The American War for Independance

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Darcia

Active member
Was the WFI realy the war that gave America's Freedom, or was it the war of 1812.


I Honestly the war of 1812 gave us our true Independance because it showed the world that we could continue and we could defeat the British, sure we got our Independance in the WFI I beleive we truly got it when we beat the British on our own and we showed the world we could survive.
 
The American Revolutionary War obtained independence. Britain didn't try to reassert rule and they did not leave forces occupying. The fledgling USA was not answerable to the crown, nor did the King try to tell them what to do.

We were still heavily dependant on trade from the nations of Europe -- Great Britain being the foremost among them. We hadn't yet developed the industrial and technological systems to go it completely alone.

The War of 1812 was many things. Not a victory, but the United States demonstrated that it would stick up for itself when threatened. We showed to Europe that they weren't just a joke that would cease to exist eventually. So in that war, we won some respect.
 
WE most likly could't have won the WFI if it wasn't for the French showing up and helping us cornor them. However we weren't under direct rule alot of people didn't respect us back then, the War of 1812 but a new sense of respect...
 
Dameon said:
Was the WFI realy the war that gave America's Freedom, or was it the war of 1812.
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Seeing that in the War of 1812, the USA didn't gain anything from the British. I feel it safe to state that whatever freedom you are referring to, was gained in the AWI.
 
Actualy alot of People say the Americans got Thier President they had re-elected because of it, also we got Washington destroyed and rebuilt better than before in the overall end.
 
well..get the tomatoes ready folks...

we didn't get our real independence..until we got a government established that allowed us to interact with other nations on an equal basis...

While we were a young nation of roughly 13 states...our collective bargaining agency, a government established under the articles of confederation...really had no power to get collective power from those 13 states. However..when we established a new government..under the constitution that was actually binding..with power to enforce and establish national goals and ideas...was when we as a country could look at another nation like britain..or canada..with an established national will..a navy a army...and all the things that go with it.

So while we severed our ties with england in the declaration of independence..it was the establishment of our government under the constitution that gave us the mean to continue our independence..and our nation.

ok..have lit my cigarette aim those tomatoes well les infants... :D
 
Hmmm, I wonder who the American Soldiers on the Frontier back in 1803 would say if they heard someone claim the Britian controlled them! I'm sure after they would riflebutt the questioner in the face, they would give thier opinion of wether or not the British crown were still thier soverign. I mean, this conversation just outright cancels out almost two generations of Americans. It's like the differance between Europe in 1943 and then 1972... a whole lot of living happened, it may seem like to us two centureies later 1812 and 1783 are practically a day or two apart, but they are so not. Plenty of time for independant living, independant thinking.
 
The American Revolution granted the colonist their independence. However, it was the War of 1812 that further establised the United States as an independent nation. I'm sure that if England had the support of its people, the funding and the manpower (and no Napoleon), there would have been several more instances of Britain attempting to place the colonies back under their control. It wasn't really until the American Civil War...some 50yrs later that a decent relationship was established between England and the United States...and it was with only a portion of the US...the South. Close ties with southern leaders sparked the long standing relationship between the these two countries that still stands today.
Patrick
 
RedCoat, you said we gained nothing from war of 1812. I must correct you. THE MAIN REASON we fought was because the English constantly were impressing our sailors on the high seas. After the war was ended, the impressment ceased. We won what we sought, freedom from english piracy on the high seas. So how did we gain nothing?
 
BigBert96 said:
RedCoat, you said we gained nothing from war of 1812. I must correct you. THE MAIN REASON we fought was because the English constantly were impressing our sailors on the high seas. After the war was ended, the impressment ceased. We won what we sought, freedom from english piracy on the high seas. So how did we gain nothing?
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We did gain that. But if you look deeper the British did not see the impressment of US seamen as impressment of forgieners. They saw it as impressment of subjects to the Crown,
The U.S. still considered by the Crown to be colonies in rebellion for the most part. What we gained was recognition as a sovergion nation.
 
BigBert96 said:
RedCoat, you said we gained nothing from war of 1812. I must correct you. THE MAIN REASON we fought was because the English constantly were impressing our sailors on the high seas. After the war was ended, the impressment ceased. We won what we sought, freedom from english piracy on the high seas. So how did we gain nothing?
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Simple, read the peace treaty. No mention is made of impressment or the rights of neutral shipping.
Impressment stopped for two reasons.
Firstly Britain had agreed to stop impressment 3 weeks before the US declared war on Britain. The fact that the US decided to continue with the war after they found out, even though no action had yet taken place, tends to make us British think that perhaps the conquest of Canada had more to do with the War of 1812 than you Americans like to admit.
Secondly, by the end of the War of 1812 Britain was no longer at war with France. The RN was being 'downsized' to save money, there was no longer any need to impress or even press-gang anybody
 
if you look deeper the British did not see the impressment of US seamen as impressment of forgieners. They saw it as impressment of subjects to the Crown,
The U.S. still considered by the Crown to be colonies in rebellion for the most part. What we gained was recognition as a sovergion nation.
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No, Britain recognized the US as a sovereign nation at the Treaty of Paris after the AWI.
The British only impressed sailors who they believed had been born in Britain or had already served in the RN. Any sailor who could prove he was American born was released( and a number were)
What the British didn't recognize was the right of a person to change his nationality( this was a grey area in international politics at the time), not the sovereignty of the US as such.
 
The fact that impressing of American sailors occurred was bad enough. But would the UK have held to its agreement to cease impressing Americans into their navy? By the fact that it happened to begin with, we see that they had very little respect for the United States. I doubt that they would have changed their attitude had the War of 1812 not occurred.
 
godofthunder9010 said:
The fact that impressing of American sailors occurred was bad enough. But would the UK have held to its agreement to cease impressing Americans into their navy? By the fact that it happened to begin with, we see that they had very little respect for the United States. I doubt that they would have changed their attitude had the War of 1812 not occurred.
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After the war with France had ended, what their attitude was didn't matter, they didn't need them ;)
So even if the US had not declared war on Britain, impressment would have stopped at the end of 1814 by the latest anyway
 
Didn't need them ... until some other time and some other war, at which point (assuming the War of 1812 hadn't happened at all) they would had no qualms whatsoever at reinstituting the practice.
 
And if it had happend sometime else instead of 1812 thier is a chance America may have not won for different reasons. However that is one o the major reasons we went to war aginast Britian.
 
A good point was brought up...that the US was concerned more about the northwestern border between the US and Canada than impressment. I do not doubt this to be true. Expansionism was, since early colonial times, a primary objective.
Patrick
 
Additionally, there was some disagreement as to where the Northwestern Border truly was. Though it tends to be downplayed or forgotten altogether, this was one of the things that was more clearly defined in the in the peace negotiations.
 
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