OCTOBER 1973 WAR (YUM KIPPUR)- AN EGYPTIAN VICTORY

As long as your views arent criminal, anti-semitic, racist etc... They are welcome.

But the interesting thing to say about the Yum Kippur war is that it was a failure, the conflict is still here. Both parties failed miserably.

Now, we can speak about the war from a military perspective, saying that they did a good job at that and a bad job in this part, and that X is a good warrior and that Y is a terrible soldier...
It's very interesting, but I think that in these days, success in battle is overrated.

The Americans lost in Vietnam. And the war in Iraq is going to last for years... etc etc... And we can find more examples of that since forever...

What we need is real politics.

And you said that yourself, you think that jews and Arabs cant live next to each others without fighting each others...
But is it the truth? Arabs and Jews live together in many countries... The countries I know, the USA, Morroco, France... Spain...
Or is it the space? But I know that historically Jews, christians and Muslims lived together in Jerusalem... In peace and sometimes in harmony...

The problem isnt there. We can live with each others very happily... Whatever the differences...

Because the conflicts doesnt start from hate. It starts from this animal instinct that pushes us to rule the world...
If you just want to live in peace, you can live in peace. But when you want to rule the world... You start looking for enemies.
 
usinfantryMOS11c10 said:
On the topic however, The Yom Kippur war, was only a victory for Egypt politically and some of their strategic objectives were accomplished. However it was an over all tactically decisive victory for Israel.....

'Pulls out map'

Yep still there just checking...lol.
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* If i will live 100000 year at future , it will not be able to contain y laughing for ur talking man ........ till me simply ur *tactically decisive victory how it come ( and ur losing the land that u conquer before and losing ur peoples and weapons that forced us to help u at these days ) ..... ur god and u can won the war but the war of making lies and films .... look to ur boarders now to know who won the war............. and smile .... ;) *we kicked u from Sinai ... and soon or later from palestine.......... i know u will laugh at *my talking and sai *( llok one egyptian is talking ) *but just remeber one thing *that egyptian *who kicked you out from his land and also how you ran waya from him at war * ask dian ask sharon ask ur leader who attend the war wat did we do for them *:)
 
usinfantryMOS11c10 said:
Well perhaps you should read up on your history then.

17th Century BCE- Jewish People Migrate To Egypt Because of Famine.

13th - 12th Centuries BCE- Jewish people settle in Israel.

722 - 720- Israel captured by Assyrians

586- Israel captured by Babylonia.

And I'll go ahead an skip a thousand years or so.......

Oh here you are.

636-1099- Arab Rule Starts in Israel.


Sorry buddy, I'm just going off the facts that history provides me with.

Tell me why is it such a big deal that we have one country that we have rightfully defended in war countless times now, but you guys can have over 30 of them? Not wanting to start an argument, you brought it up. I'm just wondering.
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for your knowledge man .... that peaoples whos am talking about *( kananyon - ashoryen ) came before any relegion came to the hole waorld *...... the fact said that *jewish lived in the arabian countries from old old history but another smile from me to you *they wasnt the first arabian peaoples before them with long long long time ..... and hebrew pplz was as gangs came to fight with them from time to time ....... so till me ( if ur a theife and u came to my home from time to time to steal any thing .... shall u came and knock my door to till me i was here from years before and i have rights at this home *
 
usinfantryMOS11c10 said:
Arabs do and can live in Israel. However the Arabs for the most part don't want to live with the Jews.

Perfect example of why I said I have nothing more to add to this post.
I am not willing to get banned just for expressing my views against people who obviously don't like and approve of the Jewish people's existence. I know I will lose my cool and I am not trying to get ticked off today, as I'm allready starting to.

I am officially out of this topic, no exceptions!
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the problem that ur politics and religon man *are still acting for that *th muslims dont want you to live with them ....... to your knowledge u have a religion like me u have profet like me .... and i respect ur prophet MOSA ( عليه السلام ) *more than u .......... our war with the zionist not with the jeudism ...... jewish was liveng at arabian countries and have rights as same as muslims and christian ....... ( for ur knowldge my family told me that part of our furniture we purchased from jewish who was living at our city ) but ask ur self why everywhere *ur pplz go they kicked them out.......... why all of other nations *before refuse to live with them ........ as ur slef and am sure u know the solution but u wont say it to me ........ man i will not hate or fight agaisn jewish or judism ........... but srry i will fight to smach zionist from hole world ............... they are disease *more dngerous than *any other disease *( *haaai i know very will u will come back to look after my reply on your previous talk even with ur acting of being out of this topec *;) )
 
I am out of the Topic. Doesn't mean I cant look. Well and comment a little.

