India, China seek to resolve boundary dispute


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India, China seek to resolve boundary dispute

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Saturday, April 9, 2005 (New Delhi):

Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao arrives in India today for a four day visit.

While his first stop is Bangalore, his meeting with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in Delhi is likely to take centre stage next week.

During the parleys, a breakthrough is expected on the boundary issue, which has been the cause of a rift for more than 40 years.

Highly placed government sources have told NDTV that the two leaders will announce a set of guiding principles that will become the basis for the resolution of the dispute.

Occupying territory

Special political envoys on the boundary issue appointed during former prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee's visit have already met four times.

Since the 1962 war in the west, India has accused China of occupying over 40,000 square kilometers of Jammu and Kashmir specially Aksai Chin ceded to it by Pakistan.

In the east, China claims India possesses 90,000 sq km of its territory, mostly in Arunachal Pradesh.

Will be updating this thread with news from Wen Jiabao's visit, if you got any more news about this visit please post it here

China, India to discuss free-trade zone

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BEIJING - In the runup to Premier Wen Jiabao's visit to India, Beijing said he will discuss possible establishment of a free--trade zone between the two countries during talks with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh. Wen will visit from Saturday through Tuesday, April 9-12.

"To have closer economic cooperation between China and India serves the fundamental interests of the two sides. With the growth of economic cooperation and trade between the two countries, naturally the Free Trade Zone has been put on the agenda," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Qin Gang told reporters.

"I am sure during Premier Wen's visit to India, the leaders of the two countries will exchange ideas and have beneficial discussions on this. As to whether there will be an agreement concluded, it depends on the specific situation of discussion and talks," Qin said.

Wen and Singh are expected to meet on April 11.

Qin stressed that China and India are large developing countries with great potentials. "Both are committed to economic development. China and India have their own respective advantages. The two economies are highly complimentary."

"In a lot of fields we can learn from each other and compliment each other so as to enhance each other. We hope to, on the basis of equality and mutual benefit, carry out multi-level economic cooperation with India so as to seek a win-win result, including the establishment of a free-trade zone," the spokesman said.

Promise and problems

By Dr Jing-dong Yuan

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April 2005 marks the 55th anniversary of the establishment of diplomatic relations between China and India. It is a major milestone for the two ancient civilizations, neighbors, and rising powers. Over the past five and half decades, the bilateral relationship has witnessed the warm "Hindi-Chini bhai-bhai" brotherhood and the famous Panch Sheel or the Five Principles of Peaceful Coexistence in the 1950s but it has also been overshadowed by the 1962 border war and the acrimonious spat in the wake of India's May 1998 nuclear tests.

Sino-Indian relations today are enjoying a period of stability and growing economic ties. Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao's forthcoming visit to India From April 9-12 will build on the positive momentum generated by the June 2003 visit by Indian prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee. However, there remain unresolved disputes and emerging conflicts between the two countries - ranging from boundary issues to energy security - that require strategic vision, diplomatic skill and mutual accommodation.

Rebuilding ties after Pokhran II nuclear tests
Beijing reacted strongly to New Delhi's accusation that the Chinese threat was the key rationale behind its May 1998 nuclear tests. China retaliated by canceling the scheduled Joint Working Group meeting on boundary issues and played an active role in pushing through United Nations Security Council Resolution 1172 calling for nuclear rollback in India and Pakistan. Beijing's relentless diplomatic campaigns to isolate New Delhi eventually induced the latter to seek rapprochement. Sino-Indian relations gradually thawed and Indian policymakers publicly retracted the China threat rhetoric.

In May 1999, Kashmiri militants, with the support of the Pakistani military, crossed the Line of Control into the Kargil area in the India-controlled state of Jammu and Kashmir. The Indian army launched military operations seeking to repel the intrusion. As the conflict escalated, threatening a major military confrontation between the two nuclear states, both New Delhi and Islamabad were seeking international support. Pakistani Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and Foreign Minister Sartaj Aziz went to Beijing soon after the crisis broke out and sought to secure Chinese support; however, their requests were turned down. Instead, the Chinese leaders advised the Pakistani visitors to seek a peaceful settlement with India. Indian Foreign Minister Jaswant Singh subsequently visited China in June 1999 as the Kargil crisis reached the boiling point.

