How to stop China - Page 4




 
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October 23rd, 2004  
jackun
 
why to stop china?

china is such a friendly country.
October 23rd, 2004  
AsianAmerican
 
 
For real China is an awesome country... GOOD FOOD, GOOD GIRLS, and GOOD PEOPLE. I say let history and the future do its thing and we'll see what happens in the next decades... Just get ready to learn how to use chopsticks heheheheh J/K.
October 23rd, 2004  
Leighsong
 
WOW--heated debate!

I dream of visiting China in the near future. I intend to have a glorious experience.

So much has happened throughout history, and currently, perhaps China may seem to be a threat to the western world.

As I view these threads, and learn much history that I've long forgotten, one thing seems to be common--us against them.

The Chinese did recently discover a HUGE previously unknown oil bed. Perhaps this will give them much more economic leverage in the coming years.

The west have been ignoring the Chinese economic strengthening, and even supporting it, to a large degree. I fail to see how this is a surprise to many, but I learn something new everyday

Great debate, and thanks to all for sharing very valuable, and historic relevance!
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October 24th, 2004  
Kinection
 
Wow... getting flamy here.

Quote:
I know I looked at my time period! Ezechiel said, HISTORY!!! History includes the Qin, Tang, and Qing Dynasties. He didn't say present day China, you did! Ezechiel said, "China for many times became World Number One", that means he was mentioning history, not PRC. Next time, do a little research before you quote others! I think your pro-Chinese.
My point is that viewing China in the future does not necessarily mean looking at it's past, before PRC time. There is no need to go on a side track here on things that don't contribute to the topic.

As for pro-Chinese, yes in some ways. Or maybe I'm just open minded, either way, I always like to see things from both sides.

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The U.S. has always been interested in stopping dictators, especially horrible men like Stalin, I think It's a shame more countries didn't ally against him during the Cold War he was a terrible person who provoked everything that was brough on him.
This post was so short that I wasn't quite sure which side you are arguing against. But, I would like to point out the US has also appointed and supported many dictators.

Quote:
2. Afghan (but Afghanistan did survive in good way now, the problem is the act of invasion were still wrong)
A country that harbors a terrorist on the scale of Osama Bin Ladin should be dealt with.

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5. Few years ago, USA "indelibrately", "Carelessly" bombed the Embassy of China. This once lead the world into a dangerous condition.
I think this is kind of unfair, are you saying the US is deliberately doing it or that the US needs to learn to control their bombs?

Quote:
The Chinese did recently discover a HUGE previously unknown oil bed. Perhaps this will give them much more economic leverage in the coming years.
linkage?
October 24th, 2004  
USAFAUX2004
 
 
China is not a bad country, it is actually a super power, but because of its organization and population its in a mess
October 24th, 2004  
Ezechiel
 
Quote:
My point is that viewing China in the future does not necessarily mean looking at it's past, before PRC time. There is no need to go on a side track here on things that don't contribute to the topic.

As for pro-Chinese, yes in some ways. Or maybe I'm just open minded, either way, I always like to see things from both sides.
China r a peace rising power for the past decade there r 3 pooints for u to get an idea :

1. Territory Conflict between India and China in 1963 --- This problem later contributed to a small bttle between them. I did not know who did it aggresively (I read that Indian did,but some other said China did). But whe China got the victory on that, they gathered all the Indian soldiers hostage, threat them well and release them back to INdia homeland. China as well helped the INdian to repair the military equipment. Plus, China did not demanded any special thing from India side, this is the most important part. The China had been praised by the UN at that time.

2. Vietnam-China conflict after Vietnam's independence. After Vietnam claimed the independence, Soviet Union provoked them to make trouble on China (started from 60'sthe relation between China and Soviet Union went very bad). Vietnam aggresively did something bad such like getting into China territory and did something. China reacted by sending troops to fought the Vietnamese. 20 days China claimed victory. But China,once again, released all the VIetnamese soldiers back to their homeland, whitout demanding anything.

3. China never provoked any communis political revolt in neighbouring countries. Even if u said North Korea, China's purpose is to prevent US from spying the China land if they won the Korean war and establish Information centre in North Korea. Vietnam war was provoked by Soviet Union.

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A country that harbors a terrorist on the scale of Osama Bin Ladin should be dealt with.
maybe. For this action had been approved by UN.

Quote:
The Chinese did recently discover a HUGE previously unknown oil bed. Perhaps this will give them much more economic leverage in the coming years.
linkage?
I believe that's China East Sea area, where Japanese and Chinese were having conflict on. Didn't u guyz know that China and Japan were arguing over the Diaoyu Island for years? Whoever got the Diaoyu Island, the petroleum in east sea area would majority owned by that side. Also some said that Siberia area have a larger oil resouces than Persian Gulf., but not very sure.

