Israeli terrorism - the first Minutes of Gaza Attack - Page 5




 
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January 3rd, 2012  
VDKMS
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostrider
Yes, I remember, I tried to be funny, with a minor success. In my point of view, the problem (Israel/Palestine/the area) we need to change focus from what happened in the past, we can learn from the past (hopefully, it does not happen so often) and use the knowledge to come up with comprehensive solutions/suggestions. It will never work with an approach of you did! No you did! Things like that are not so constructive. I am extremely critical toward Israel sometimes and likewise I am extremely critical toward the Palestinians sometimes. The Flotilla to Gaza could have been handled differently. However, I am not critical toward the IDF soldiers deployed on the ships, I am critical toward the people that placed them there
I think the solution might be this one, I'll quote a earlier post of mine. (About How Would You Solve the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict? Page 18 #171)

Quote:
Another angle.

The last discussions became more and more extreme, like exremists from both sides unwilling to compromise. Tit for tat arguments leading to nowhere. Thanks to MontyB I started my research again in finding solutions. One interesting link I found was about the memoires of Condoleezza Rice, it showed that Olmert and Abbas were really willing to make a deal. Problem was the refugees. Abbas could not tell 4 million Palestinians that 5000 of them might go back. And it is quite obvious that a nation of 7.3 million people cannot absorb 4 million Palestinians. That's suicide. The same is true for Palestine. So instead of trying to find a solution at once, why not try it step by set, but not with negotiations but with cooperation. Building peace trough entrepreneurship.

Can Start-Ups Move Forward Israeli/Palestinian Peace?

BUILDING PEACE THROUGH ENTREPRENEURSHIP IN ISRAEL AND PALESTINE

Businessmen prefer an economical friendly environment. Israel or Palestine doesn't matter as long as the laws are in favor of their business.

One response to the article is interesting:

Quote:
Bill Kruse says:
October 8, 2011 at 11:30
One of the paths to comity between nations is economic co-reliance. The pragmatism of business is more likely to succeed than through what sadly is the all too often iconoclastic, egocentric posturing of professional politicians. Business relations devolve into personal relations. Parties come to recognize the “other side” is not comprised of sub-humans whose aspirations are alien to their own. Every sane human wants to live in peace and aspires to a better life for their children.
The potential for the existence of minority radical elements always exists. However, it is seldom that one nation launches rockets into another when the rockets destroy assets which are owned in whole, or in part, by the aggressor.
The initiatives described in Ms. Fedoryk’s article are heartening.
I had to redo the 2 links, because they didn't work in the quote.
January 3rd, 2012  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VDKMS
I think the solution might be this one, I'll quote a earlier post of mine. (About How Would You Solve the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict? Page 18 #171)



I had to redo the 2 links, because they didn't work in the quote.
I liked this/these suggestion(s) this could be a constructive step toward peace and stability
January 3rd, 2012  
Der Alte
 
No matter what side of the conflict you favor, the drama surrounding a Palestinian bid for statehood at the United Nations is a saddening spectacle. Even the most passionate supporters of the idea recognize that the U.N. vote will not bring about a Palestinian state, nor will it bring an end to the conflict between Israelis and Palestinians.

The chain of events that brought us to this moment required a series of uninspired, really, failed performances by the three principal players, the leaders of the United States, Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Heck of a job, guys!

Today, the three stand in most uncomfortable positions, with little control over what comes next. America has lost much of its ability to influence events throughout the region. Despite continuing efforts and entreaties, Washington’s word carries much less weight than it once did. The Palestinian Authority has almost accidentally built high expectations with practically no ability to deliver results. Lurking in the wings is its rival, the radical Hamas, governing more 1.5 million Palestinians, hoping the disappointment will help it pursue its ultimate goal of making the entire territory, including Israel, part of a rebuilt Islamic caliphate. And Israel, ever more isolated, is watching decades of painstakingly built relationships, the diplomatic armor of peace, crumble to pieces.

The surreal dimension of this exercise, the part that makes you rub your eyes to make sure it’s really happening, is that there is not much of a debate about whether a Palestinian state should exist. Israeli governments and most Israelis have for decades supported its creation. Palestinians don’t reciprocate. They don’t accept the existence of a Jewish state. But a Jewish state already exists. The question is how to establish one for Palestinians and how to put an end — forever — to the hostilities between the two sides. A vote at the U.N. is nothing but evidence that the real work to make this happen is failing.
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January 3rd, 2012  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VDKMS
A Palestinian poll (you know it because I posted it) showed that only 5,5% support your case of using violence against Israel.
Oh,... of course, everyone thinks that allowing Israel to go ahead with their genocidal policy will be the solution.

Where do you get this BS?

The actions of the Marquis also put French citizens in danger, but they were considered heroes never the less, and they were supported by those people they put in danger.
January 3rd, 2012  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by senojekips
Oh,... of course, everyone thinks that allowing Israel to go ahead with their genocidal policy will be the solution.

Where do you get this BS?

The actions of the Marquis also put French citizens in danger, but they were considered heroes never the less, and they were supported by those people they put in danger.