International pressure on Pakistan, including unequivocal warnings by the administration of US president Bill Clinton to Sharif, eventually brought the crisis to an end in July. China's apparent neutrality in the dispute gained much appreciation from India. The two sides have since then on many occasions publicly announced that they do not view each other as a security threat. Improvement in the bilateral relationship continued with Indian president K R Narayanan's visit to China in May 2000 to mark the 50th anniversary of the establishment of Sino-Indian diplomatic relations. Chinese parliamentary head Li Peng and premier Zhu Rongji visited India in January 2001 and 2002, respectively, further consolidating the bilateral relationship.

Of all the key events over the past few years, perhaps the most important would be Indian defense minister George Fernandes' week-long visit to China in April 2003 and prime minister Vajpayee's June 2003 visit. The former was more symbolic while the latter ushered in important milestones. Fernandes' China trip was significant in three respects. First, the visit was the first by an Indian defense minister to China in over a decade. Second, the visit, coming from someone who five years earlier had been widely quoted by the media as describing China as India's "security threat No 1" just prior to the Indian nuclear tests, signified just how much the two countries had mended their fences. Third, at a time when China was embroiled in the crisis over Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) and when many international events originally scheduled to be taking place in China had been canceled, Fernandes' visit was much appreciated by his Chinese hosts.

While no major breakthrough was achieved during Vajpayee's visit - and indeed no such expectation had ever been entertained - there was nevertheless significant progress in four areas that deserve closer scrutiny. The first is the growing consensus and converging interests between Beijing and New Delhi over a wide range of bilateral, regional and global issues. The two countries issued a joint declaration on principles for relations and comprehensive cooperation and vowed not to view each other as a security threat. They reaffirmed their determination to resolve their disputes through peaceful means. This is a far cry from the suspicions and hostility between the two Asian powers in the wake of India's May 1998 nuclear tests.

This stabilizing and maturing relationship is clearly marked by the two countries' converging interests in developing a fair, equitable international political and economic order, the role for the United Nations, and support of global disarmament, including efforts to prevent the weaponization of outer space. Beijing and New Delhi are seeking to promote greater equality and fair distribution of wealth between the rich and poor by working to improve the current international economic system. As developing countries, both China and India are interested in gradually integrating their economies into the global trading system in ways that provide the necessary protection and transition time for their industries to adjust; in addition, Beijing and New Delhi are also calling for greater economic assistance from the Northern industrialized countries to the vast majority of developing countries in the South.

Likewise, both are critical of US unilateralism and seek to promote a multipolar world where they can play a more important role in global affairs. India is looking forward to securing a permanent seat in the proposed expansion of the UN Security Council, and China has indicated its support of Delhi's aspiration. India has long championed for nuclear disarmament, a goal shared by China. Beijing and New Delhi are also interested in promoting the peaceful uses of outer space as both are developing their emerging civilian space programs. Weaponization of outer space could well put into jeopardy these programs, threaten existing peaceful use, such as environmental monitoring and weather forecasting, and risk inducing an arms race in this new frontier.

By each appointing a special representative to oversee the political framework of border negotiations, the two countries have clearly demonstrated their determination to speed up the process of resolving the territorial disputes. This reflects a consensus reached by Chinese and Indian leaders that to reach the full potential of bilateral relations requires the satisfactory closure of this issue. So far, four rounds of meetings have already been held and the change of government in India has not affected the process.

China and India have made important - though largely token - gestures toward each other. New Delhi has shown greater appreciation of Beijing's sensitivity over the Tibetan issue by affirming for the first time that the Tibetan Autonomous Region is part of the territory of China. Beijing, on the other hand, has extended de facto recognition of Sikkim being a state of India, something that Beijing had refused to do ever since the small Himalayan kingdom acceded to India in 1975. While Chinese diplomats continue to characterize the issue as a historical legacy that takes time to resolve, the fact that official Chinese maps are showing Sikkim as part of India suggests that Beijing considers the issue closed. Indeed, New Delhi is confident that the de jure recognition will not be long in forthcoming.

Finally, Vajpayee's visit was marked by its economic orientation. A large entourage of Indian business executives accompanied the Indian prime minister; further, of Vajpayee's three important speeches delivered during his visit, two were addressed at business venues. Indeed, bilateral trade grew to $7.6 billion annually by 2003 and is projected to reach $10 billion in 2004 and surpass $15 billion by 2007, if not earlier. That target may be achieved earlier as the bilateral two-way trade already reached $13 billion in 2004, surpassing the original goals by over 30%. A Sino-Indian Joint Study Group on Trade and Economic Cooperation was formed in March 2004. In addition to growing bilateral economic ties, the two countries are also active in exploring potentials for regional economic cooperation, including the sub-regional "Kunming Initiative".

