but hell what a lesson to guys used to actually treat women like shit to see a girl keeping a man like a dog, or seeing some of them lining up while a girl aims at their balls with her hands pretending she's shooting.
After all those guys lives spent humiliating women that's good afterall. I happened to think about that last night while watching tv. I do not agree with violence if not necessary but don't feel any shame about certain humiliations to some sunni thugs.

Well,as we all know there is a certain rule about treating the POW's,and again as we all know no body is sticking to it.It wasn't brought just formally but,they should putt this guys in iraqi prison with iraqi guards under us supervision,and non of this would happen!!

As I said earlier, we are indeed dealing with a couple of psychos in uniform given more power than they should have gotten and/or having lacked direct supervision...
It is wrong and they should pay!
What concerns me is that the issue has been placarded in the media (ours!) longer than the US mutilated bodies hanging from a bridge for example! Were was the domestic and INTERNATIONAL outcry than?
What were our dear elected officials saying at the time, from all sides of the political spectrum. Anything strong and enlightening anybody remember? Did we demand AL Sadr resignation and AL JEZEERA to say "I am sorry" for stirring anti-US hatred?
I love to tell americans (French too, by the way!) that there is a name for people that enjoy a good "self whipping" session like that: VICTIMS!!
What a bunch of fat and self destructive crowd we became....fast food, fast media, fast war...please, don't show me pain or cruelty, starving kids in Bengladesh, machete murders in Nigeria, corpses burned in tires in South Africa, cannibalism in Congo....I cannot handle it....I am a Britney-Barbie-Disneyland-tree hugger person! Can't we all go along?

Come on...that shows the power of a couple bearded men in robes over modern democracies: Spain withdrew its forces after the trains were bombed in Madrid and eventually, Rumsfeld is going to be let go when the ugliest pixs and the well anticipated videos (rape &, group masturbation according to German news) will surface.
They also announced today that the first American psycho will be court martialed in IRAQ with live coverage from Arab media ...and Saddam hasn't even been indicted for the chemicals and the wood chippers!!!
I think Rumsfeld should be tried there too! (nota: that is a joke to make my point!!!)
Does it sound right to any of you?

Eric, while I agree with much of your post - why call these soldiers Psycho? That term hardly fits, but is more akin to Hussein's former regime thugs. Let's not join the media in being overly dramatic or comparing some of these soldiers actions to that of murderers.

I find it strange they are starting with an E-4. Last I heard E-4’s do on run the show. And a female PFC running amuck and causing untold havoc among the prison population just doesn’t seem factual.

As a former senior NCO and current Officer I’d sure like to know what the hell the leadership was doing when Pvt Shitforbrains and SP4 Buckethead were single handedly trashing the prison. This does not cut it with me. For all you civilians reading this; Army Pvt’s and SP4’s do not go to the latrine without someone senior knowing.

It’s quite apparent the military went after those that are too stupid to defend themselves as someone they could place on the chopping block as quickly as possible. This is a showboat if I have ever seen one.

In other words, this is pure b******t.

Originally Posted by Eric

I think Rumsfeld should be tried there too!

Why, exactly?

What needs to happen is the immediate chain of command needs to get relieved, there is no way I can believe that some junior enlisted got away with all of that with no one higher knowing within hours, if not minutes.

It is b******t but very seldom do we, the public get to see the Officer side of the punishment. I am confident that Officers are being investigated however, this showboat actually boils down to a few people that admitted doing these things for nothing other than amusement. They were targets in the open. As for the leadership, I HAVE to be confident that they will, too....get their day in court but as you know, Officers are treated with "career protection" where an enlisted is not. I have seen Officers prosecuted but it is a very hush hush thing. IN this case, I do believe they will find a "goat" and butcher them for all eyes.
And Eric. I do not believe Rumsfield will be tried. He will be questioned, he will be maligned...but I dont hold him responsible in any direct fashion. If he has directly appointed the Officers in charge of POW detainment, he will be tried. We will see a star or two relieved of command.

When I said I think Rumsfeld should be ried too, I meant it as a joke to make a point1
As far as the use of the "psycho" word, I do believe these guys/girls got carried away by something far beyond than the simple call of duty Mod Edit: Let's not discuss proper interogation techniques or even allude to what may be SOP. ..The leashes, the piling, the masturbation ...I am not sure about that! Actually I have a problem with that and the fact that the "breaking" of the prisoners was given to unlisted personnal and not to professionals! What was that female prison admin doing in the jail at night with her lover and naked Iraqui prisonners but taking a power trip?

No-go on officers getting hanged in private. Most are being given "career-ending" reprimands. Sorry, but if they aren't making big rocks into little ones, then our military justice system is failing.

Originally Posted by RnderSafe

I think we are agreeing on this...but "career ending reprimands" dont impress me much.

Originally Posted by Redneck

Why, exactly?

What needs to happen is the immediate chain of command needs to get relieved, there is no way I can believe that some junior enlisted got away with all of that with no one higher knowing within hours, if not minutes.

It's pretty obvious now that people very high up in the chain of command knew what was going on but turned a blind eye. I also think whilst shocking and sadistic the media probably are blowing some aspects of this out of proportion. A lot of the sadistic acts that have been exposed are part and parcel of psyhcological interrogation and warfare. They are not nice things to do to your fellow human beings but we are at war and war isn't nice at all.

However in saying that I think much of what is obviously going on is clearly out of order.