all day as no one defended murders, and you are insisting that we are defending their act.
Do you always do that when you're out of arguments?

OWEG, you are not making a good case by saying that "no one defended the act of the 4 killings"

In fact, many do, not ALL, but many do and you have to wake up to that fact.

Killing, raping and riots are beyond a stupid act by a few individuals, it is totally barbaric and by too large of a group for comfort.

You are not seeing one or two people storm buildings, kill, rape, burn flags and call for American death can we agree on that without name calling?