Does Egypt control Israel now? No. Therefore Yom Kippur was not an Egyptian victory.

I'm not responding to your somewhat..... okay, extremely racial post however.
 
hagez said:
for your knowledge man .... that peaoples whos am talking about *( kananyon - ashoryen ) came before any relegion came to the hole waorld *...... the fact said that *jewish lived in the arabian countries from old old history but another smile from me to you *they wasnt the first arabian peaoples before them with long long long time ..... and hebrew pplz was as gangs came to fight with them from time to time ....... so till me ( if ur a theife and u came to my home from time to time to steal any thing .... shall u came and knock my door to till me i was here from years before and i have rights at this home *
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Okay is there records of this, of these people existing. And is there any physical evidence linking them to the land, Pottery, tools, that have been carbon dated to prove a specific time or written records from that time period. Not written records from 750AD, those don't count, I need proof of written records from the actual time period showing undeniable facts.
 
I'm tired of these speeches... Pro Arab propaganda, and Zionist propaganda etc etc...

Is there someone on this earth who is actually trying to seem a little neutral?

"I'm not an antisemite, but we crushed them damn jews..."

And then:
"the jews are still here, so they crushed you..."

It's boring... cant you behave like civilized people for once? And on such serious matters? This is a serious conflict... Not a soccer match.

The Egyptian fought, the Israeli fought and at the end... They both lost men, time and money... And they achieved nothing... The conflict is still here.

So, you want my real opinion? They are both freaking losers...
 
usinfantryMOS11c10 said:
Okay is there records of this, of these people existing. And is there any physical evidence linking them to the land, Pottery, tools, that have been carbon dated to prove a specific time or written records from that time period. Not written records from 750AD, those don't count, I need proof of written records from the actual time period showing undeniable facts.
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yabosyeen pplz was at arabian countries *3000 year before jesus birth *and before any religion came , and for ur prove if u want go and read the arabian books , it will show u any proov u want , :) for ur knowledge all arbians are also semitizm that will damage ur lie about anti simitizm , as i told you ask about the history of ( yabosyen - ashoryen ) and till me what did u find there .
am not racial man but am wondering from pplz tryto steal the land before and ask about their rights at it now .

for ur knowldge if ur israel is exist now at world our book is telling that it will end and the end is near to come .......... u will raise and control 2 times at our history .... one before and the other is now then ;) ur out of world .....
 
usinfantryMOS11c10 said:
I am out of the Topic. Doesn't mean I cant look. Well and comment a little.

Does Egypt control Israel now? No. Therefore Yom Kippur was not an Egyptian victory.

I'm not responding to your somewhat..... okay, extremely racial post however.
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u answer ur self by this reply ........ our war was to kick u outside Sinai ...... and smile ur now out of it totally out of it ........ :) u answer ur self man


War 1973 *was enoromus victory on eavil ......... victory of rights .....victory of EGYPTIAN .... victory for *EGYPT*
 
usinfantryMOS11c10 said:
Okay is there records of this, of these people existing. And is there any physical evidence linking them to the land, Pottery, tools, that have been carbon dated to prove a specific time or written records from that time period. Not written records from 750AD, those don't count, I need proof of written records from the actual time period showing undeniable facts.
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Jewish lived at egypt more than 450 years more than the period they role or live at palestine * thats only for ur knowldge ..... and even when u came to live with arabians at palestine u didnt owe any mm at it *so , no rights for u at it and soon or later ur out
 
Tuodor Hirtelz *make me laugh to much , he was choosing where will his pplz will live, and for ur knowldge he choose Sinai to be his pplz country , and from the choises ( argentina - oghanda ) * :) so by the name of god how u have rights at palestine and before you was searching away to live *:)

u dont have right here man and as i told u *soon or later ur out
 
The best conditions that the jewish took was at arabian countries ... they controled the economy ... they controled the industry .... ( specialy at EGYPT ) ... u was part of us man ..... but as i told u ......all of other and previous nations that u lived with it hate u from ur way to live and deal with others ..... u spread evil every where u go .... *:) thats ur fact
 
Umm I hate to jump in here but someone should probably mention that the mods (not me **Added to prevent accusations of acting like a mod**) here are not fond of multiple posts, you may want to use the "multi" option to reply to multiple messages.

:)
 
MontyB said:
Umm I hate to jump in here but someone should probably mention that the mods (not me **Added to prevent accusations of acting like a mod**) here are not fond of multiple posts, you may want to use the "multi" option to reply to multiple messages.

