Can taiwanese kidd DDG can restrain ambition of China?

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sandy

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TAIWAN NEWS

Taiwan Set For Delivery Of Two US-Built Kidd-Class Destroyers
Taipei (AFP) Dec 06, 2005
The first two of four Kidd-class destroyers sold to Taiwan by the United States are due to arrive at the weekend, bolstering the navy's defense capabilities against rival China, a navy spokesman said Tuesday.
The two destroyers, which were first refitted for Taiwan's use at a US naval shipyard, were scheduled to arrive Saturday at the Suao naval base in the island's northeast, naval lieutenant-commander Wu Chih-chieh told AFP.
A formal commissioning ceremony has been set for mid-December, he said, adding that Taiwan would take delivery of the remaining two destroyers in 2006.
The four Kidd-class destroyers, originally built for the Shah of Iran, were commissioned in the US navy following the Iranian revolution in 1979. They were decommissioned from the US navy in the late 1990s.
Taiwan's navy has said its combat capabilities will be greatly improved thanks to the four 9,600-tonne destroyers, sold to Taiwan as part of an arms package approved by US President George W. Bush in April 2002.
The deal infuriated China, which opposes any arms sales to the island it considers to be part of its territory since the two split in 1949 at the end of a civil war.
In July the Pentagon released a report warning that China had deployed up to 730 ballistic missiles targeting the island.
It said Beijing's defense build-up could tip the military balance against Taiwan and pose a credible threat to other countries in the region.
Analysts say Taiwan's navy badly needs the destroyers, which will be armed with Standard II missiles and a system capable of simultaneously tracking dozens of incoming airborne threats.
The surface-to-air missiles have a range of 144 kilometers (90 miles) and vastly outperform the Standard I missiles deployed on Taiwan's Perry-class frigates. Cross-strait tensions have increased since Chen Shui-bian of the independence-leaning Democratic Progressive Party won the presidency in 2000, ending the Kuomintang's 51-year grip on power. He was re-elected last year.
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http://www.spacewar.com/news/taiwan-05zn.html
I think kidd class DDG is better than any chinese warship.
Even she is old lady.
 
I agree with you. I think this is a much stronger naval setup to use the Kid Class Destroyers in an air defence roll and their Kang Ding Class Frigattes in an anti-ship mission profile. The Kang Dings are just horrible at anti-aircraft so these Kidds are an excellent addition to the Taiwanese navy. And at 15% of the origional cost of the Kidd class, the Taiwanese are getting a great deal on them.

Honestly, though, I think the Taiwanese would be best suited by trying to get some better fighter planes. If they could try and get a deal on some F-35s or even F-22s I think that would drastically improve their defence. Because, let's not kid ourselves, whoever wins air superiority is going to win a naval battle in the Taiwan Straight.
 
I think the Taiwanese would be best suited by trying to get some better fighter planes. If they could try and get a deal on some F-35s or even F-22s
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I just dont see why we dont give/sell them a SSBN. Then they have a nuclear deternt, problem solved.
 
i just dont see why we dont give them independence,problem solved?
American's problem solved,but china get new problem.
 
Eh, we can't get into a China vs. Taiwan thing in a thread like this it'll blow up and take it way off topic.

Let's just stick to the Destroyer in question.
 
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did you know that those KIDD class ships were once built for the Imperial Iranian Navy but never delivered due to the revolution in Iran??

US Navy personnel used to call them Ayatolla class

Laid down by Litton Ingalls, Pascagoula Miss. June 26 1978.
Launched August 11 1979 and commissioned June 27 1981.
Built for Iran.
Taken over by the US Navy By Executive order after the fall of the Shah in July 1979.
Reclassified Guided Missile Destroyer DDG-993 August 8 1979.
Decommissioned March 12 1998 At Norfolk Virginia.
Fate To Taiwan as the DDG-1801 Keelung, scheduled to be commissioned on Dec 19 2005 at Su-Ao Naval Base.

http://www.iinavy.org/sirus.htm
 
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Rabs said:
I just dont see why we dont give/sell them a SSBN. Then they have a nuclear deternt, problem solved.
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See: Iran-US relations in the last 50 years for why we don't give foreign nations nuclear secrets.
 
The US should not ever sell first class weaponry like the F-22 or F-35 or a SSBN to the Taiwanese for the simple reason that there is a VERY credible chance of peaceful reunification and then guess who has got their hands on the most advanced weaponry the US produces? Yeah. ;) Backing Taiwan was a cold war gambit and in light of bigger and more dangerous fish I am all in favour of a "catch and release" scheme for this troublesome little island with its gangster elite and complete lack of respect for the rule of law both domestic and international.
 
I wasn't thinking about the F-22/F-35 as being in the same catagory as an SSBN but, yeah, you're right. Even if we where to bomb any next-gen fighters in such a peaceful reunification the Chinese would still get all the pilots and techs that worked with it.

And that's not a good situation.

Better to sell them our out-of-date technology at a discount. This Kidd program is very good for both the US and Taiwan.
 
bulldogg said:
The US should not ever sell first class weaponry like the F-22 or F-35 or a SSBN to the Taiwanese for the simple reason that there is a VERY credible chance of peaceful reunification and then guess who has got their hands on the most advanced weaponry the US produces? Yeah. ;) Backing Taiwan was a cold war gambit and in light of bigger and more dangerous fish I am all in favour of a "catch and release" scheme for this troublesome little island with its gangster elite and complete lack of respect for the rule of law both domestic and international.
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No see we don't anybody anything and if Taiwan wants to buy planes from Lockheed Martin let them. And the JSF plans were for European nations to purchase them also.
 
