How is More Less ? - Page 5




 
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Boots
 
April 7th, 2015  
brinktk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
You are a combat veteran before you went into combat what did you do?

Did you prepare as best you could for what you were going to face, think through your actions etc. or did you just get up in the morning and think "Yay I am invading Iraq today" and run off towards Baghdad with a packet of Doritos and a rifle under your arm?

Men and women need to realise life is a struggle from start to finish and it is up to the individual to primarily get themselves through it and then pull those around them through as best they can it is not about living in each others pockets until you cant stand each other any more and going through some acrimonious court case.

So my answer to your questions is, you plan for success and failure, you analyse every situation and you do what is right for you and if it goes wrong you adapt and move on but this applies to everyone.

Which means yes you get an education, you get a job and chances are you will work until your bones fall out but realise you will make mistakes so learn from those mistakes and stop repeating them time after time and for the love of what ever deity you want to back stop trying to blame other people for the mistakes you make just make the right call for you and move on.



Exactly although you have to analyse the situation to realise you have a nutcase or loser.



Here is another option how about going through life being yourself rather than molding yourself to the personality of those you are trying to impress, if a relationship is going to work it will be because of who you are not who you are trying to be this week.

That is precisely the point. Everyone needs to be taught to plan for these things because this is reality. I don't know where you found in anything I said that I am finger pointing. Identifying the problem, yes. Allowing that problem to win, absolutely not.

I don't think I EVER said that people won't make mistakes and shouldn't learn from them. I actually think that men, as a whole, are learning from the mistakes of others and themselves. That it is a minefield out there and are making a perfectly logical conclusion to forgo that game altogether.

That's why, as I am observing here at my university, young males are simply avoiding women altogether. They know a simple accusation will get them expelled at the very least and sent to prison at the most. Even if they are exonerated in the end, recovering will be difficult. Meanwhile, there are signs all over the campus stating "Don't be THAT guy" or "MEN, It isn't okay to rape"...as if we are cavemen that need to be reminded of that. They have learned that if they protest this, a proverbial shit storm will arise and they will either be shamed into compliance or they will be threatened with expulsion once again...(not to mention the raving lunatic gender studies majors throwing gasoline on the whole thing with claims of rape apologist or misogynist). And this is in Oklahoma...I can't imagine how it is on the coasts...

That is called planning for it. They can't win either way. Times have changed and I'm not sure if older generations are in the know about these things. This IS happening and it isn't just flooding into academia. It is flooding into the workplace, and even into the military. (with a recognized backlash from the rank and file in the Army about the whole thing and a surprisingly reasonable response from the Army leadership recently acknowledging this backlash). So...they are simply walking away until the world comes to their senses...going on strike I suppose. A perfectly rational response.

More of this is being pushed, it is simply a matter of time...
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vp8tToFv-bA"]Feminism and the Disposable Male - YouTube[/ame]
April 7th, 2015  
MontyB
 
 
It seems to me that your argument is "can't win, don't try" but the fact is as you have pointed out the way to win is simply not to take part and men are apparently adopting that tactic.

We are not disagreeing that a problem exists we seem to be disagreeing on the solution and I am saying that it is up to males to step in and stop the rot (even if it is by simply avoiding relationships) and I am not really sure what your solution is.
April 7th, 2015  
Yossarian
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
We are not disagreeing that a problem exists we seem to be disagreeing on the solution and I am saying that it is up to males to step in and stop the rot (even if it is by simply avoiding relationships) and I am not really sure what your solution is.

You have to have that American Mentality to see how things normally work out in our society.

In the U.S. historically most problems get ignored until they reach critical mass, look at slavery, civil rights, the women rights movement, WW 2, and the War on Terror.

So with that, after this new generation of men passing off marriage and home building means social expectations and legal laws binding marriage itself are currently lagging about 20 years behind.

It will take time, in the meantime, I don't know if I can ever be willing to please a woman with today's expectations of servitude, so I am going to take care of myself and my family and stay out of trouble.

And will I sleep soundly every night doing it just like I do now. Welcome to America.
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Boots
April 7th, 2015  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yossarian
You have to have that American Mentality to see how things normally work out in our society.

In the U.S. historically most problems get ignored until they reach critical mass, look at slavery, civil rights, the women rights movement, WW 2, and the War on Terror.

So with that, after this new generation of men passing off marriage and home building means social expectations and legal laws binding marriage itself are currently lagging about 20 years behind.

It will take time, in the meantime, I don't know if I can ever be willing to please a woman with today's expectations of servitude, so I am going to take care of myself and my family and stay out of trouble.

And will I sleep soundly every night doing it just like I do now. Welcome to America.
I don't have to have an American mentality for anything because the same things happen here but to blame women for the problem is wrong because it is men that not only gave up power but also happily reversed the roles.

If things are to change then it is males that will have to reclaim equality how they do it is irrelevant and not taking part is simply a valid tactic to achieve this.
April 7th, 2015  
Yossarian
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
I don't have to have an American mentality for anything because the same things happen here but to blame women for the problem is wrong because it is men that not only gave up power but also happily reversed the roles.

If things are to change then it is males that will have to reclaim equality how they do it is irrelevant and not taking part is simply a valid tactic to achieve this.

"The tables have turned since Henry VIII. The ax no longer falls on the ex-wife's neck, it falls on the assets. There's no blood, but something even worse: lawyer's ink.
"

Well for us here stateside I don't see men taking the public slamming shaming for men marching on Washington for men's rights...

Here in the States, Divorce is an industry too, and once something is commercialized then it's almost impossible to change it, especially with so much momentum riding behind the industry.
April 7th, 2015  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yossarian

"The tables have turned since Henry VIII. The ax no longer falls on the ex-wife's neck, it falls on the assets. There's no blood, but something even worse: lawyer's ink.
"

Well for us here stateside I don't see men taking the public slamming shaming for men marching on Washington for men's rights...

Here in the States, Divorce is an industry too, and once something is commercialized then it's almost impossible to change it, especially with so much momentum riding behind the industry.
Then don't buy into it, cant get divorced without first getting married and as with most industries if no one is using your product then you go out of business pretty quick.

I have not personally encountered any of these issues marriage wise so far we have survived 12 years by being very independent people and not trying to merge into one hideous personality, I have encountered these issues at work but I am a confrontational sort of person and find that being direct usually stops these issues before they start (never try and sort it out with the person always go direct to management and ensure that it is properly looked at).
April 7th, 2015  
brinktk
 
 
I think we ARE agreeing then. I'm saying that lack of participation is a valid tactic...the alternative is revolution which I don't think anyone wants.
April 7th, 2015  
Yossarian
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinktk
I think we ARE agreeing then. I'm saying that lack of participation is a valid tactic...the alternative is revolution which I don't think anyone wants.

Agreed, the more I think of things the more nervous I get, for now biding time and keeping a clean nose will never hurt.
April 8th, 2015  
Kesse81
 
The differences between men and women are clearly reflected in our environment, in the family and society - and it is here that we must work to eliminate their unfair and harmful crystallization into rigid stereotypes and prejudices.
We canīt really in a precise way talk about women and men in general. Each of us is human before we are "man" or "woman". And each of us - man or woman - has roles and functions to perform, individually and socially. This is where the differences begin.
We may all equally choose to play different roles. This is man's free choice. I believe in man's superiority over its gender.