Guys,

Do not take this comment in the wrong way. No wonder why we have conflicts in the world.
January 3rd, 2012  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostrider
Guys,

Do not take this comment in the wrong way. No wonder why we have conflicts in the world.
Don't worry, I'm sure I understood his drift exactly, and I'd gladly bet real money on the fact that his information (disinformation) has been "sanitised" and approved by the Israeli propaganda machine.

It only stands to reason, that if it were even vaguely true we wouldn't be where we are. Policies and processes with approval ratings as low as 5.5% just don't get off the ground, or if by some chance they do, they are so ineffective as to be unnoticeable.

The type of racist rubbish he spouts must be an absolute godsend for the recruiters of groups like Hamas and Al Qaeda.
January 4th, 2012  
VDKMS
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Der Alte
No matter what side of the conflict you favor, the drama surrounding a Palestinian bid for statehood at the United Nations is a saddening spectacle. Even the most passionate supporters of the idea recognize that the U.N. vote will not bring about a Palestinian state, nor will it bring an end to the conflict between Israelis and Palestinians.

The chain of events that brought us to this moment required a series of uninspired, really, failed performances by the three principal players, the leaders of the United States, Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Heck of a job, guys!

Today, the three stand in most uncomfortable positions, with little control over what comes next. America has lost much of its ability to influence events throughout the region. Despite continuing efforts and entreaties, Washington’s word carries much less weight than it once did. The Palestinian Authority has almost accidentally built high expectations with practically no ability to deliver results. Lurking in the wings is its rival, the radical Hamas, governing more 1.5 million Palestinians, hoping the disappointment will help it pursue its ultimate goal of making the entire territory, including Israel, part of a rebuilt Islamic caliphate. And Israel, ever more isolated, is watching decades of painstakingly built relationships, the diplomatic armor of peace, crumble to pieces.

The surreal dimension of this exercise, the part that makes you rub your eyes to make sure it’s really happening, is that there is not much of a debate about whether a Palestinian state should exist. Israeli governments and most Israelis have for decades supported its creation. Palestinians don’t reciprocate. They don’t accept the existence of a Jewish state. But a Jewish state already exists. The question is how to establish one for Palestinians and how to put an end — forever — to the hostilities between the two sides. A vote at the U.N. is nothing but evidence that the real work to make this happen is failing.
As long as they do not trust each other a peace deal will be very difficult. I hope the Jordanian effort starts to bring trust back.

The situation is also very complex.
January 4th, 2012  
VDKMS
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by senojekips
Don't worry, I'm sure I understood his drift exactly, and I'd gladly bet real money on the fact that his information (disinformation) has been "sanitised" and approved by the Israeli propaganda machine.

It only stands to reason, that if it were even vaguely true we wouldn't be where we are. Policies and processes with approval ratings as low as 5.5% just don't get off the ground, or if by some chance they do, they are so ineffective as to be unnoticeable.

The type of racist rubbish he spouts must be an absolute godsend for the recruiters of groups like Hamas and Al Qaeda.
Palestinian Center For Public Opinion

If you think it is Israeli BS then check here

Poll No. 180
Nov. 02, 2011

excerpt:
Quote:
Resumption of the Peace Negotiations
Responding to the question: “In general, do you support or oppose the resumption of the peace negotiations between the Palestinians and the Israelis under the present conditions ?”, (16.0%) said “ I support”, (45.9%) said “between both alternatives” (they are undecided yet), (32.9%) said “ I oppose” and (5.2%) said “I don’t know”.

And asked to respond to the question: “Which of the following ways or options, according to your opinion, is the best for ending the occupation and establishing a Palestinian state: a) the negotiations up to the reaching of a deal between the Palestinians and the Israelis, (b) the non-violent resistance (peaceful popular demos), (c) working along with/ through the United Nations, (d) to hold an international conference that is authorized to impose a solution on all parties concerned, (e) violence, military actions, or (f) otherwise ?”, (17.6%) said “the negotiations up to the reaching of a deal between the Palestinians and the Israelis”, (20.9%) “the non-violent resistance (peaceful popular demos)”, (23.4%) said “working along with and through the United Nations”, (17.9%) said “by holding an international conference that is authorized to impose a solution on all parties concerned”, (5.5%) said “violence, military actions”, (10.5%) “otherwise”, and (4.2%) said “ I don’t know”.
January 4th, 2012  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VDKMS
Palestinian Center For Public Opinion

If you think it is Israeli BS then check here

Poll No. 180
Nov. 02, 2011

excerpt:
I still think that it's BS. I guess the persons polled did not wish to show their hand in a public poll, but put simply, the evidence on the ground makes a complete mockery of that which is in your quote.

As I said If it were even vaguely true we wouldn't be where we are.
January 5th, 2012  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Can we go back to the thread starter and the video. We can ignore the relability of using youtube like that. Even if we never reach a consensus about the Palestine/Israel issue. I enjoy never-ending stories ( I am sorry Redleg ). The video shows a triage of wounded and killed people. What do you actually see on this video?
 


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