USAF in trouble? - Page 3

August 10th, 2008  
I am a former Marine, the fact on the ground is that due to BRAC USA, USMC, USAF and a few guys from the USCG are attending the same classes the USN has an office down the passage way oops hall. All 5 services are in the same building going through the exact same training, instructors are from all the services execpt the Coast Guard we only send students.

Common MOS schools are already combined such as Army 92 Lima you will find AF, Marines, and Army personnel going through the same exact training.

The instructors feel that this is an atttempt to get the troops ready for unification. I don't like it any more than anyone else but it is happening. Unification of the armed services will start in logistics and support functions that have not yet been contracted for some reason.

Let me say as a former Marine myself I don't agree with the policy or even begine to understand it and I will be retired before I see it in practice.

I do agree that aviators are very different but they are not all bad I have to work with them every day and I actually like some of them.
August 10th, 2008  
The Army, Navy and Marines have always shared MOS schools at least for the last 25 years.

MP's Army/Marines (except for the laspe of judgement in the mid 80's when Marines went to Lackland)

Army/Marine Artillery

Army Marine Tankers

Army/Marine Parachute Riggers and All Airborne Billets

Marine/Navy Aviation- Only makes sense Carriers and all.

Army/Marine Engineers

Army/Marine specialty schools BAC-Ranger- MFF etc.

Army/Marine Ordanance and Weapons repair.

As well as others I'm forgetting. The USAF is reading way too much into the interservice cooperation that has been going on for years and that they are just discovering. Above all and all that.
August 11th, 2008  
Let's hope your right. They seemed pretty sure of themselves.
August 11th, 2008  
Look at it this way Senior Chief. The AF is lost in the sauce in a war like this. They are restricted to Tac air and CAS. The insurgenets and the Taliban have no MIG's to shoot down and no major formations any more to Arc -Light. They are reaching for missions. When Zoomies reach for missions they try to glom on to everyone elses. Then they begin to believe they have the answer.
August 11th, 2008  
A Can of Man
Originally Posted by Sukio
I don't think so, even in the Air Force I bet their are some still hardliner indivuals (seasoned NCOs, Experianced Officers). Those individuals will shed some disicpline on their subordinates and maybe their collegues.

That's a big assumption and I think you might be wrong.
Attempts on improving discipline can be met by extreme hostility by the lower ranks.
August 12th, 2008  
Originally Posted by c/Commander
It's got to be a discipline thing - it's certainly not a general lack of training. Aviators have always been more lax than personnel with other designators, maybe that culture in the Air Force has been taken a little too far.
Aviators are different that is true perhaps a bit of a superiority complex, I am a sailor myself but an now stationed at a place where I deal with aviators all the time. And have had heated debates with them in the Wardroom.

Before this job I have now I had never talked much with aviators and really had little use for them. We used to call them SLEB for SELF LOADING EXCESS BAGGAGE. I considered the Helo Det to be a pain in the A$$ and was always happy to see them leave the ship.

I have learned to tollerate their existance.
August 13th, 2008  
The Other Guy
Maybe if it didn't take 20 years to get a plane in service (i.e. the F-22) this wouldn't be a problem.

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