Israeli Nuclear policy....? - Page 3




View Poll Results :What should Israels nuclear policy be:
A) Admit having Nukes, refuse to disarm them, and threaten arab nations that any WMD attack on Israel would earn a nuclear response. 5 22.73%
B) Keep the current policy, admit nothing, denie nothing. 8 36.36%
C)Admit having nukes, agree to disarm them. 9 40.91%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

 
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June 15th, 2004  
Marksman
 
 
You missunderstood me,iwasnt talking on world scale,not on isreal-arabs conflicts...etc.
June 15th, 2004  
Italian Guy
 
 
You kidding me ? I'm gonna drop this. Democracies are the good guys, countries allowing you freedom of speech, of movement, of thought, human rights are the good guys. Thats my childish criteria.

Oh man you've lived under communism you should now that pretty well.
June 15th, 2004  
Marksman
 
 
OHHHh i do.The problem is that this democrasy here was corrupted,now when Legia talks......lots of them are going to slammer!!Not such a good
example of democrasy,huh??
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June 15th, 2004  
1217
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ItalianGuy4US
Democracies are the good guys, countries allowing you freedom of speech, of movement, of thought, human rights are the good guys. Thats my childish criteria.

Oh man you've lived under communism you should now that pretty well.
Communism isn't the direct opposite of democracy. Capitalism is.

Democracy isn't sacred. Take Israel for example, now I don't know who outnumbers who in Israel, but if the majority is let's say the Palestinians, and they want to kill all Jews, than it would be democratically correct to kill all Jews! I don't think that's what we want now, is it? (For equality purposes I'd like to add that it's possible here to exchange the terms "Jew" and "Palestinian" in this post. It's only meant as an example, not to put anyone down)

BTW, don’t forget Hitler was democratically elected. The world isn't black and white, good and bad, it's different shades of grey all the way.
Even Hitler did good things in his life (Constructing highways and such), so even he wasn't 100% bad. (More like 99.999999989635678% )

I do agree with your "countries allowing you freedom of speech, of movement, of thought, human rights are the good guys." statement, but still no-one is all good or all bad.
June 15th, 2004  
SHERMAN
 
 
Firstly:

Marksman and Italian, enough. What the heck is up with you people, we cant debate with out flamming?!


Second-this is not about the world in general, this about Israel....
June 15th, 2004  
Italian Guy
 
 
Yeah sorry I resorted to flaming and apologize. Sorry Marksman I know you're one of the good guys .
Anyways what I meant was that democracy HAS TO BE the best, the good guy. C'm on. I know Europeans ( 1217 ) are way too used to go around philosophying without sense of practice, but this is it.
And- 1217, the case about Israel compared as Nazi Germany, there's a little detail being part of democracy which I would like you to remember: it's called constitution. I don't think the Jews would agree on the basis of a hypothetical Constitution where mass murdering the Jews would be legal, if agreed upon by the majority of citizens. Before playing in a democracy, you gotta create a widely-shared constitution.

Secondly, dude, sorry to disappoint you but Nazi Germany wasn't really a democracy. Hitler may have come to power with regular elections, but there was no freedom of movement or of speech for its citizens. Nor were human rights mentioned in the constitution.
Which is, DEMOCRACY does not mean ONLY that the majority rules. It involves much more.
June 15th, 2004  
Marksman
 
 
I owe you an apologize too,you are totally right,Nazi germany was never and couldnt be democratic ever,it was natuional-socialistic and that aint no democrasy in my book.So im stil 55 percent for the disarmament,well...........heck i might change my mind later
June 15th, 2004  
Uncle_Sam
 
 
Even Hitler did good things in his life (Constructing highways and such), so even he wasn't 100% bad. (More like 99.999999989635678% )

Mod Edit: Sorry Uncle Sam: i just had to change the color...the yellow was just not readable.

He wasn't bad for his country, but he was bad 100% for the world.


Israel should have a nuclear arsenal, my oppinion. Although I am against every small country haveing Nukes. Nobody gave Jewish people peace for 3 milleniums, I think nukes are only solution for them, so nobody will attack them!
June 15th, 2004  
1217
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ItalianGuy4US
Yeah sorry I resorted to flaming and apologize. Sorry Marksman I know you're one of the good guys .
Anyways what I meant was that democracy HAS TO BE the best, the good guy. C'm on. I know Europeans ( 1217 ) are way too used to go around philosophying without sense of practice, but this is it.
And- 1217, the case about Israel compared as Nazi Germany, there's a little detail being part of democracy which I would like you to remember: it's called constitution. I don't think the Jews would agree on the basis of a hypothetical Constitution where mass murdering the Jews would be legal, if agreed upon by the majority of citizens. Before playing in a democracy, you gotta create a widely-shared constitution.

Secondly, dude, sorry to disappoint you but Nazi Germany wasn't really a democracy. Hitler may have come to power with regular elections, but there was no freedom of movement or of speech for its citizens. Nor were human rights mentioned in the constitution.
Which is, DEMOCRACY does not mean ONLY that the majority rules. It involves much more.
I did not mean to compare Nazi-Germany directly with Israel, and I don't think I did. It's even in two different paragraphs. Hitler was elected, so started out as a democratically elected official.

BTW in my opinion the ideal government would be a single, highly intelligent dictator (for lack of a better word) who had the best in mind for the country and it's citizens. In real life, no one man could probably handle the responsibilities and the power that would come with that position, so I'll settle for a democracy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [url=http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=DEMOCRACY
dictionary.reference.com[/url]]de·moc·ra·cy
n. pl. de·moc·ra·cies
1) Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.
2) A political or social unit that has such a government.
3) The common people, considered as the primary source of political power.
4)
Majority rule.
5) The principles of social equality and respect for the individual within a community.
All I'm trying to say is that who are the good guys and who are the bad guys depends on your point of view. To get slightly back on topic, I for one sometimes find it hard to keep to my convictions that the Israelis are the good guys, if I see how innocent looking palestinains are homeless and blaming the Israeli gouvernment. Both groups do good and bad things, no country is all saints, not even Israel or the US. (Or the Netherlands for that matter.) I guess I'm on thin ice here, and I find it hard to get my exact opinion on the screen, but please try to understand what I'm trying to say before cutting me down...
June 15th, 2004  
SHERMAN
 
 
Idident think 1217 was comparing Israel with the Nzais.

Oh, as to the Hitler thing, he was horrible for Germany, thanks to him it got into a war it couldent win, was divided, and was nearly destroyed by WW2. All of this is however, offtopic