:)
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thnx for ur note Monty ......*
 
I don't think the problem is the money, its the professionalism. I'm always impressed by the numbers of aircraft, tanks and naval assets that Israel has given its small size both in population terms and economy, even allowing for US aid. The UK spends 50 billion dollars each year on defence and it can't even afford a completely independent nuclear deterrent, the US has the ability to prevent the UK from firing the trident system, which was bought from the US, but I digress.

When the US wargamed the iraq war, the opfor general "sunk" US carriers with speedboats, they also managed to communicate with units despite the us interfering with communications in the game. However the iraqi generals never tried any alternative or unorthodox strategies.

As someone mentioned earlier arab countries have large armies for power, I would define that as good for internal repression, for hoovering up lots of ill educated men and looking good for other third world countries. The exception is Saudi Arabia, who are scared of having a large army in case it overthrew the regime, but they do have a large airforce. how good it is, I couldn't say.

I never get the impression that any of the arab countries are serious about their militaries. Paper tigers, I would describe them.

As for this topic, I'm not the most knowledgeable person about the 73 war, but after the surrounding of 2 arab armies, didn't the americans have to stop the israelies from destroying them both in the sinai, and didn't they also have to stop them from effecting speeding across the sinai and into cairo (literally), because the russians were threatening to get involved.
 
johnmacadam, do you think that Israel had the means to expand the war further than that?
So, saying that it was the American who stopped them is pretty weird... I would say that the Americans gave them a good excuse to stop the battle.

It's not easy to say how things would have been if they played their cards differently... But if they pushed the battle further, they would had to stop at some point. Israel doesnt have the numbers or the means to occupy many countries at the same time.

And a destabilization of the enemy Arab regimes could have been a bad thing for the future of Israel. If the people took the power... The Palestinians would have had very different allies. Maybe even stronger allies.

If you see these Arab regimes as potential enemies, giving the dictators and other corrupt governments a chance to survive is a very good thing.

Like the US did with Saddam in the first Gulf War.
 
As I understand it, there was nothing between the israeli armoured divisions and cairo, 2 egyptian armies were surrounded in the sinai and about to be destroyed. The US told them to stop and they pulled back to the sinai canal. I don't think it was a case of wanting to occupy egypt, so much as nothing could stop them from humiliating the egyptian government by driving through to cairo.
 
It's funny... We are talking about war here. It's a complex political process... It's not a game. Taking Cairo isnt an objective.

There is a difference between taking Cairo and taking Egypt. And I dont think that the objective was to take Egypt anyways...
And what's the point in destroying Cairo? It's not a constructive or intelligent thing to do...

I think that we should stop playing games... Political games too.

The Israelis were in a self defense war, they had to destroy the army that was attacking them, they did that, and they went home.
And we hope that it was the good guys who won the battle and that the Egyptians had no right to launch an offensive.
 
Taking Cairo, Egypts economic, political and cultural centre was an option, and I read that the US government stopped them. Of course war isn't a game, I have no idea if they planned to destroy Cairo, or merely stop outside the city.
The Egyptians attacked as part of their attempt to regain the Sinai, which was occupied after Israel attacked in 67, so in that sense the Egyptians had every right to launch an offiensive. There is no real good guys here, just various shades of game.

As for playing games, I have no idea what you mean, I'm merely discussing the Yom Kippur war.
 
Sorry if I seemed aggressive, but for many people and I mean powerful people, wars are like games...
And I get really angry when I think about it. People are dying, lives are destroyed and others are thinking about money and power. It's a real curse.

Like the Americans racing to take Iraq, like if they had to prove something to someone... And at the end, they are stuck in a hellish situation.

Taking a city just to prove a point is stupid in my opinion. Arab governments are so silly that there is no point in humiliating them. And I would say that hurting the population is always a bad thing to do.

The democratic model we love so much is based on the respect of the populations. We strip the power from the elites, may they be military, politic, economic, intellectual, whatever... And we give the power to the people who send their kids to fight in wars... And then, we get peace.

Total peace? Not really, as there is always a war against crime and terrorism... It's not an idealistic model of life. It's realist and easy to achieve.

But when we let silly people control the system, we piss off the good honest people and then we have a dirty war on our hand.

Sparing Cairo was the right thing to do. Israel didnt had the public support in Egypt to take on their government. The best they could was to put an end to the offensive.

It's all about politics, the objective is the liberation of the populations, regardless of their way of life, economic level, education level, religion, culture, skin color, political views... etc...
 
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