India! - Page 3




 
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October 12th, 2004  
FlyingFrog
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by westwater
China is not comparable to India in military equipments.Indian have many modern weapon which chinese can not get.
But India can not challenge China in most aspects, include economy education and living level .
I don't know.

But honestly China is aiming at USA, no one else. It may take some years, but we WILL put USA behind us

Like this in OG:
http://www.southcn.com/sports/star/l...996_410798.jpg
http://sports.tom.com/img/assets/1/tian109_2.jpg
October 13th, 2004  
godofthunder9010
 
 
Total focus on one competitor only is prolly not the best way to do it. If China is only focussed on the USA, they might miss something important elsewhere.

India is behind China in most aspects, but they are developing pretty fast. Truth be told, a war between the two would not be easy on either side. Also, the mountainous border would put the attacker at a serious disadvantage.
October 16th, 2004  
Argus
 
Quote:
FlyingFrog wrote :
By "won" what does it exactly mean? Does it mean India conquered some lands from Pakistan or something others? I don't know too much about those 3 wars, but I did hear about them.
Infact India and Pakistan have faced each other in the battle grounds on Four occassions (to be exact not Three).

In 1947, 1965, 1971 and 1999 (Kargil Conflict).

In 1947 (First Indo-Pak War), Just after 2 Months after the independence of both the nations, Pakistan attacked Kashmir (then a separate Entity), Kashmir then took to Indian side as it was more moderate country. This caused India to retaliate and drive the pakistanis back.


In 1965 (Second Indo-Pak War), Operation GIBRALTAR, as the Pakistanis called it, was a brilliant plan. It was the brainchild of Maj. Gen. Akhtar Hussain Mallick, the GOC of 12 Infantry Division in Azad Kashmir area. According to the plan, hundreds of trained Azad Kashmiris would be infiltrated into the Kashmir valley, then recruit locals and incite them to rebel against the Indian Government.

At the time of the rebellion, vital points like the airport and the radio station would be seized and Kashmir would declare its 'Independence' from India. This way Pakistan would get Kashmir into its fold without resorting to major conflict. The plan was bold and daring. and accordingly hundreds of guerrillas infiltrated into Kashmir on August 5th, equipped with arms and explosives and organised to fight on the lines of Mujahid forces. For the plan to succeed, the Pakistanis relied on the support of the local population, and to their dismay the Kashmiri people remained steadfastly loyal to India, and thus the brilliant plan failed.

This snow balled into a full scale war all alone Western Indo-Pak Border and finally on on September 23rd 3:30 am ceasefire was brokered between the two by UN.At the time of the ceasefire India was in possession of about 710 square miles of Pakistani Territory. In turn it had lost 210 square miles of its territory to Pakistan. Most of this was in the Chamb sector.

After the Tashkent Declaration on 10 January 1966, both sides agreed on an immediate exchange of Prisoners of War (POWs) and withdrawal of troops to positions held before August 5th, 1965.


In 1971 (Third Indo-Pak War) Liberation of Bangaladesh, Pakistan was originally made up of two distinct and geographically unconnected parts termed West and East Pakistan on the either side of India. Although the Eastern wing of Pakistan was more populous than than the Western one, political power since independence rested with the Western elite. This caused considerable resentment in East Pakistan. The dawn of 1971 saw a great human tragedy unfolding in erstwhile East Pakistan. Entire East Pakistan was in revolt.The Pakistani Army conducted several crackdowns in different parts of East Pakistan, leading to massive loss of civilian life. The details of those horrific massacres, in which defenceless people were trapped and machine-gunned, is part of Bangladeshi (then, East Pakistan) history. Survivors compare it to the Nazi extermination of Jews.This led to the exodus of more than 8 million refugees (more than half of them Hindus) to neighbouring India. West Bengal was the worst affected by the refugee problem and the Indian government was left holding the enormous burden. Repeated appeals by the Indian government failed to elicit any response from the international community and by April 1971, the then Indian Prime Minister, Mrs. Indira Gandhi, decided that the only solution lay in helping Bengali freedom fighters, especially the Mukti Bahini, to liberate East Pakistan, which had already been re-christened Bangladesh by its people.

Pakistan felt it could dissuade India from helping the Mukti Bahini by being provocative. The Pakistan Air Force (PAF) in East Pakistan took to attacking suspected Mukti Bahini camps located inside Indian territory in the state of West Bengal.Confident that another war would be as much of a stalemate as the 1965 Conflict, the Pakistanis got increasingly bold and finally on 3 December 1971 reacted with a massive co-ordinated air strike on several Indian Air Force stations in the West. At midnight, the Indian Prime Minister Mrs. Indira Gandhi in a broadcast to the nation declared that India was at war with Pakistan.

This again turned out to be a all-out war between India and Pakistan. Finally on Dec 16 The Pakistani forces in East Pakistan have surrendered formally to the Indian Army. The surrender was signaled by the signing of the surrender document by Lt Gen A A K Niazi, the Army Commander of all Pakistani forces in the area. 95,000 Pakistani soliders surrendered and were treated as POWs (later release). India imm. declared East-Pakistan as Bangaladesh a new independent country as per the will of people of East-Pakistan.


1999, (Fourth Indo-Pak Low intensity war - Kargil War) The terrain of the Kargil and surrounding regions of the LOC is inhospitable in the best of times. Some of the characteristics of the region are jagged heights of up to 18,000 feet and harsh gusts of wind and temperatures plunging to about -60 degrees Celsius in the winter. There had existed a sort of "gentleman's agreement" between India and Pakistan that the armies of either side will not occupy posts from the 15 September to 15th April of each year. This had been the case since 1977, but in 1999 this agreement was cast aside by the Pakistani army in hopes of trying to gain the upper hand in Kashmir and plunging the Indian suncontinent in brief and limited war and raising the spectre of nuclear war.

