Anti-ship missile danger to the us Navy supremacy?

[EagleHammer]

http://www.rense.com/general59/theSunburniransawesome.htm

I recomennd someone reading this, any one agree.?

 

[A Can of Man]

Any weapon is a danger. But there will always be ways to get around this as well. If you think a type of missile made from current generation technology would be threat big enough to take the US navy out of the picture, you're having a laugh.

 

[rock45]

technology

I read it and it's interesting but the article leaves out a lot of important facts which aren't covered. The technology used in the first Gulf War in 1991 to combat Scuds has improved. The US Navy missile defenses have improved as well I do think they are threat, any anti-ship missile is threat and should be treated as such. The technology to see and pick up Iran's preparing these and other missiles greatly improved which is the key. I assume US Naval assets in the area have targets pre-planned as well and in minutes can launch as well. I can't prove it but like to feel that US Navy assets can jam some of these missiles as well. Let face it US technology generally figures out most of Russia's weapons and technology, I think US forces will do well here to. I'm not saying no missiles will get through but not the hundreds and hundreds this article talks about. Large portions of these Iranian launching sites will never have the chance to fire twice. Mainly judging by most Middle Eastern nations I don't feel Iran has hundreds and hundreds of trained personnel to fine targets under heavy jamming, armed the weapons, and fire these weapons. I feel Iran's defenses are on or about the same level as Syria's and the Israeli's and US would have little trouble dealing with that. I think the situation will change quickly when weapons start hitting them on a wide spread level. It's a difficult subject to disgust because you don't know all the facts involved or even basic who has what and where. US Armed Forces aren't going to announce where and how many different weapon platforms are pointed at Iran. It's like a Friday night in a big city you never know how many cops are on duty, but there's more then you think.

 

[A Can of Man]

Just exactly how many different kinds of soviet weapons have promised that they could match or surpass American equipment just to get their clocks cleaned time and again?

 

[rock45]

Soviet weapons have promised

I agree very few have lived up to the hype the one that comes to mind that is close is the Su-27 family. Again missiles, radar, and jamming, still not as good I rather be in a F-15C with AESA radar and keep the fight at mid range.

 

[mmarsh]

Yes but in the Sunburn's case its no idle threat. Its deadly.

 

[rock45]

Deadly

Is it deadly or is that what the Russian makers say it is? Were not going to to say in public if we can or can't stop it. I'm sure it's dangerous all anti-ship missiles are but would US Navy risk putting two carrier task forces in the Gulf if we couldn't work with it a little?

 

[A Can of Man]

mmarsh, none of the Russian hardware is idle threat. Just that in war they have normally been on the losing side (militarily).
I'm sure it's a great weapon. If the USN kinda walked into it unprepared I guess it would do a lot of hurt but again, who's to say the USN will play to the missile's strengths?

 

[major liability]

One or two are not that big of a threat, but what if they launch a swarm of anti-ship missiles? I strongly doubt you'd be able to intercept more than a few of them.

 

[senojekips]

If the Russkie's strategy is to exploit our weaknesses, I'm sure that our strategists have worked out a game plan that will ensure that we don't present our weaknesses (we keep our endangered assets out of harms way and use alternative means to achieve our end.

In the meantime the old battle goes on,.... we develop fleas to infest their dog, e.g. a suitable anti missile defence. I'm sure our technology can match that of the Russkies???

 

[A Can of Man]

It's just typical "COULD THIS BE THE ANSWER TO AMERICAN IMPERIALISM???" hopeful and wishful thinking.
As for launching thousands at the US navy ships... well what are the odds that these ships will be in the range of at least five hundred of these launchers? How many of these launchers will there be in total? The cost of setting up something like that would be enormous and you're going to have to get it out of some other part of the military... say the Army or Air Force. That will lead to other weaknesses available to be exploited.
It's like saying the new Sukhoi series of aircraft are so good that the United States will no longer have air superiority. Utter rubbish.

 

[Guardsman_Ca]

Never under estimate the opposition.:wink:

 

[A Can of Man]

America's weaknesses lie elsewhere. Currently, technology isn't one of them although with the Chinese improving like crazy it may be ten or fifteen years down the road.
We've heard about these Russian "wonder weapons" that will reign death on Yankee imperialists for ages.
The greatest threat to the US military is still the grenade, basic explosives and the AK-47.

 

[wrc_619]

I can't say exactly what the warships have, but thye've got defenses. When it comes down to it, we just don't give up. There is a laundry list of ships that by rights should have sunk, but came back to fight, the most notable being the Cole and the Samuel b Roberts.

