Royal Navy F***ed

Gator said:
TThe United States Navy hot bunks Missile Boats, using Gold and Blue Crews for its SSB Fleet.
The United States Navy has no trouble with such, and there are no loyalty issues that I know of to deal with as they are both Crews of the same Sub, one is just called Gold, while the other is called Blue.
This allows the Ballistic Missile Submarine to stay out on Duty longer while giving one Crew a much needed break.
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Yeah but each Gold & Blue are assigned to one boat. They're not jumped aorund to other ships.

The Brits are moving folks around to other boats and ships. Hot Bunking in the US Navy and the Royal Navy are two different things.

The US Navy doesn't take the crew of the USS Florida (SSGN-728) and move her to the USS Michigan (SSBN-727). Sure, they're both Ohio CLass boats but they're still different. Ships of the same class are still different because not all are built the same. During their time in drydock when they're being built. Plans are changed from the original to make improvments and such.
 
I think, in the end, the Royal Navy simply needs more ships of the right class: it needs to pay off its out of date frigates and submarines, build the right number of new ships (so a third more destroyers and submarines than currently scheduled), crew and arm them up.

If that costs money, well, that's the price of liberty.

Oh and we need to talk about logistics, Military Police and combat engineering too...but that's a topic for another thread...
 
Kirruth said:
I think, in the end, the Royal Navy simply needs more ships of the right class: it needs to pay off its out of date frigates and submarines, build the right number of new ships (so a third more destroyers and submarines than currently scheduled), crew and arm them up.

If that costs money, well, that's the price of liberty.

Oh and we need to talk about logistics, Military Police and combat engineering too...but that's a topic for another thread...
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So, are you running on a Platform of Higher Taxes to be used for a Military Build-up?..... Or Service Cuts in the Civilian Realm?

Perhaps a little of both?
 
Gator said:
So, are you running on a Platform of Higher Taxes to be used for a Military Build-up?..... Or Service Cuts in the Civilian Realm?

Perhaps a little of both?
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Well personally, I am not running for another four years (got elected in May). Nationally, we are two years out from a general election, and spending and defence policy for that election are still under debate. So, what follows is my personal opinion.

The way I see it is this:

Defence is a three-way balance between the capabilities you have, the cash you have and the commitments you have.

The point I was making in this thread was that the improvements planned for the Navy (capability) could and should have gone ahead within the existing defence budget (cash), the problem being that the defence budget is being spent on war fighting (commitments).

I think that the poor decisions of world governments have meant that castrophic impacts of climate change and global war will increase over time, which means our commitments are likely to expand and we will require enhanced capabilities, both of which will demand cash.

The problem is that the baby boomers are now retiring, which means that there will be an increased demand on our nations' resources for pensions and healthcare, and fewer people paying into the system. I think the truth is that seniors are going to have to adapt to less social provision, and those who are working are going to have to live with higher taxes and working longer.

In the end, I think it will come down to a choice between defending liberty and living comfortably. A trip to a Commonwealth or US war cemetery, shows how many have given what Lincoln called the "last full measure of devotion", and tells us that the choice has already been made.

Heh, I probably could have answered your question with just that last paragraph but hey, you know what politicians are like...
 
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The tax take is horrendous in the UK. We pay, for example, approaching £5 for a gallon of petrol, about $10 at the last count. What is even more horrendous, however, is where the money goes. We have the most awful, snout in the trough, politicians you can imagine. You saw the last post. Well pensioners, who have paid all their lives, are on a pittance, the lowest in Europe I guess, and nothing like approaching. Politicians STILL are voting themselves enormous salaries at low levels, even nonsensical levels of service, and every conceivable perk you can ever think of. They are publically hated because they scandalise our nation. I have no axe to grind other than truth and justice. They have plucked the Golden goose here, sold us down the river, to the extent that it is likely that England, like its navy,will not survive, except as a tucked away region of Europe. You have to understand that our current crop of Labour politicians are drawn from the ranks of the failed communists, who always hated England. On the other hand, seeing the different landscape that has arisen, and being only career orientated ( and what a career, who says that crime doesn't pay) the Conservatives have abandoned the politics of principle, and joined the chattering classes to buy every sleezy vote they can, including fraudulent postal votes. They all are trying to remove the spine of our nation, and I can see a time when the press will be reigned in; they already want to shoot the messenger.

I believe that somehow we have to make our politicians accountable and that some have deserved to be accused of treason, for betraying the trust of the people they are supposed to serve. They have, for example, dragged in the Trojan Horse and have exposed us to the enemy within. I believe this has been a deliberate policy to destroy our traditional culture. We have never been consulted, these things have been imposed.

Of course, in the long run, you get the government you deserve. This is why so many good Brits are leaving, particularly for places like Australia.
They think we are finished - I want to fight to the last, but now I have to rely on my voice and my pen.

How'm I doing?8)
 
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Kirruth said:
In the end, I think it will come down to a choice between defending liberty and living comfortably. A trip to a Commonwealth or US war cemetery, shows how many have given what Lincoln called the "last full measure of devotion", and tells us that the choice has already been made.
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You view the Iraq War as "Defense" or "Offense"?

In the United States I believe that when people start to do without things they like they will look to cut back on the Military..... and vote for such things at the Ballot Box, seeing how the Military is used in an Offensive Role now days instead of Defense and Civilian Military Contractors are taking the big slice of the Tax Dollar Pie.

As for what will happen in England..... well, no one forced you to expend your Tax Pounds in Iraq, that was the choice of your Government, and your Government alone.
Makes me wonder just how that will play out as people in England stand in line for Government Services if cuts are to be made.
 
gator
They will simply tax the trousers off us, that is if we have any left. But you know what - if there had been no Iraq conflict, they'd have still taken whatever was in the pot for their big government wages, expenses, and all the crackpot, knee-jerk projects you could throw your hat at .

At the moment, we could do with the Australian model, and lots of our people are heading that way to join it. Hey-ho.
 
There are to many fat Joes, sitting on their coaches, whining about bigger tax refunds, and more public services. Dont care where you get the money to do so, as long as its free for him.
 
Del Boy said:
gator
They will simply tax the trousers off us, that is if we have any left. But you know what - if there had been no Iraq conflict, they'd have still taken whatever was in the pot for their big government wages, expenses, and all the crackpot, knee-jerk projects you could throw your hat at .
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Word is Kirruth is your Servant (or at least one of many) in the Government there..... perhaps Kirruth will seek to take some of the Tax Burden off the people of England..... if such a thing is even possible.
 
Gator said:
Word is Kirruth is your Servant (or at least one of many) in the Government there..... perhaps Kirruth will seek to take some of the Tax Burden off the people of England..... if such a thing is even possible.
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Heh, well, I can definitely promise a strong defence (if ever they give me the big job).
 
Kirruth said:
Heh, well, I can definitely promise a strong defence (if ever they give me the big job).
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Be a refreshing change of pace from what is in my own opinion the tepid Offense England has put forth of late.

Best of luck.
 
When ever I stumble into conversations like this I end up just squinting my eyes, gritting my teeth and repeat "There will always be an England!" until I feel better.

There will always be an England. And nothing that England is going through now is new or something they haven't over come before.
 
God Bless the UK too.
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The Army now gets rotated around it's postings ever six months. Now is it easier to leave a ship on station and replace the crew, or to sail ship back to Britain just to change crews. All our assets must be used to the full and not wasted just sailing backwards and forwards to their home base
 
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