Originally Posted by Whispering Death

Adam - That is my point exactly, they should be fielding the XM8->M8 because we are long overdue for a new rifel.

Button - Is that what is holding up the OICW? I haven't heard anything about it since the XM8 started making waves, All I know is that our infantry can't wait till' 2012 for some pie in the sky weapon.

I live don Ft. Belvoir, Research and Devlopment. The guy who lived nexted door was a R&D guy, Tony Bremmer, I knew his son. He showed me the Land Warrior System and the XM8, there still being tested.

Originally Posted by Whispering Death

Adam - That is my point exactly, they should be fielding the XM8->M8 because we are long overdue for a new rifel.

Button - Is that what is holding up the OICW? I haven't heard anything about it since the XM8 started making waves, All I know is that our infantry can't wait till' 2012 for some pie in the sky weapon.

My amature understand of the OICW was that it was simply too bloody heavy; and a fair bit too complicated for the Infantry man.

Originally Posted by Pogue

M9 Beretta 9mm. I want the 1911 .45 back

Me too.

Originally Posted by r031Button

My amature understand of the OICW was that it was simply too bloody heavy; and a fair bit too complicated for the Infantry man.

I agree with Button 100%. The XM8 and land warrior system may look good on the Discovery Channel. Proximity munitions, data read outs tracking etc. But the techies at R&D ALWAYS forget the first rule of the Infantry " If something can fail. It will." and the 2nd Rule K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple Stupid.)

Currently very few problems such as failures to feed, failures to fire etc need the assistance of an armorer or tech to make the weapon function and keep the rifleman in the fight.

Keep it simple is the best way to explain it. I have argued on this site about how ignorant it would be to give everyone optics on the battlefield. They are great without mud, dust, rain snow and all the other crap that is actually present or happens during combat. I could really see performing a combat swim and hoping I could see through my optics while swimming onto the beach or better yet, all the "wiz bang" electronics working while full of water. I am not against technology, it is what I do for a living now, but I am against technology for a grunt that only makes it more difficult for him to complete his mission. I want my pointman to look for enemy, not reboot his weapon because it vaporlocked!

Anyone think maybe the FAMAS? I have never shot one, so Im not going to point any accusations. However, i have read some field reports ( possibly biased) of how completely ungangly it is to use.



Or how about the Lewis gun, ( not trying to pick on the french) issued by the french during WWI . It was the one that had a slit cut in the magazine so you could see how many bullets you had left, i THINK that was the Lewis gun, not sure. It kinda looks like a bren gun almost. Anyway, that dandy little slit just did wonders for a gun in the muddy trenches of France. Troops said the jam rate was ATROCIOUS. I read one report that claimed 1 - 50 shots jammed. Though im sure thats a LITTLE exaggerated.

The topic is currently issued weapons. If we're talking past, I'dhave to bring up the Ross rifle, a target rifle issued to Canadian troops during WW1.

It wasn't the Lewis gun. That was the Chauchet your talking about.

Yeah the Lewis gun was used with great effect during both the air war and trench warfare during WW1.

The M1 thompson was one kick ass weapon. It seems to be more powerful that the submachine guns we have today, with a drum mag, you can go Mafia or kill some Neo nazis. The M14 was a good rifle also but not good with firing full auto because its a freakin plain old rifle not an aasault rifle. Its meant to be semi. Not to meant it was pretty hefty. Yah anyways back to the topic ,we're talking about the WORST CURRENT ISSUE. I can't say much about the M16 since I've only fired a 5 clips both in semi and auto, but I heard that if you use the RIGHT KIND of ammunition it would greatly reduce the jamming. The lead in a bullet can drammitcally affect its functioning because too much lead can cause overkill to its bolt system. Now how about the m9. I can say something about this because I've fired it quite a few times, its not the 9mm bullet, but the pathetic gun itself which was made by not the US but the former Axis italians. After firing a 57 rounds and being aciddentally dropped into some sand I tried firing it but the gun sound as if had no more bullets left which is strange because the slide didnt go back and made that *click* I pull the slide off and saw that it was fine, but was unchambered, then I check the mag and the spring was jammed by a some sand. Whe I took the bullets out the spring was just plain stuck and it became bent easily. I can tell that this pistol didn't have the reliability to be in the military, more like civilian stuff.
The US should try replace the berreta back to the good ole SIG SAUER PISTOLS. Sure it costs a tad bit more, but its worth it!