The momentum generated by the Vajpayee visit has continued. There have been more high-level exchanges between the two countries, with the Chinese defense minister visiting India last, the first in almost a decade, and the first joint Indian-Chinese naval exercises. India's chief of army staff also visited China in late 2004 and the commander of the Indian 4th Army Corps, the unit that was involved in the 1962 war and is now stationed in the areas along the Line of Actual Control, paid a visit to the Tibet Military District Command in Lhasa.

Rivalry or partnership: Challenges ahead
The coming months and years will testify if the goodwill and momentum generated by Vajpayee's successful June 2003 visit can be maintained. While the two countries are on good terms for now and, indeed, their domestic priorities - economic development and prosperity - provide strong incentives for them to avoid conflict, obstacles remain and sustained efforts at the highest political level are required to steer the ship of bilateral relationships without hitting any major shoals. These include the intractable territorial disputes, even though the Line of Actual Control has been relatively peaceful over the last 40 years; mutual suspicions and the potentials for competition and rivalry; China's relationship with Pakistan in the regional context; the China-India-US strategic triangle; India's eastward diplomacy; and the emerging energy security issue and potential trade disputes.

Despite the generally benign atmosphere between the two countries, there remain lingering suspicions and distrust; the scar of the 1962 war has yet to be healed. India claims the Chinese-controlled Aksai Chin of approximately 35,000 square kilometers as part of the territory in Ladaakh, Kashmir. Beijing, on the other hand, disputes New Delhi's possession of more than 90,000 square kilometers in what is now the Indian state Arunachal Pradesh. Without a satisfactory resolution of the territorial disputes, there can never be a "full and complete" normalization of bilateral relations. Since the early 1980s, eight rounds of border negotiations and 14 rounds of Joint Working Group meetings have taken place. During Vajpayee's visit to China in June 2003, the two governments designated their respective special representatives to provide the political impetus to the process. Four rounds of meetings have been held so far. However, a solution remains elusive due to fundamental differences over the mechanisms of settlement. Clearly, final resolution of the issue requires not only political decisions at the highest level in both capitals but also the political skills to sell it to their respective domestic constituencies.

A stable Sino-Indian relationship requires the effective management of the delicate China-India-Pakistan triangle. For over 40 years, and specifically in the wake of the 1962 China-India war, Beijing and Islamabad have developed a close political-security relationship. Over the years, China has provided both moral and material support in assisting the latter's rivalry with India. This "all-weather" relationship was a key component of China's South Asia policy as Beijing sought to tie down India and extend its influence to the subcontinent. Since the early 1980s, as China and India embarked on the path of normalization, Beijing has shifted to a policy of balance and made greater efforts to address New Delhi's legitimate concerns over Sino-Pakistani ties, in particular in the defense area.

While China's neutrality during the 1999 Kargil crisis demonstrates a more balanced Chinese South Asia policy, that gesture has yet to translate into goodwill and confidence on India's part that the Sino-Pakistani relationship is not targeted at India. Indeed, China-Pakistan ties, in particular in the security area, remain a serious concern to India as reports suggest continued Chinese missile assistance to Pakistan. New Delhi remains suspicious of the Sino-Pakistani relationship and those two nations' resilient security ties, ranging from the construction of a strategic outlet for Pakistan in the Gwadar Port and continuous supplies of military equipment - these reinforce the specter of strategic encirclement of India. While China's continuing support of Pakistan is partly due to containing India, it is also aimed at maintaining a stable relationship with an important Islamic country - and a nuclear weapons state - and therefore Beijing retains its influence over the government in Islamabad out of concerns over the Islamic unrest in its own territory, especially in Xinjiang.

Despite progress in bilateral relations over the past few years, mutual suspicions remain. Partly this is due to the dynamics of the security dilemma and structural conflicts between the two Asian giants; it is also because of the lack of institutionalized and regular high-level official exchanges. India has watched China's phenomenal growth in the economic and military sectors with both envy and alarm. Beijing's defense budgets have grown at double digits over a decade and Chinese acquisitions of advanced weaponry from Russia has resulted in improved aerial and naval capabilities of the two-million strong People's Liberation Army.

