Dutch war on Terror?

November 8th, 2004  

Topic: Dutch war on Terror?

Recently the great grand nephew of Vincent VanGogh was killed for making an anti-Islamic film. He was shot and stabbed by an Islamic radical as he begged for his life on a street in Amstrerdam. The perpetrator was apprehended after a shoot out, and eight others were later arrested in connection with this.


What I want to know is, what is the concensus of the population in Holland about this? You hear the Dutch Government and alot of people making all kinds of talk about taking tougher measures against Radical Isalm, but will they really?

The thing is most of Holland is very liberal oriented, its hard to see them get tough on stuff like this. The reason I'm saying this is (if I'm not mistaken) an anti-Islamic activist was killed there years ago by radical Islamist without anybody doing much of anything.

Also will the Dutch finally take a stance and see the USA was right on the war on terror? It would be nice to get some in-country pespective since I don't live there in the land of tulips and wooden shoes.
November 8th, 2004  
A bomb went off at an Islamic school today as well In the Netherlands, nobody injured, but a clear sign that radical Islam, as I have always believed, is gradually replacing it's traditional enemies (Jews and Christians) with today’s secular European societies.
November 8th, 2004  
Were the Jews ever the enemies of secular European society? I know the Nazi's hated em? But they sure are anti-Israel, and very pro-Palestinian, maybe now they'll realize they sided with the wrong crowd?

As far as the other stuff it seems like the Dutch are getting p----d off. Any Dutch people out there can tell us more.
November 8th, 2004  
About 5 Muslim moskes or buildings are attacked too yesterday. There are over 1 million Muslims living in the Netherlands, where the population is about 15 million.
November 9th, 2004  
I have a hard time not to see more of this radical agressions amongs civilian targets in this part of Europe. The older generation amongs the fundamentalists have tried to hold the hatred towards everything that is considered as western ideology, freedom of religion, tolerance, coexistence down, but time changes. Have anyone read religion in school? What we see today is the younger generations growing dissatisfaction with this freedom of religion. For not to many years ago I heard that religious persecution of jews in France was on the menu again by Islamic fundamentalists.

Problem with Islam in general is that it can only be one world religion or you will die by the sword. Convert or die. I have a hard time to see any Islamic movement to be tolerant. I know what Muhammed did when he returned to the very same city he was banned from in first time. When he returned all other religions in that city was condemn and erased and I dont want to know what happend to those who did not accept this new world order when he returned with his army.

Any crack pipe liberal oriented I think we can love everybody political correct person will die by the sword or convert in the next 50 years. Maby the convert process is the new liberal view of the future tolerance? The new fundamentalist movement in Europe is stronger then ever and the word tolerance will be something you will find on stone boards in the Algerian desert = Pic any desert when this is over.

This is the future rather you want to except it or not. This is the price of our lac of vision. and we will all have to pay for this. Am I radical you say? Well return to me in 15-25 years and tell me that I was wrong and we will see who stands in the corner with the cone hat and the left thumb in mouth for an hour. That is if we still are alive that is. Holland has announced that there will be new laws and restrictions for the Islamic Imans. All preaching will be conducted on the Duch language in the future. Well Holland may be liberal but they are no idiots thats for sure, unfortunately I think this comes to late to be honest.

It is a good time for people to wake up and toss this utopia dream in the garbage and see the reality I think. This is if not only the beginning and you can wait and watch for yourselfe. I just take out the rubbish from the closet rather if you like it or not. Holland is a very nice country and it is a loss to see freedom and common sence in our mening being killed of one by one just because of a little group very liberal wet dream thinking people. Well what they think and loved to see is it nothing wrong with, but Im sorry to say that the world is not working like they want it to work.

Look in to the history. There is always a paus in every war. I do understand all the people that say, but we have lived as neighbours in generations? Well I say take a good look at the Balcans and learn from this history or read first chapter in Tom Clancys Red Storm Rising, I believe that the author have catched a genuine fundamentalist in action. I would love to see more tolerance in the world, but some people can just not handle that type of freedom and live with it, before it was a battle in the desert. Today it is a battle that will take place in our own gardens. I am looking forward to see Vincent VanGogh´s movie and may he find rest.

You do not run over egg shells and expect that they wont crack.

- My piece of mind


November 9th, 2004  
i think that terror well infected Europe by now,its just the matter of time when and where will it show its face
November 9th, 2004  
Now see this is a genuine problem we have here.

A person was murdered because of his views, in the West by the Arabs. Who do they think they are? And are they really so dumb to not see that they're spitting in their own bowl?
I hope that the Dutch government takes firm and decisive action to protect it's (peaceloving) citizens, and makes an example out of these pricks.
I'd say close/burn down the mosques, after all you don't see a Christian church in the Middle East do you?
That'll teach'em and if not that, then cattle cars and a one way ticket to wherever they came from.
This is a bit rude I know but how can you compete with such hate which has the power to kill someone just because he has exposed an inferior status of women in the Arab society?

This makes me so mad, I'm a liberal at heart...but this...this is too much, we give them a good job, welfare to some, (better) education, good conditions to live in and this is how they repay us?

If I'd be president of Europe I'd say to the moderate ones that they sort the radicals out themselves or else...oneway ticket for all or worse.
*sorry, got a bit emotional*
November 9th, 2004  
A Can of Man
Absolutely spot on Doc S.
I also think the previous generation had troubles showing some levels of intolerance because of the Nazi history. Anyone who is obviously right wing in Europe is often slandered as a Nazi.
Also people don't realize everything happened for a reason. The values we hold and traditional habits we have all started because of a reason. Over the generations we simply forget why they are there perhaps because the habit was so effective at eradicating the problem we no longer had a grasp of what the problem was, nor the scale of the problem.
Our incredible level of tolerance, openmindedness etc. were in a large part a display by our generation trying to prove we are "better" than the previous generation. However, especially now with the growing social problems in our countries in developed countries, and also with the advent of radical Islam, our new approach to life, society and culture is being severely put to the test.

The problem is not our lack of tolerance. It is their lack of tolerance. Tolerance must work both ways. If it works only one way, and the intolerant one's power is significant, what you have is merely surrender and defeat.
November 9th, 2004  
Italian Guy
We are having a main focus on whats going on now in the Netherlands with Islam. The most multicultural society in Europe, shining example of the "European" way to tolerance, has proved uncapable of dealing with the clash of cultures. The clash between us and them is not concealable now.
November 9th, 2004  
The most multicultural society in Europe, shining example of the "European" way to tolerance, has proved uncapable of dealing with the clash of cultures.
Not sure if you mean clashes among ALL cultures, since in the Netherlands there are many many different cultures living here, most can coexist with each other without ANY problem, and quite nice to see them among each other.