This Gitmo Bullshit - Page 5




 
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Boots
 
June 25th, 2005  
CSmaster
 
the reason is this:

U.S is the one always telling others to be humane to prisoners, to give fair trials, to protect human rights

now ppl all laughing at U.S because americans have not lived up to their own principles

It is normal for criminals to commit crme, but it will be a big irony if a police commits the same crime, right?
June 25th, 2005  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by soldierzhonor
You've got to admit, this is somewhat humorous if you look at it in perspective. Countries pressurizing America because someones room temperature wasnt adequate? Or how about the complaints of being in prison awaiting trial for what was it? 4 years? Rap music? Where is this international pressure on the countries who kill candidates during elections? How about any unity against nations who imprison their people based on religious beliefs? Why not pressure them? I can understand the pressure against forcing people to listen to rap music...lol. Why choose Gitmo out of all the worse prisons in the world? People actually turn their views against the US because of 2 prisons? Thats like saying "I'll never go on a plane ride because they always crash". The pressure on the US is still hard to grasp considering some of the things that go on in the world.
I really don't think underplaying or overplaying things is looking at things in perspective:
You make light of the ttemperaturething simply saying it wwasn'tadequate and I would agree that 1-10 degrees either side of normal is probably not an issue but if you are talking the difference between freezing and boiling then it is an issue.

You seem to be saying that 4 years awaiting trial is no big deal however I would suggest it is "if" you are innocent.

Quote:
Why choose Gitmo out of all the worse prisons in the world?
Because it is a prison where the inmates have not actually been charged or convicted of anything, they are not POW's and apparently they are not criminals they are simply in a state of limbo, now I accept other nations have similar prisons but I can almost gguaranteethat those nations have already had their human rights record questioned by the world including the US.

On the other side of the coin I really don't think too many people care what happens to "actual" terrorists my recommendation is a gram of lead behind the ear all people seem to be asking is to finish the process and either convict them or release them.
July 1st, 2005  
bulldogg
 
 
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L28309310.htm

Whether he's lying or telling the truth it is going to get air time and piss people off in muslim countries. Why keep it going? There can be nothing good come from the continued operation of Camp Delta. It is giving fuel to the fire.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/Wa...110152-ap.html

At least one now has been tried now and found not guilty in the country where he was accused of breaking the applicable laws.

There is also another recent story I cannot access on VOA pertaining to Camp Delta.

Chinese Internet Firewall.
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Boots
July 1st, 2005  
Missileer
 
 
I couldn't help but notice this part of the post.

"But some Muslim fundamentalist Kuwaitis oppose the U.S. military presence in the country. Militants have attacked Americans in Kuwait several times since 2002, killing one U.S. marine and a civilian contracted to the military.

Scores of young Kuwaitis have fought alongside Muslim militants in Afghanistan, Bosnia, Chechnya and Iraq."

If he's caught again, the same type of defense will be provided by Kuwait and the cycle will start again.
July 1st, 2005  
Redneck
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulldogg
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L28309310.htm

Whether he's lying or telling the truth it is going to get air time and piss people off in muslim countries. Why keep it going? There can be nothing good come from the continued operation of Camp Delta. It is giving fuel to the fire.
Why? Because we do not bow to the demands of our enemies. If we were to cave in to these demands, think of the message we would be sending; that if there is something the extremists don't like about how we operate, all they have to do is riot and kill a couple people and we'll change to suit their wishes. Also, we are gaining valuable intelligence from those held in Guantanamo Bay, as well as keeping them "off the streets" so to say.

Quote:
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/Wa...110152-ap.html

At least one now has been tried now and found not guilty in the country where he was accused of breaking the applicable laws.

There is also another recent story I cannot access on VOA pertaining to Camp Delta.

Chinese Internet Firewall.

You seem to have missed the reason for his aquittal:

Quote:
None of the alleged crimes took place in Kuwait and they were not punishable in Afghanistan at the time they allegedly were committed, according to al-Shimmiri.
He was aquitted because Kuwait had no legal jurisdiction, and the old Taliban government did not see whatever acts he committed as crimes, which is not saying a whole lot considering what they were openly doing themselves.

Not the best argument against the legitimacy of the detentions.
July 1st, 2005  
bulldogg
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
If he's caught again, the same type of defense will be provided by Kuwait and the cycle will start again.
I would definitely agree with you on that one. Does anyone know why he was returned to trial in Kuwait and not to Afghanistan since this was where the crime he was charged with was to have occured?
July 1st, 2005  
Redneck
 
 
I would imagine it is because he is a Kuwaiti citizen, and the crimes he committed were not considered crimes in Afghanistan at the time they were committed, I do not know Afghani law, but I would imagine that would throw a wrench in the works for the prosecution.
July 1st, 2005  
bulldogg
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redneck
... the crimes he committed were not considered crimes in Afghanistan at the time they were committed,...
How do you break the law when there is no law to be broken?
July 1st, 2005  
Redneck
 
 
That's most likely one of the reasons he was detained by the U.S.; he broke international law/engaged in terroristic activities/what have you. So we rolled him up, but as far as national law goes, I don't think that he can be charged successfully with committing an act that under the new government is a NATIONAL crime but that under the government existing when that act was carried out was not considered a crime by that government. Same general principle as the Nazi war criminals, the heinous acts they committed were not criminal under Hitler's government.
July 1st, 2005  
Italian Guy
 
 
Number 1: Article 4 of the GC describes a context: "provided that they act according to the rulesand costums of war". they never did, so article 4 does not apply.

Number 2: International Law. If it was for that Saddam would be still mass-murdering his own people and thanks to International Law the genocide in Sudan is not considered to be a genocide.

Hence: the US should verify that its own constitution is respected. Now where and how does Camp Delta infringe the US Constitution? What has the Supreme Court say about that?

(how many people are detained in Gitmo? are they all from Afghanistan? What percentage of them has had a trial so far?)