In addition, China is also modernizing its strategic nuclear forces. If there is one single lesson that New Delhi's security analysts have drawn from the 1962 war, it would be this: power and strength are the only ticket to the club of great powers. For many of them, the very fact that China continues to lead India on many indicators of power poses a greater threat than its military defeat 40 years ago. China is also paying close attention to India's growing military power and its nuclear and missile development. New Delhi is purchasing advanced Russian fighter aircraft, submarines and an aircraft carrier. In addition, India is expanding its defense contacts with Israel and has acquired the Phalcon early warning system that was denied to China. Jerusalem's proposed sale of the Phalcon system to China was effectively blocked by Washington in 2000 out of concerns over its use by the Chinese military against US interests in the region, especially around the Taiwan Strait.

Chinese security analysts are also debating the significance and implications of a warming US-India relationship. Prior to September 11, 2001, there were growing concerns that the new and growing ties between Washington and New Delhi could have negative security implications for China, especially the apparent attempt by Washington to enlist New Delhi as a potential counterweight, if not part of a containment strategy, against China. Within this context, the growing security ties, including US military sales to India, joint military exercises, and regular defense consultations between the two are of particular concern to China. Washington and New Delhi were drawing closer to each other than ever before. There were regular high-level visits to each capital, and the administration of President George W Bush briefed the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP)-led government on major policy initiatives, treating India almost as an ally. New Delhi, in return, openly endorsed US missile defense positions. Indeed, even many US allies were concerned with the strategic implications of Washington's decisions.

Washington's current focus on combating global terrorism and the post-September 11 policy shift brought a renewed engagement of Pakistan and an emphasis on great power cooperation; this reduced Beijing's worries about an Indo-US entente against China. But a China-India-US strategic triangle has clearly emerged in that policymakers are increasingly aware of and attentive to policies taken in the other two capitals and how these may affect its own security interests. Within this complex structure, Washington and New Delhi share normative values (democracy) and strategic interests, while Beijing's ties with both are more driven by contingent rather than structural interests.

Beijing is wary of New Delhi's eastward strategy of developing greater economic and military ties with Japan and the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN). In recent years, India has launched a new post-Pokhran offensive diplomacy of engagement and entente with countries beyond New Delhi's traditional strategic domain: Japan, Vietnam and, to a broader extent, members of ASEAN, many of which have ongoing disputes with China. The Indian defense minister visited Japan in January 2000, the first such visit since India gained independence. Japanese prime minister Yoshiro Mori visited India in August 2000 and Vajpayee paid an official visit to Japan in February 2001. Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi's upcoming visit to India this month will further consolidate such ties.

India has also broadened its relationship with ASEAN countries and improved relations with Myanmar. Chinese analysts note that New Delhi's Southeast Asia diplomacy could add complexity to China-ASEAN relations. For example, growing Indian and ASEAN naval cooperation could impinge upon China's maritime interests, making a final resolution of the territorial disputes in the South China Sea even more difficult. The Indo-Vietnamese defense cooperation is viewed with suspicion given that China has unresolved territorial issues with both countries.

China-India trade has experienced significant gains in the last few years, totaling $13 billion in 2004. However, given the sizes of both economies, the level of economic interdependence remains low. Both countries have registered significant growth over the last decade. There is intense competition for, and protectionism against, each other in the areas of foreign direct investment (FDI) and market access. China is now in a comfortable lead, with $60 billion FDI - 12 times India's total - in 2004. While leaders in both countries have touted the complementarities of their industries - India's software and China's hardware - they have yet to make significant investments in each other's economy. How to promote and expand greater economic contacts and manage competition for markets and investment and technology imports would also test the leadership skills and entrepreneurship in both countries so that their projected growth could both benefit from and generate more win-win cooperation instead of falling into the trap of zero-sum games.

Finally, India and China are both energy consumers and importers. A net oil importer since 1993, China today is the No 2 oil consumer after the United States, depending on imports for two-thirds of its total consumption. While ranking sixth in the global petroleum demand, India's fast growing economy and its lack of domestic energy sources means that it is bound to move up the imports' ladder, projected to occupy the fourth place by 2010. On energy security issues, the two could compete as well as cooperate. Indian and Chinese oil companies are already involved in overseas oil field exploitation, extractions and acquisitions from the Middle East, to the Persian Gulf, to Latin America. An uncoordinated competition from the world's most energy-thirsty countries could drive up prices and rivalry in yet another field.