Better than the Aegis class? I daresay the most advanced weaponry we should sell them is some of the old mothballed WWII battleships, like the Alabama or New Jersey.
 
bulldogg said:
Better than the Aegis class? I daresay the most advanced weaponry we should sell them is some of the old mothballed WWII battleships, like the Alabama or New Jersey.
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Nope, the Arleigh Burke class are the only ones with the AEGIS system.

ARLEIGH BURKE CLASS (AEGIS) GUIDED MISSILE DESTROYERS, USA

The first Arleigh Burke Class Aegis destroyer was commissioned in 1991. Contracts for the destroyers have been split between the Northrop Grumman Ship Systems (formerly Litton Ingalls Shipbuilding), based in Pascagoula, Mississippi and the General Dynamics subsidiary, Bath Iron Works, based in Maine. The first 21 ships (DDG51-DDG71) are categorised as Flight I and the next seven (DDG72-DDG78) as Flight II.
The revised Flight IIA ships entered production in late 1997. 17 have been commissioned: USS Oscar Austin (DDG 79), August 2000; Roosevelt (DDG 80), November 2000; Winston S. Churchill (DDG 81), March 2001; Lassen (DDG 82), April 2001; Howard (DDG 83), October 2001; Bulkeley (DDG 84), December 2001; Shoup (DDG 86), June 2002; McCampbell (DDG 85), August 2002; Preble (DDG 88), November 2002; Mason (DDG 87), April 2003; USS Mustin (DDG 89), July 2003; Chafee (DDG 90), October 2003. Pinkney (DDG 91), May 2004; Momsen (DDG 92), August 2004; Chung-Hoon (DDG 93), September 2004; James E Williams (DDG 95), December 2004; Nitze (DDG 94), March 2005. Halsey (DDG 97), July 2005.

The ships are armed with 56 Raytheon Tomahawk cruise missiles, with a combination of land-attack (TLAM) missiles with a Tercom Aided Navigation System, and anti-ship missiles with inertial guidance. The Standard SM-2MR Block 4 surface-to-air missiles with command/inertial guidance remain at the centre of the Aegis system. Both Tomahawk and Standard missiles are fired from two Lockheed Martin Mk 41 vertical launch systems.

These things are floating Armageddons.:firedevi:
 
The problem with a stagnated, constant politico/military conflict like this, especially when a country is bullying a smaller, less defensible country, is that there will be repercussions to both the sparring parties and any benefactors. One of those problems is that China's now going to be looking for ways around those two destroyers. As a deterrent, sure, I'd watch my back if I were trying to assault a blocking force like that. But as I said, tensions are going to escalate as the firepower escalates.
 
I think they bought all four of them from Fleet. They are upgraded to almost new condition. The anti-sub systems surpass most of our bigger destroyers because of being designed to run quiet.
 
bulldogg said:
The US should not ever sell first class weaponry like the F-22 or F-35 or a SSBN to the Taiwanese for the simple reason that there is a VERY credible chance of peaceful reunification and then guess who has got their hands on the most advanced weaponry the US produces? Yeah. ;) Backing Taiwan was a cold war gambit and in light of bigger and more dangerous fish I am all in favour of a "catch and release" scheme for this troublesome little island with its gangster elite and complete lack of respect for the rule of law both domestic and international.
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I got it, we will go back to how things were in the 50's when the US was prepared to let China have their way with Taiwan, the only catch for China is that they will have to give up on North Korea, since it was Chinese intervention in the Korean War that is the basis for almost all US-Taiwan Defense pacts.

As for the Kidd's saving Taiwan, I doubt it, they will be as advanced, if not more, than anything China has in their arsenal but against hundreds or even thousands of air craft China would be throwing at Taiwan they are essentially ineffective, they will be able to pack a punch but it will only leave a bruise, not break anything.

Now, if we were to give Taiwan a couple destroyers or cruisers with Aegis it would be a different story, since they have the capability to track and engage hundreds of targets at the same time.
 
I am of the firm opinion this island is not worth it.

I've been there, dealt with the people both on and off that rock and they deserve China. Just my opinion... but they are in fact using the US and drawing us into something that most definitely smells like a Hyde Park dunny. The Taiwanese are known internationally as the most corrupt and incorrigible businessmen anywhere. Smugglers and poachers in business suits the lot of them. The PRC and Taiwan are a match made in heaven, let them sort it out and stay out of it is my advice.

If two criminals were beating the crap out of each other would you risk getting stabbed or shot to break it up? I say stand back, let them sort it out, don't let any bystanders get hurt, send the loser to the morgue and take the winner to jail.
 
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I'm probably about to be neutered but, I think there would be no war if both sides just said, "okay, it's over" and became PRC. The mainland and Hong Kong deal worked out fairly well and I think Taiwan would be received in the same manner. Except for what's left of the Formosans, everyone on Taiwan is Chinese with the exception of tourists and business people.
 
Rabs said:
I just dont see why we dont give/sell them a SSBN. Then they have a nuclear deternt, problem solved.
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Yeah I thought about that too (actually, I thought about the US giving South Korea nukes), but then you could have a domino effect of nukular armament (Japan, Indonesia, Myanmar may start wanting some)
 
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