Your view on the Terri Schiavo case

Charge 7 said:
The Washington Post is a notoriously extremely liberal leftist newspaper. If you think that's "balanced" you're more delusional than I thought.

This is what Strongbow said:

I don't think the wide spread use of "living wills" is going to stop the US religious right from trying to pull a stunt like this again.

So tell me where you could get any other conclusion from that than he's stating it was all setup by the religious right?

You want me to comment on Bush's role? I thought I did when I said that the right and the left had gotten mileage out of it. If you want me to expand upon that then fine. Bush did what his beliefs told him to do. Could you fault him for being more involved in it when his brother was at the heart of it all? Family stands by family - surely even in Australia. That's what Terri's family did too of course.

Oh, and is "liberal" a bad word then? I use words like "conservative" too as well as "right" and "left". You have a problem with that? Would you rather I said "the good guys" and "the bad guys" as you seem to think is the proper teminology?

If you think George Bush got involved purely for family and personal beliefs then I consider that delusional ( a word you seem to be able to use and get away with) . Please expand on this.

I agree with Strongbow that the pro-lifers and the religious right took full advantage of this poor family's situation.

Your lack of comment about the treatment of Judge Greer by the pro-lifers and religious right is a big concern. Do you think he had it coming?
 
You are of course entitled to your opinion, just as Strongbow is.

You did not read (or chose to ignore) where I did say that the religious right had indeed gotten mileage out of this case as did the the liberal left for that matter.

The US is not, however, a nation of polar opposites. Most of us exist somewhere inbetween. This was a landmark case and cut across the spectrum. To say that it was only driven by the religious right is excluding the vast majority of Americans who were quite interested in it whatever their political viewpoints.

You also seem to have missed entirely my personal interest in it. When you have had a family member in such a situation, you can grasp this controversy much clearer than somebody just listening to the media.

Oh, and where was I required to comment on Judge Greer? As for whatever situations he has come to since this ruling I am against the mistreatment of anyone by anybody for any reason.
 
i think now would be a good chance to put this topic to rest, as was mentioned further up, this thread is like the taiwan issue here;

a lot of people are very passionate/involved in the topic and no one is going to change sides...let it go
 
i think now would be a good chance to put this topic to rest, as was mentioned further up, this thread is like the taiwan issue here;

a lot of people are very passionate/involved in the topic and no one is going to change sides...let it go

Hear, hear and thank you, Chewie.
 
She did fine at least until her "husband" removed her feeding tube. I mean the guy is living with another woman AND has had 2 kids with her.
Thats a lot of kids for not being married at ALL.
 
That dirty :cen: bastard didn't care about her, he just wanted the money. And his attoureney, Felos, was a maniac. He thought he could think something and ta da it would be there. So I thought of the F-16 that would be sitting in the driveway when i got home and BLAM! it wasn't there.
 
Charge 7 said:
The Washington Post is a notoriously extremely liberal leftist newspaper. If you think that's "balanced" you're more delusional than I thought.

This is what Strongbow said:

I don't think the wide spread use of "living wills" is going to stop the US religious right from trying to pull a stunt like this again.

So tell me where you could get any other conclusion from that than he's stating it was all setup by the religious right?

You want me to comment on Bush's role? I thought I did when I said that the right and the left had gotten mileage out of it. If you want me to expand upon that then fine. Bush did what his beliefs told him to do. Could you fault him for being more involved in it when his brother was at the heart of it all? Family stands by family - surely even in Australia. That's what Terri's family did too of course.

Oh, and is "liberal" a bad word then? I use words like "conservative" too as well as "right" and "left". You have a problem with that? Would you rather I said "the good guys" and "the bad guys" as you seem to think is the proper teminology?

So, you think Bush did it (with the help of Tom De Lay) for purely family reasons. Thats got to be delusional.

As John Danforth said recently, the Republican party was being transformed into "the political arm of conservative Christians".

I think the alarm bells are starting to ring for your "lame duck" president. He is going to need all the defending he can get from "anti-liberals" like you from now on.
 
I'm not an anti-liberal. Actually, many times I've supported causes that were spurred by the liberal side of the political spectrum. I've stated time and time again that I am an independent voter. And no, I don't support everything Bush has come up with. Social Security comes quickly to mind. Politically I'm something of a moderate. I don't care for extremists in either camp. I do not just go right down the middle though. I lean to whichever side is making the most sense at the time and offers the most constructive solutions.