Beijing and New Delhi would both do well in working with each other to find energy security. Already the two countries are seeking to cooperate rather than to compete directly with each other since the latter strategy is bound to drive up oil prices. India hosted the first-ever meeting between major Asian oil-importing countries, including China, and the Middle Eastern oil-exporting countries such as Saudi Arabia. Chinese and Indian oil companies have acquired equity stakes in Iran's Yadavaran oilfield. In addition, China and India are also discussing a potential natural-gas pipeline.

The Sino-Indian relationship is bound to be one of the most important bilateral relationships in the coming decades simply by the sheer weight of numbers: combined they represent 40% of the world's population and their continuing economic growth will project them to the second and third place within the next two decades. How they manage their relationship will have a tremendous impact on peace and stability in the regional and, increasingly, global context.

Dr Jing-dong Yuan, is director of research for the East Asia Nonproliferation Program at the Center for Nonproliferation Studies, and associate professor of International Policy Studies at the Monterey Institute of International Studies, where he teaches Northeast Asian security, Chinese politics and comparative national security policy.

Well that was a lot to read. I think once that whole jammu and kashmir dispute gets settled, that region will become a lot more stablized. I just wonder what pakistan will got from it.
Chinese PM Wen Jiabao arrives in India; focus on trade, bord



BANGALORE, India (AFP) - Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao arrived here on the last leg of a four nation South Asia tour for talks with Indian leaders expected to boost trade between the two Asian giants and narrow differences on a dragging border dispute.
Wen touched down in this southern city, hub of India's thriving IT industry, from Sri Lanka after having earlier in the week visited Pakistan and Bangladesh.

Police in Bangalore stepped up security after hundreds of exiled Tibetans warned they would stage protests during the premier's visit to register opposition to Chinese rule of their homeland.

Karnataka state, of which Bangalore is the capital, is home to thousands of Tibetan refugees who are staying in Bylakuppe, Kollegal, Mundgod and Hunsur settlements.

Police said Saturday many Tibetan youth had been taken into preventive custody to ensure a smooth stay for Wen, who is accompanied by Foreign Minister Li Zhaoxing, Minister of Education Zhou Ji and Minister of Commerce Bo Xilai.

The premier's engagements in Bangalore include a visit to the offices of Tata Consultancy Services, India's biggest software services exporter, and the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO), a Chinese embassy spokeswoman said.

According to IT industry experts, China is keen to grab a slice of the multi-billion dollar software exports and outsourcing market, currently dominated by India.

Wen was Sunday to leave for the Indian capital New Delhi, where he is to meet Indian Foreign Minister Natwar Singh for talks.

He is scheduled to meet on Monday with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh.

Indian officials have said the agenda for the talks between the world's two fastest growing major economies will be topped by business, including a possible free trade zone in a market of 2.3 billion consumers, one third of the world's population.

An Indian official said accords to boost trade beyond the current 13.6 billion dollar mark and cultural links between the two countries were also expected to be concluded during Wen's visit.

However, the two countries have still to resolve a long-standing boundary dispute that led to a brief, but bitter, border war in 1962.

Discussions to resolve the border dispute are under way and former prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee reached an agreement with the Chinese government in 2003 that scaled down tensions considerably.

India says China occupies 38,000 square kilometres (14,670 square miles) of its territory while Beijing says New Delhi occupies some 90,000 square kilometres of Chinese territory.

Home Minister Shivraj Patil said this week India was "hopeful" that a solution to the border dispute would be worked out soon.

Wen and Singh will "discuss how to solve this (border) problem, about trade and how to maintain peace," Patil was quoted as saying by the Press Trust of India news agency.

Wen is expected to face protests by exiled Tibetans living in Delhi as well.

India has played host to Tibetan spiritual leader the Dalai Lama, 69, and officials of the Tibetan government-in-exile since the monk fled Tibet in 1959 after a failed uprising against Chinese rule.

The Dalai Lama has since recognized Chinese control and encouraged renewed ties in 2002 between representatives of both sides who have met three times to discuss a possible return of Tibetan exiles.

Tibet's exiled prime minister Samdhong Rinpoche Friday appealed to the younger Tibetans "to refrain from indulging in aggressive demonstrations" in a bid to create a "conducive atmosphere" for China and the exiled government to hold talks.


China looks to improve ties with India

News Source

Sunday, April 10, 2005 (Bangalore):

Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao arrived on a four-day visit to India on Saturday.

On the first day of his visit, Jiabao said China was ready to work with India in handling bilateral relations from a strategic perspective and properly settle questions left over from history.