The Intruders on the heights were an amalgam of professional soldiers and mercenaries. They included the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 12th battalions of the Pakistan Army’s Northern Light Infantry (NLI). Among them were many Mujaheddin and members of Pakistan's the Special Services Group (SSG). It was initially estimated that there were about 500 to 1,000 intruders occupying the heights but later it is estimated that the actual strength of the intruders may have been about 5,000. The area of intrusion extended in an area of 160km. The Pakistani Army had set up a complex logistical network through which the intruders across the LOC would be well supplied from the bases in POK (Pakistan Occupied Kashmir). The intruders were also well armed with AK 47 and 56, mortars, artillery, anti aircraft guns, and Stinger missiles.

The Indian Army detected the intrusions between May 3-12. From May 15 - 25, 1999, military operations were planned, troops moved to their attack locations, artillery and other equipment were moved in and the necessary equipment was purchased. Indian Army’s offensive named Operation Vijay was launched on May 26, 1999. Indian troops moved towards Pakistani occupied positions with air cover provided by aircraft and helicopters.

Pakistan issued statements condemning India's counter attack and falsely claiming that the fighters were the mujaheddin and or Kashmiri freedom fighters. Pakistan also falsely claimed that the Line of Control separating the two sides was not clearly defined. This was false as the line of control was clearly delineated by the two sides in 1972. Pakistan tried to use kargil as a way to project the Kashmir conflict as a potential nuclear showdown thereby encouraging international intervention that might favor Pakistan. Similarly, Pakistani leaders visited China, an ardent ally, to shore up support for their cause and simulataneously pressure India. However much of Pakistan's diplomatic overtures failed, despite early sucess. The world saw proof of Pakistani army involvement in Kargil. India likewise tried to use the international media to make its case known. India was sucessful in showing the world that the Line of Control was clearly delineated and both sides possesed copies of the maps. Second, India demonstrated that the Kargil conflict was orchestrated and executed by the Pakistani army working with the Mujaheddin. Indian restraint and limitation to restrict the operations to Kashmir, allayed fears that the conflict would spiral out of control and result in nuclear war. It sucessfully thwarted Pakistani attempts at "nuclear" blackmail. The ultimate triumph of diplomacy occured as Pakistani Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif travelled to Washington D.C in early July to negotiate a settlement of the conflict. At this time, defeat of the Pakistani occupying forces seemed assured as Indian armed forces had taken back almost all of the peaks in their respective sectors. The only remaining occupied peaks were the ones closest to the Line of Control, where Pakistani artillery fire could provide cover to the invaders. In a negotiated settlement, Pakistan decided to withdraw its troops from the remaining locations in a set time frame.


Thus India technically won all the wars.
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October 16th, 2004  
Bharatiya
 
Welcome to the boards Argus!

I had completely forgotten about the 1965 war. What a shame! Anyways, that was a very good detail account of all the Indo-Pak wars.
October 17th, 2004  
FlyingFrog
 
Thanks for sharing the info.

How do you think the Kashmir issue can be fixed?

If there will no compromise between the 2 countries, then Kashmir will always be the focus of trouble.
October 9th, 2008  
RAZPOR135
 
well let me tell you that China has also occupied some part of J&K(about 30'000sq km) .It was actually given by Pakistan to china as it was diificult for them to hold all of,it,....so, wat you get does Pakistan really want Kashmir..idon't think so...they just want a new issue to go on war with India.
a country like Pakistan which is not sure it can protect it, doesnt deserve to get Kashmir.
April 7th, 2014  
JOC
 
 

Topic: Sino-Indian border dispute


There was -is still contested territory in the mountains separating China and India. In 1962 the Sino-Indian War was fought in these areas. An agreement to resolve the dispute was concluded in 1996. In 2006, the Chinese ambassador to India claimed that all contested area is Chinese territory amidst a military buildup. At the time, both countries claimed incursions as much as a kilometer at the northern tip of Sikkim. In 2009, India announced it would deploy additional military forces along the border.
April 11th, 2014  
LeEnfield
 
 
It should be remembered that both these countries have nuclear weapons and ICBM to deliver them. Any future war could be a disaster Now if the Taliban took over in Pakistan then god help the west.
April 12th, 2014  
AirForceGenius
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingFrog
Indian airforce is modern and powerfull, can be said in Top 5 in the world.

Indian Navy is growing strong too, in Top 6 no doubt.

Indian land force is OK, some with very good equips some not.

Give India another 10 years, they will be Top4 or Top5 in general militarily.

Pakistan:
Pakistan does not worry too much about India, their president said:
If Pakistan is invaded, they will nuke the invaders, so safety gurrantted.

Indian people are good people.

India's airforce at the moment is a JOKE. They are seriously poorley disaplined or trained and have a low standard of intake which leads to many many air crashes.

Sure they have a few planes but none of them are cutting edge just old joe planes from the cold war like the SU-29, not a chance against an F-22 or a Eurofighter typhoon.

5th airforce in the world either goes to Eygpt or Britain.

i would say india is about 8th.

India has a decent navy but once again in lack or modern equipment that the worlds moving on to. They are depending on a new carrier which is nothing in comparison to what america or Europe are building. Have you seen the Gerald.R.Ford i would say india is about 7th, underneath Italy, Britain, France, Russia, China, US
April 14th, 2014  
MontyB
 
 
How exactly can you compare things that will never go head to head.