 

[mmarsh]

I can't say exactly what the warships have, but thye've got defenses. When it comes down to it, we just don't give up. There is a laundry list of ships that by rights should have sunk, but came back to fight, the most notable being the Cole and the Samuel b Roberts.

What people don't realize is that the SunBurn is a cruise missile designed specifically in the 1990's to sink U.S Carrier Battle Groups. This is not a conventional AS missile like the Soviet Navy workhorse the AS-12 'Kitchen' or even the French 'Exocet' or our own 'Harpoon'. This is something totally unseen before. It flys at MACH 3, which means it can reach its maximum range (65 Miles) within 2 minutes. Not only is it faster than any other anti-ship missile in the world its also faster
than any anti-ship system currently available. It fly so fast there isn't even enough time to jam it. let alone launch a SAM or use a gun system.

 

[Easy-8]

a 22. LR round is a threat to your supremacy but that doesn't mean it is likely to be sinking a Nimitz Class Carrier anytime soon.

 

[Rabs]

What people don't realize is that the SunBurn is a cruise missile designed specifically in the 1990's to sink U.S Carrier Battle Groups. This is not a conventional AS missile like the Soviet Navy workhorse the AS-12 'Kitchen' or even the French 'Exocet' or our own 'Harpoon'. This is something totally unseen before. It flys at MACH 3, which means it can reach its maximum range (65 Miles) within 2 minutes. Not only is it faster than any other anti-ship missile in the world its also faster
than any anti-ship system currently available. It fly so fast there isn't even enough time to jam it. let alone launch a SAM or use a gun system.

That is just simply not true after reading through numerous "sink a carrier" threads over at defense talk, with responses from people that work in the defense industry for a living.

I will give link to thread through PM if wanted but here is an exchange between a member and an pretty well known expert.

i still believe the best bet are sunburn missiles or Yakhon missiles. americans do not have the ability to shoot these missiles down let alone india. how ever in order launch these missiles many other indian navy ships must be sunk or disabled because i'm guessing that they won't just be sitting there as pakastan gets close enuf to launch such an attack

gf0012-aust: absolute bollocks.

the USN has trained against supersonic threats for the last 8 years (public declaration - but has been longer) In fact they have used russian missiles as the test beds (KH-31's).

The KH-31's were modified by Boeing and found to be inadequate to simulate sunburns and have been replaced.

At the last series of supersonic tests, 49 out of 50 supersonic launches were intercepted successfully.

The US was running supersonic ship strikes in 1958 - so the issue of how to counter them has been undertaken since then.

Just some more

Name 1 country that is capable of surging 250-500 strike platforms and able to penetrate a battle dispersed screen to a depth of 500km before being able to get to the centre of gravity of that fleet. Ans = 1 (if they're lucky). Even they (the Russians) have a fleet that is estimated to only have 20% of it's active penanted fleet seaworthy, and has an airforce that is progressively being sold off to India as they need the money. They won't sell off supersonic strike bombers and anti-shipping specific aircraft to China as they mistrust them. Out of all the platforms they have that are capable to go the distance and attempt to break the screen - well, they have less than 20 of them in total. They were even at the stage where last year they were prepared to lease Tu-142's to the USN so that they could practice swarmed strikes. They've been selling their missiles to the US (KH-31's and rumour has it some Sunburns) to act as Supersonic targets. China is not even a 10th of the capability of the Russian current ORBAT in capability. India arguably is better at AS roles than China in current capability and platform potential.

The US has spent 20 years training against supersonics (why some people think that a supersonic cruise is a new invention is beyond me

). The only navy and airforce that had the capacity to surge and swarm were the Soviets in the halcyon days of their navy and airforce - and even their post cold war documents indicated that they believed that less than 5% of their platforms would break the screen - let alone get the capital targets.

Hell I've even intercepted a few back in my Jane's Fleet Command days.

 

[wolfen]

I can't say exactly what the warships have, but thye've got defenses. When it comes down to it, we just don't give up. There is a laundry list of ships that by rights should have sunk, but came back to fight, the most notable being the Cole and the Samuel b Roberts.

I don't know too much about the small boys, but anybody that thinks he's gonna sink a Nimitz class anytime soon is a fool. I can't say what the defense system is but a friend of mine who was a FC2 told me once during the gulf war that nothing would be coming near us anytime soon So I'm not holding my breath. Don't know about the Sam Roberts, but the Cole was a cowardly attack.

 

[major liability]

So basically, the only counter to a carrier group remains a tactical nuke?

 

[wolfen]

Well, yea maybe, all Nimitz class are supposedly capable of surviving a nuke attack as long as its not a direct hit.