"China attaches great importance to developing good neighbourly relations and friendly co-operation with India" Jiabao said.

The Chinese premier, who will hold talks with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and other leaders in Delhi on Monday, said the purpose of his visit was to enhance China-India friendship and promote bilateral relations.

Business over border?

Meanwhile, Jiabao and his 140-member official delegation are in Bangalore on a two-day visit to strengthen the Bangalore-Beijing trade and technology ties.

The question on everyone's mind is whether the historic geo-political disputes be pushed under the carpet and business be made the mantra to bring Indo-China relations to a new high.

"Business is the most important part of our relationship. The boundary issue, I think, is no longer a problem. What we are doing with the boundary issue is just to remove it from the way of the overall development of our relations," said Sun Yuxi, Chinese Ambassador.

Corporate bonhomie

Chinese telecom companies like Huawei and ZTE have already set up base in Bangalore. Indo-China trade is presently at $14 billion, but the wish list in the immediate future is $18 billion.

"There are already 133 Indian companies that have started business in China and about 49 Chinese companies have set up their office or developed their business in India. So this cooperation already started a long time ago. We want to give it a big push to have further development on this," said Yuxi.

So what remains to be seen is whether the ice over the border dispute melt with the newfound bonhomie between Indian and Chinese corporate boardrooms.

The Chinese Premier, by choosing to come to Bangalore before going to Delhi, is making his point very clear that he means to put business before borders.
Chinese premier calls for tech axis with India


"It is true India has the advantage in software and China in hardware. If India and China cooperate in the IT industry, we will be able to lead the world...and it will signify the coming of the Asian century of the IT industry,"
--Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao


BANGALORE (Reuters) - Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao visited India's technology hub on Sunday and said the two Asian giants could team up to become world leaders in information technology.

Wen arrived in Bangalore on Saturday on a four-day visit to India aimed at easing a decades-old border dispute and boosting trade between the world's two most populous countries.

Wen visited Tata Consultancy Services (TCS), India's largest software exporter, at a gleaming technology park symbolising India's growing prowess in information technology (IT).

"It is true India has the advantage in software and China in hardware. If India and China cooperate in the IT industry, we will be able to lead the world...and it will signify the coming of the Asian century of the IT industry," he said.

Wen also visited the Indian Space Research Organisation, the Indian Institute of Science and the office of China's largest telecoms equipment maker, Huawei Technologies, that plans to invest $100 million in India.

Huawei, which employs 800 Indians and 30 Chinese in India, is a rare Chinese player among more than 1,200 software units in Bangalore.

Wen was scheduled to leave for Delhi later on Sunday.

Wen, on the last leg of a four-nation South Asian tour, said his Indian visit would hold "significance in history".

His visit symbolises both the rivalry and the cooperation between two of the world's fastest growing economies who are mulling a free trade area.

China, whose exports in software and back-office services total less than a fifth of India's estimated $17.3 billion, is boosting English-language skills in schools to help mount a challenge to workers in Bangalore's software campuses.

On the other hand, TCS and Infosys Technologies, India's top two software firms, have set up centres in China with local staff, while Wipro plans to start one soon, aiming for a slice of China's $30 billion software market.

Wen begins official talks on Monday in Delhi, when he is due to meet Prime Minister Manmohan Singh. Apart from the long-standing border dispute, talks were to focus on trade with the aim of eventually establishing a free trade area (FTA).

"Definitely there will be something coming out on this (FTA) in this trip," Sun Yuxi, China's ambassador to India, told "BusinessWorld" magazine. "If we can develop a free trade area between China and India, we will be the biggest in the world."

Two-way trade has been growing at 30 percent a year for the past eight years, and could surpass $30 billion by 2010 from the current $13 billion. That would put China ahead of the United States as India's largest trading partner.

Each with more than one billion people, India and China are emerging as global diplomatic heavyweights. Bilateral ties are warmer now than at any time since a 1962 war over their 3,500-km Himalayan border.

The visit may clear the way for an end to the dispute.

The two most populous nations on Earth have two options: 1.) India and China can either act as a counterbalance to one another much like NATO and the Warsaw pact were during the Cold War. The difference there is that if a fullscale-war broke out between the two, it would easily surpass anything in history in shear bloodletting and deathtoll. Option 1 is something neither country wants to see.

2.) Or they can work together. Southeast Asia is already phenominally potent in terms of technology, economy and manufacturing before you facture in her two most biggest players. If they work together, both stand to benefit.

