80 M1's destroyed in Iraq - Page 4




 
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April 7th, 2005  
godofthunder9010
 
 
I think that Vietnam is an effective comparison in a way. We went into Vietnam without the slightest clue how to deal with nonconventional warfare, and we never were as effective as we could have been against the VC's unorthodox tactics. And that comes into play in this situation when we consider the M1. It was designed with conventional battles in mind, and less consideration was put into dual-use against guerilla warfare tactics. We sortof fall back into the same thing over and over again: Planning equipment for a fair fight and not worrying about every contingency.

It wouldn't be a bad idea to take a page from Israel's book and build a tank with a bit better protection. The Leopard II and Merkava both have implemented mine protection and other urban-warfare considerations went into their design. Mine protection should be included in any future MBT design I would think. Even in a convetional battle, that is one less vunerability. It would take a certain amount of redesigning on the M1, but if you have vunerability, I can't see why you wouldn't want to fix it.

It would be interesting to see what can be come up with for a purely urban version of the M1a2. Yet I have to wonder if a MBT is the best possible answer for the needs of urban warfare? Then again, what would be the idea armored vehicle with urban combat as its primary purpose?
April 9th, 2005  
bushpig1998
 
 
The abrahms was never designed for urban combat and it's gun is complete overkill for the role. If there were other tanks around, I'd say go for it. Maybe an Abrahms chassis and turret, but with a 30mm Gatling gun form the A10. Should make very light work of anything on the ground - as well as other armoured vehicles.
April 9th, 2005  
Kozzy Mozzy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bushpig1998
The abrahms was never designed for urban combat and it's gun is complete overkill for the role. If there were other tanks around, I'd say go for it. Maybe an Abrahms chassis and turret, but with a 30mm Gatling gun form the A10. Should make very light work of anything on the ground - as well as other armoured vehicles.
The 120mm gun is acutally quite good for urban combat. What else are you going to use to blow buildings apart?
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April 9th, 2005  
FO Seaman
 
 
The M1A1 was made with long range tank battles in mind, hence: Main Battle Tank.

The M1A2 SEP was made with a little bit more urban warfare in mind.

Combat is always shifting and reshaping, in 1940's it was long and medium range battle, 1960's was medium to short range combat, 1980's long range and massive armies, 2000's urban warfare.

Not only that but no M1 has ever been totally, utterly, destroyed in combat. And a M1 chassis with a 30mm is not an anti-infanty or anti-personnel weapon, plus it has 2 tons of recoil and that would rip the gun turret of the chassis, thats overkill. The Bradley has awesome anti-personnel/infantry capabilities, 25mm Chain gun, M240-D coax, M240-B AA gun. The M1A1 and M1A2 SEP are great in urban combat, 120mm, M240-D coax, M2 and M240-B AA guns, the HEAT-MP-T are used to take out buildings, so are the HEAT-T.

The M1 is still a good MBT.
April 10th, 2005  
Boobies
 
 

Topic: Hmmm


Think a M1A1 equip with several Gatlin Guns (Six Tubes) instead of 120mm canon would do good in Urban area?
April 11th, 2005  
C/Cpl. Chirico
 

Topic: Re: Hmmm


Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobies
Think a M1A1 equip with several Gatlin Guns (Six Tubes) instead of 120mm canon would do good in Urban area?
Dunno, still at a disadvantage due to its size and lack of manuvering capability in tight spaces.
April 13th, 2005  
FO Seaman
 
 

Topic: Re: Hmmm


Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobies
Think a M1A1 equip with several Gatlin Guns (Six Tubes) instead of 120mm canon would do good in Urban area?
Gatlin gun is what they used during the Civil War. A Vulcan Cannon is what they use now. A 12x7 or 20mm is not a good urban combat weapon.

The M1A1/A2 SEP is now armed with the XM1028 Canister round for anti-infantry use.

A small caliber minigun like the M134 wound be nice, but ammo jamming and the possiblity of overheating are always a problem and the gun can't be fired remotly due to the possibility of hydrulics jamming when hit and damage to the gun.

Now this is outdated but somthing like this cound be used.



The M163.
April 13th, 2005  
Charge 7
 
 
Quote:
Gatlin gun is what they used during the Civil War. A Vulcan Cannon is what they use now.
It's still called a Gatling Gun.

http://www.f-106deltadart.com/20mm_gun.htm
April 13th, 2005  
AlexKall
 
That above gun look like a gatling gun to me?

Check:

Cluster of barrels: Yes
Fired in a sequence: I presume that as a Yes
Cluster is rotated: Yes mingun cluster barrels spinn in a clock vice (seen from the front of the gun) rotation, quite fast too. Or is it anti clock vice? I think its clock vice
April 13th, 2005  
AlexKall
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charge 7
Quote:
Gatlin gun is what they used during the Civil War. A Vulcan Cannon is what they use now.
It's still called a Gatling Gun.

http://www.f-106deltadart.com/20mm_gun.htm
Beat me too it

Weired type of cammo, or is it the black and white thats confuzing me?