On the diaoyu island issue. Japanese were being very aggresive by building station on the island. At the same time China did not really got in the conflict directly but presented speech to warned Japan not to do any terrible thing on the INternational politic stage. Isn't this peaceful enough?
October 24th, 2004  
Big_Z
 
 
"Also few years ago. USA planes went to spy the China land in China teritory. A Chinese pilot went to stop them but they refuse to do so. And accident happen,the pilot died. And what about the spies in the plane who got caught by China? China released them all. And yet USA rufuse to apologize............ "
Umm America has caught Chinese spies before....... They werent just flying over either.
October 24th, 2004  
Duty Honor Country
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Z
"Also few years ago. USA planes went to spy the China land in China teritory. A Chinese pilot went to stop them but they refuse to do so. And accident happen,the pilot died. And what about the spies in the plane who got caught by China? China released them all. And yet USA rufuse to apologize............ "
Umm America has caught Chinese spies before....... They werent just flying over either.
You are telling one side of the story Big Z while leaving out some importnant facts

US SIDE

On 1 April 0915 (local time), the EP-3 plane was on a routine surveillance mission in international airspace over the South China Sea. It was intercepted by two Chinese fighter aircraft. US Admiral Dennis Blair said such encounters were not unusual. ''They come up, take a look, report what they see and fly back. It's pretty routine,'' he said. The collision occurred 113m (70 miles) off the Chinese island of Hainan. ''One of them bumped into the wing of the EP-3 aircraft,'' Admiral Blair said. He said intercepts in recent months had become ''aggressive to the point we felt they were endangering the safety of Chinese and American aircraft''. The US lodged a protest with Chinese officials. The admiral said the EP-3 is a big plane usually flying straight and level while fighter aircraft are more nimble. ''The faster, more manoeuvrable aircraft has the obligation to stay out of the way of the slower aircraft,'' Admiral Blair said. ''It is pretty obvious who bumped into whom.'' Apparently there was no communication between Chinese and American pilots. There was sufficient damage to the American plane for the pilot to declare a mayday signal on an open international distress channel. The White House said two of four propellers were damaged as well as the nose cone, wing flaps and equipment indicating the plane's air speed. It said the plane plummeted 2,400m (8,000 feet) at one point. The pilot diverted to an airfield on Hainan Island where the plane landed 15 to 20 minutes later. The US said it was standard procedure for a damaged plane to land at the nearest airport after issuing a mayday call. The last communication from the plane was that it had landed safely and all 24 military personnel on board were uninjured. US Senator Richard Lugar, who sits on the Senate Intelligence Committee, has said that the Chinese pilot who is believed to have died, Wnag Wei, had challenged the US plane before, but this time had "exceeded his grasp". US surveillance crews are said to become quite familiar with Chinese pilots who intercept them and often photograph them.

CHINA'S SIDE

After detecting a US plane conducting surveillance off the city of Sanya, two Chinese F-8 fighter jets took off and carried out ''routine tracking'' of the aircraft. At 0907 the all the planes were flying in the same direction, 400m apart with the US plane on the right. A Defence Ministry spokesman said ''the immediate cause of the collision was the violation of flight rules by the US plane which made a sudden and big movement to veer towards the Chinese plane,'' the state news agency reported. ''The US plane's nose and left wing rammed the tail of one of the Chinese planes causing it to lose control and plunge into the sea,'' he said. The pilot parachuted from his plane and is still missing, while the other pilot landed his F-8 safely. At 0933 the US plane illegally entered Chinese territorial airspace and landed at Lingshui Airport in Hainan, the spokesman said.

The analysts

Nobody really knows how or why the mid-air collision happened. Many Western analysts, including the specialist publication Jane's Defence, argue that the two Chinese F8 fighters were dispatched to intercept the US surveillance plane and "hemmed in" the much bigger plane, in an attempt to make it change course. The slightest misjudgement by either the US or Chinese pilot could have caused the collision. They generally argue that the US plane was unlikely to veer suddenly to the left, as claimed by Beijing. It is a big and cumbersome plane that the far more nimble Chinese jets should have been able to avoid. The Washington Post newspaper has reported that US officials are saying the Chinese interceptor plane that crashed was actually flying under the US plane. The collision occurred, according to this report, after the US surveillance plane started banking. One report says that Wang Wei was killed instantly after the collision. The report claims that he ejected into one of the propellers of the US surveillance plane.

it would be wise of you to tell the facts Big Z. I followed this story very closely.
BBC SOURCE
October 24th, 2004  
USAFAUX2004
 
 
thats the problem with the world...we always blame the other guy
October 24th, 2004  
A Can of Man
 
 
But in this case, the Americans are right about the collision.
It is the nimble jet's obligation to stay clear.
I have a very hard time believing that the intel aircraft rammed a Chinese fighter jet intentionally so the Chinese plane must have gotten dangerously close.
It could have been a bad case of a Chinese fighter pilot getting killed trying to show off about his flying ability.