I don't know whether either nation will truly trust the other until their border disputes are resolved. The wounds from 1962 will remain otherwise and provide reason for a degree of mistrust. Chinese support of Pakistan gives off the impression that China wants to sabotage the only nation on Earth who can near equal it in population. This seems to have been the idea of Chinese support of Pakistan. China had little else to gain afterall. So the border dispute and Pakistan are the two things that can most damage any attempt to establish truly friendly relations between the two emerging giants.

Isn't it interesting that so much is made of China and how they will likely overtake the United States in GDP, yet Inia is relatively quietly positioning itself to do precisely the same thing?

I will hate to see option 1. And I will wish they will solve the border dispute in a hurry. I think border dispute is easier than Paki alliance issue. I believe Paki and India need to start fixing their kinks instead having others to pick sides. It is tough that strategic benefits being factored in first instead of building long lasting friendship.
thunder, nice comments, however from my analsis of the relathionship i came up wiht soemthing different

china would choose india aginist pakistan anyday, but one reason why china chose pakistan

oil, pakistan is currently a great place for a port which would transfer oil directly to chian through their border region, and this port is currently under construction

this could be seen also when china is improving its relationship with iran and several other middle eastern country, this is trying to ensure future oil demands since china too is a fuel driven economy

teh future of the world is computers, IT, manfuactring and resources, china and india together will produce this diverse result
Premier Wen in New Delhi for landmark visit

Premier Wen in New Delhi for landmark visit

News Source: XinhuaNet

BEIJING, April 11 -- Visiting Premier Wen Jiabao arrived in the Indian capital yesterday evening, and is expected to meet with senior Indian leaders today in a landmark visit aimed at pushing bilateral relations to a new high.

Analysts anticipated the tour will lead to a major step forward towards the resolution of the long-standing border dispute between the two sides.

"China and India, both developing countries, could have a positive influence on peace and development in Asia and even the whole world, through a harmonious relationship, enhancing mutual trust and expanding co-operation," Wen said.

China is ready to work with India on expanding relations from a strategic and overall perspective, as well as address issues left over from history, he said.

Wen made the remarks upon touching down on Indian soil late Saturday from Sri Lanka.

The premier spent most of the weekend visiting Bangalore, the "silicon valley of India," before flying to New Delhi yesterday afternoon.

He is on the last leg of a four-nation South Asian tour, which started with Pakistan on April 5, and also took him to Bangladesh.

Wen is due to meet Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh today.

They "will talk about all the important issues, and the border question will also be discussed," Indian Home Minister Shivraj Patil was quoted by Xinhua as saying.

However, Patil cautioned against pinning too much hope on the talks, saying results should not be expected overnight, according to Xinhua.

Before Wen embarked on the tour, Vice-Foreign Minister Wu Dawei revealed in Beijing that during the premier's visit, China and India may agree on guiding principles to help them resolve their border dispute.

The vice-minister stressed the current border issue would not stand in the way to advancing friendly and co-operative relations between China and India.

Yesterday in New Delhi, special representatives from China and India ended their fifth round of talks after reaching an agreement on the guiding principles on the solution of the border issue.

Officials from the Chinese delegation told Xinhua the meeting was held in a cordial, co-operative and constructive atmosphere.

China's Special Representative and Vice-Foreign Minister Dai Bingguo reached an agreement with Indian Special Representative and National Security Advisor M K Narayanan.

Both sides agreed the next round of talks would be held in Beijing at a date acceptable to both countries.
godofthunder9010, I think the position of both countries would be somewhere in between those two points you mentioned. There will be massive cooperation, this is just the beginning, but there will be competition too. Healthy competition is good always.
There is progress on the border issue too, the 4000 k.m. long border which has been a traditional trade route since ages and its virtually shut down with no exchanges for many years now, if they settle the boundary issue and open the roads for trade and commerce there would be a phenomenal increase in the bilateral trade. There's already some progress on this, the premier Wen Jiabao this time is carrying maps which he would exchange with his Indian counterpart which show Sikkim, a north-eastern state of india, as a part of India. Earlier they claimed Sikkim to be theirs though it was in India.
The last thing is now the chinese claim of the state of Arunachal Pradesh, they claim that India occupies 90,000 square kilometres of China's territory. India claims that China occupies 40,000 square kilometres of Indian territory (Aksai Chin in Jammu and Kashmir). Once this particular issue is settled then we can expect really good things in the future. But I think it'll be a tough task for both the sides to give up their land claims


the red area at the top right which is called Aksai Chin is claimed by India and it is occupied by China now, the red area in the left bottom is the Indian state of Arunachal Pradesh which is claimed by china as its territory and is occupied by India now, The small red area in the middle is the state of Sikkim in India which China now has recognised as India's.
China and India sign border deal


Xion Where Did you get that Crappy Map ....... :D

Look Mine is Better :)

Source:BBC News


India and China have signed an agreement in Delhi aimed at resolving a long-running dispute over their Himalayan border.