It may interest you to know that Vermont's senior US Senator, Patrick Leahy, is my neighbor and a friend. He's also very much a Democrat. I've voted for him in every election. I've also voted for our now retiring Senator Jim Jeffords who was long a Republican before becoming an Independent - had he chosen to run again, I still would've voted for him - despite hardcore Republicans reviling him for briefly taking away their majority in the Senate. While he was our Congressman he came to my family's rescue during a very dark time indeed. He'd always have my vote.

My support for George Bush in this is simply the view of someone who gets the idea of "family". The President's brother was up to his neck in a very heated issue. I would have been shocked if he hadn't come to Jeb's support.
 
Ok, thats good to know.

Sorry to hear about your Brother's history. I don't know how your family has stood up to that sort of worry and pressure.
 
Thank you Strongbow. I appreciate that alot.

All I could think of during the Terri Shiavo case was "what if my brother's wife had still been around when he was on the ventilator?" and I thanked God they were divorced. His ex is such a self-centered person I'm fairly certain she'd have pulled the plug.

I and my four siblings represent the national statistics for marriage - three divorces and two that have endured for decades. I've been blessed with another chance and it looks like my sister may be too. Our brother never will again. That's just one of many things he's lost. He's fortunate though to have children who love him and look forward to seeing him in the home he lives in now. His eldest has grown up a great deal for her scant 13 years. I'm hugely proud of her.

The prognosis is that my brother will continue to improve - how much can't be known. He'll never be 100% again that's certain, but he could do much better. Certainly the will is there. He talks about wanting to drive his car again (a nice sports car) everytime I visit him. He's gotten past using the walker now to get around and can walk for short stretches with a cane - this after we were told he'd never walk again. My sister told me not to tell him that but I did anyway and I reminded him that doctors had told our father the same thing after his wounds from WWII. You should have seen the fire in his eyes! A look passed between us that said quite clearly I had said exactly the right thing.
 
According to the liberals who insisted apon her demise, she was "euphoric" as she was starving to death. They said it was the most peaceful and happy she'd been in fifteen years.
 
i would think being dead is better than being a plant, same as any girls would die in gas chambers than being a jap sex slave

just my 2 cents :?
 
I will let this thread continue, but I would advice everyone to be very careful about your replies in general since this is a very sensitive issue.

thanks. :)
 
The trouble with these sorts of cases is that there is no way to know whether the person who is comotose is every going to wake up or not, whether the person with the legal rights is a filthy bastard or not. There is an endless list of cases that I've encountered that are like Charge7: the experts said your loved could never ever wake up, 0% chance, etc, etc. Then the person wakes up anyways. Charge7's family's experience is not unique on that score.

So how do you make policy on a matter where the experts have been proven wrong too many times to count?
 
My .02¢

I think that a human life is too weighty a choice for anyone to make the decision of other than the individual. All people should be encouraged to make living wills at say, about the time you get your driver's licence. If a person has no living will then the decision should always be for life - the spouse and family both having no say. It's too much for anybody other than the individual to be saddled with that kind of choice. I know for my own family we agonized over it a great deal. In the end we decided that our brother's soul came here without our intervention and so it would have to leave this world without it too and we prayed that he would be returned to us. We aren't overly religious people - none of us are frequent church-goers, but we all believe in a supreme being. Without our brother having made the choice, it could only be God's.
 
Husband is a ????????!

I think the hussband is a :cen: and had alot to do with her death. No way do I trust that guy and I think he's in a similar boat as O.J.Simpson. They both got away with killing there wives I think.
 
Re: Husband is a ????????!

Mr.Rooster said:
I think the hussband is a :cen: and had alot to do with her death. No way do I trust that guy and I think he's in a similar boat as O.J.Simpson. They both got away with killing there wives I think.

:?
 
The thing one should look at is the quality of life. Would you like to just lay there year in and year out with out being able to communicate your thoughts or needs. With modern medicine and modern surgical equipment they can keep people alive for countless years. A few years back nature would have taken these people a long time ago, are we keeping them alive because we can, should any one in hospital that is on their way out be connected to this equipment to keep them alive in vegetative state, if it can be done for one then why not every one. Lets face it if you kept an animal like that you would have all sorts of protesters around telling you just how wrong you are. Personally if I got that state I wish some one would come along with a needle and put me to sleep just like my old dogs. Just small injection and you have gone in about 5 seconds
 
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