Global Warming is real, but not primarily man-made

MC Martel: I have read a number of your posts and it clear to me that you are a liberal, it should be just as obvious from mine that I am a conservative. God bless you sir, and God bless our democracy which would not be possible without spirited disagreement.
As a liberal you take your facts from the liberal media and liberal academia because they suit your inclinations and bolsters your opinions.
It is troubling that liberals have become such haters though. That started with the DNC Chairman announcing the new jihad. Remember, "I HATE Republicans, and everything they do!" speech? It is truly unfortunate that so many Democrats, especially liberal Democrats decided to take that exhortation to heart.
Hate really doesn't improve dialogue, it makes it very difficult to come to a concensus.
Would it surprise you to learn that among the 3600 scientists that you referred to as "Kooks" who reject global warming as a man-made phenomenon there are 14 Nobel Prize winners? The list of dissenters is readily available on the internet, if you look for opposing views. Are liberal Democrats allowed to do that anymore?
As a conservative Republican I don't hate liberals and I have yet to hear any Republican leader telling us to HATE Democrats.
I believe that men of good will and integrity can disagree. I don't hate you, I just think you are wrong. Is that okay anymore?
Oh by the way, I completely agree with you about nuclear power, but I have misgivings--based on the recent occurences in Japan--about traditional nuclear power plants. However there is a nuclear power plant called a molten-salt reactor that is a huge improvement over the current water and fuel rod technology. Check into it, it is very cool.
 
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MontyB: Check out molten-salt reactors. It is a technology developed at the Oak Ridge nuclear facility in Tenessee in the 60s. No fuel rods (so no melt down potential), higher temperature (more efficient), and it can use currently stockpiled nuclear waste as fuel. MSRs look like a vast improvement over current fuel rod and water reactors. In fact China has just announced that they will be building 55 MSRs over the next decade. I wonder where the Chinese got access to test results from a secure facility in the US. It sounds like this technology would be appropriate in the most geologically unstable areas. Look into it.
 
RealNavy said:
MontyB: Check out molten-salt reactors. It is a technology developed at the Oak Ridge nuclear facility in Tenessee in the 60s. No fuel rods (so no melt down potential), higher temperature (more efficient), and it can use currently stockpiled nuclear waste as fuel. MSRs look like a vast improvement over current fuel rod and water reactors. In fact China has just announced that they will be building 55 MSRs over the next decade. I wonder where the Chinese got access to test results from a secure facility in the US. It sounds like this technology would be appropriate in the most geologically unstable areas. Look into it.
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Unfortunately I am not sure many will be going down the nuclear lines for a while after the problems the Japanese have had mostly due to outdated plants, my understanding is that safety systems in modern plants are far better at managing these sorts of problems.

The problems we will face in the future because we have chosen not to seriously look into nuclear power will be far greater now but as you have seen with nuclear plants world wide every politician that can lift a leg has jumped on the "nuclear is dangerous" bandwagon.

As for the Chinese well my guess is that they stole the data, much like everything else since 1948.
 
As I told my daughter--a Navy nuke--summoning the national will to go nuclear is difficult when nuclear power is such a political football. Of course in China, where dissent is not allowed, summoning that will is easy.
 
Global Warming is not man made.... back in the 1700s the world was in a mini ice age. Temp goes up and down. The Sun goes up and down in production of heat and light. Thus we are affected.
 
5.56X45mm said:
Global Warming is not man made.... back in the 1700s the world was in a mini ice age. Temp goes up and down. The Sun goes up and down in production of heat and light. Thus we are affected.
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It doesn't happen often 5.56 but on this I agree with you. Mankind has been on this planet for less than 0.0005% of the time earth existed. The coal we mine now was formed during the Carboniferous Period, when our land lay in a tropical climate. Hunderds of glacial and inter-glacial periods have come to pass, long before man was on earth, so the assumption that it is us, who does this is somewhat pretentious. My personal favorit is Milutin Milankovich and his theory. For an interesing read:

http://www.homepage.montana.edu/~geol445/hyperglac/time1/milankov.htm

And if you take into account the solar activity itself... well... it seems that mankind had little to no influence whatsoever in this. Besides, without the green house-effect we'd all be dead, because the average temperature on earth would drop far below zero.
 
Unfortunately it is an idiotic argument because we all agree that temperatures have fluctuated throughout history and we all agree that it is a natural cycle what we are arguing about is how much input man has had on that natural cycle.

Yet we sit here with "Anti" crowd shouting it doesn't exist and and the "Pro" side shouting its all man made when in reality the truth as usual is somewhere between the two extremes.

As for the "mini-ice age" of the 1700s well it just so happens that we had a huge amount volcanic activity and low solar activity through that period so we know what caused that one.
 
Del Boy said:
It was volcanic action that ended the Ice Age, was it not? Checks and balances.
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umm no.

Particulate matter in the atmosphere causes a cooling effect as does the conversion of SO2 to H2SO4 when SO2 reaches the stratosphere.

Ash clouds block the suns radiation and H2SO4 in the the stratosphere reflects radiation.

During the period 1580-1660 there were several major eruptions such as Mitchell (Billy Mitchell), Huaynaputina, Mount Cotabato and Long Island (PNG) to a Volcanic Explosivity Index of 5 or greater (Krakatoa was a 6 and Pompei was a 5 on this index).
 
Del Boy said:
What are we proving? Did you not like my link then?
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The link was fine but I am not sure what it was referring to, there are countless theories involving the production of green house gases to facilitate terra-forming and to be honest volcanic activity is pretty inefficient at producing CO2 compared to man.
 
MontyB said:
The link was fine but I am not sure what it was referring to, there are countless theories involving the production of green house gases to facilitate terra-forming and to be honest volcanic activity is pretty inefficient at producing CO2 compared to man.
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Yes? Well, now we are here. I guess we have averted another Ice Age.

Watch this space.
 
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10-foot-pole.jpg
 
Oh Greenland is a barren land
A land that bares no green
Where there's ice and snow, and the whalefishes blow
And the daylight's seldom seen, brave boys
Where the daylight's seldom seen


And still Norse vikings called it Greenland, and settled there...
Fact is that most archeologists and historians aggree that the Norse settlements on Greenland was mostly self sustained, and managed to grow some kind of crops, wich in turn indicates that the climate was far warmer back then.

And this was almost a millenium before Nikolaus Otto and Rudolf Diesel came up with their internal combustion engines, so the global warming of that period could hardly be related to native Americans (the vikings had'nt discovered America yet) driving around in gasoline guzzeling SUV's.

Sure, the modern man has done his part in it, but there are also some natural reasons behind the changing climate.
 
IS global warming real?

Same complaint again from me in England as last year etc. etc.

Some b/stard has stolen our share of Global Warming again!

Even so, our cartoon politicians are going to break us with their crazy circus. All for the sake of their career agendas, parading on the world stage, pretending to be statesmen.
 
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