India's national security adviser said it was "one of the most significant documents" signed by the two countries.

The agreement was sealed as Indian premier Manmohan Singh met visiting Chinese counterpart Wen Jiabao.

The world's two most populous countries fought a bitter war over their largely unmarked border in 1962.

'Major process'


India's National Security Adviser MK Narayanan told Indian television that Indian and Chinese officials had worked out a roadmap for resolving the disputed 3,550km (2,200 mile) border.

"It shows a lot of give and take on both sides," he said.
"We are very hopeful that this document will be the starting point of a major process in the settlement of the boundary dispute between India and China."

The joint statement by the two countries did not go into specifics on the issue, talking of "political parameters" and "guiding principles".

However, China has now formally given up its claim to the state of Sikkim.

The joint statement refers to "the Sikkim State of the Republic of India".

Until now, China had never recognised India's 1975 annexation of Sikkim.

On the remaining issues of contention, the statement said "special representatives" would negotiate the issues, adding: "Both sides are convinced that an early settlement of the boundary question will advance the basic interests of the two countries."

Both sides have previously claimed the other is occupying parts of its land.

While India has accused China of occupying territory in Kashmir, Beijing has laid claim to territory in the north-east Indian state of Arunachal Pradesh.

IT connection

However, analysts say the border differences have been played down in recent times as China and India developed a blossoming economic relationship.

In addition to the border plans, Mr Wen said the two countries had set a target of increasing annual trade to $30bn by 2010.

China also reiterated its support for India to be given a permanent seat on the UN Security Council.

On Sunday, Mr Wen visited Bangalore, where he urged closer ties in the fields of science and technology.

"If India and China co-operate in the IT industry, we will be able to lead the world... and it will signify the coming of the Asian century of the IT industry," Mr Wen said.

The Chinese premier is on the final leg of his first South Asian tour since taking office last March.

This is very good news. These are the first steps of relieving political tensions between the two. I would like to see more of this.
Xion or anyone, I'm curious about one thing. China claims a pretty sizable chunk of land just north of Bangladesh. One thing I would like to clarify: Has the PRC ever controlled that territory or are they just claiming it based on some old extinct Dynasty that control that territory? What is the basis of China's claims?

Most any account of the Sino-India War focusses in the territory that the Chinese seized near Kashmir.
While the Chinese claim to Aksai Chin is somewhat makeable while making the great assumption that their claim to Tibet pre-invasion was legitimate (which neither I, nor the Indian government's position neither holds true or at all makeable), the Chinese claim to what later became Aksai Chin is completely preposterous. At no time in history has that area fallen under control of, has ever been suzeran to, has ever paid tribute to, or even had cultural contact with any Chinese empire, ever.
rajkhalsa said:
While the Chinese claim to Aksai Chin is somewhat makeable while making the great assumption that their claim to Tibet pre-invasion was legitimate (which neither I, nor the Indian government's position neither holds true or at all makeable), the Chinese claim to what later became Aksai Chin is completely preposterous. At no time in history has that area fallen under control of, has ever been suzeran to, has ever paid tribute to, or even had cultural contact with any Chinese empire, ever.
So it was controlled by the Kingdom we currently refer to as Tibet then? If so, when did that occur?

I'm sure you realize that we may have Flames in the forecast over disputing China's right to Tibet. There is no other nation on the planet that I'm aware of that officially sanctions the invasion of Tibet as valid or legal or legitimate. Just China says it was legit. China seems to make up for the lack of consensus by instilling in its citizens an absolute certainty that Tibet always was part of China and that its long existance as a separate kingdom and culture was a figment of history's deranged imagination. All opinions to the contrary are a direct result of American Imperialist propaganda, or some other such.

Can we skip over the pointless debate perhaps?
actually we never claimed it

if we did we wouldnve taken it during 62'

we dont claim any land at all, except for parts of manchuria that were truly manchu territory and taiwan, which is chinese