I have a couple of thoughts.
First. Perhaps now some of you will realize that calling people "Traitors", "un-American" simply because they disagree with you, really isn't such a nice thing to do. I think MoveOn went too far, but then again some of you all could have shown the same restraint a few years back. I mean when Max Cleland was shown as a bin Laden supporter how many of you complained? -Lets not be too hypocritical shall we ???
Do not characterize the individuals here as "you". There are many different views and beliefs from many different countries on this forum, and to claim that we are all the same is a foolhardy remark.
There are distinct differences between Cleland and Patraeus, and come to think of it, I dont ever remember someone posting an article in the NYT calling Cleland a traitor.
mmarsh said:
Second, the notion of an American General betraying his own country is not exactly unfounded. -Benedict Arnold Anyone?
We all had our third grade history lesson here, we know who Arnold is. Do not compare the two, for there are no grounds for comparison.
mmarsh said:
Thirdly. I respect MoveOn ability to fight for their convictions, even if as I said I think they went too far. At good to see a few Democrats with a backbone rather than the gutless, spineless, wimps that currently make up the DNC and who are too afraid to take on the far right. If the RNC wasn't so repulsive, I'd drop the DNC in a heartbeat. Unfortunately the Dems still haven't figured out that Nobody likes a coward.
And this is my own opinion. Frankly I don't find Patreaus at all convincing, just more of the same BS we have been spoon fed. I got into a disagreement with USMC03 a few weeks ago, unfortunately I was right. Its clear that this whole SURGE business was a political whitewash to save whats left of the Pres reputation. Although I was wrong to say Patreaus would cover Bush's rear end.
In fact Bush covered is own rear end and put Patreaus and Crocker name on it so that it will look authentic. This report was prepared by the White House with only Patreaus and Crocker providing 'commentary', the WH admitted this a few weeks ago. So the WH prepared the report, and we all know about their strict devotion to the truth.
CNN just reported that Both ABC and Gallup Polls show 53% think this is sugar-coating, cherry picked report.
One example of how deceptive this report is. The reports states that the number of attacks as gone down -thats true. But the number of killed\wounded during the surge is actually higher than in previous (non-surge) years. Of course, thats the part they 'forgot' to mention in the report.
And of course there is very little mention of the Iraqi Government which is what the surge was supposed to help. i.e reduce the violence so that the politics can continue. That part, the most important part, is AWOL as well.
So you suggest that all of this is whitewash and that Patraeus is simply a puppet to cover for the Bush administration.
How the **** do you expect people to believe the truth when all they hear is the propaganda garbage out in the media?? Wait... which way does the media lean? LEFT! So, when a left leaning poll conducted by a left leaning agency provides left leaning results, that is the truth and not a product of 'whitewash'. If you actually watched the report, you would have seen a question about the definition of attacks in Iraq, and the media's assertion that the Pentagon only calls an assasination an assassination if the bullet enters the front of the head, and Patraeus said that that was not correct. Obviously the media had an agenda and substituted their beliefs for the truth.
I highly doubt that Patraeus, a man who has dedicated much of his life to to serving his country, would sacrifice himself before the gods of the media for a single man nor would betray his country to provide a retiring President with a good name.
The fact is that the situation in Iraq has changed. Ask the poeple who have actually been there and they will tell you a very different story than what CNN will. I cannot attest to the situation in Iraq, all I can go off of is what I gather from the the individuals who have been there themselves, both good and bad.
Sir, you apperantly did not take the time to watch the report and simply turned on CNN to see the tidbits fed through. I recommend you turn to CSPAN and watch it, maybe you will catch the parts where they talk about the action the governmental body has taken. A paraphrase from the report (by a Representative) "[in reference to the Iraqi government] which has actually been legislativly more effective than the congress of the United States"