What's your mind about my country? - Page 6




 
--
Boots
 
December 10th, 2014  
brinktk
 
 
I have some questions about Iran.

What would happen in Iran if a citizen spoke openly against something the government did wrong?

What would happen if someone wrote an article that criticized the political apparatus in Iran.

What would happen to a group of people that assembled to talk about problems they see in their own country(Iran)?
December 10th, 2014  
crazytanker
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinktk
I have some questions about Iran.

What would happen in Iran if a citizen spoke openly against something the government did wrong?

What would happen if someone wrote an article that criticized the political apparatus in Iran.

What would happen to a group of people that assembled to talk about problems they see in their own country(Iran)?
I do believe, good sir, that the answer is the same for all three questions. However, I suspect that you already know this. Would I be correct in that?
December 10th, 2014  
brinktk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazytanker
I do believe, good sir, that the answer is the same for all three questions. However, I suspect that you already know this. Would I be correct in that?

Patience, I want him to answer it. I want him to tell me what would happen.
--
Boots
December 10th, 2014  
moxen
 
 
Thank you all.
December 10th, 2014  
moxen
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by -- Dusty
Looking at everything you have said here, I’d have to say that you’re not in Iran, not from Iran, you're not Islamic, you’re not even an adult.

Grow up and get a life punk.
0_o . . . So who am I?
December 10th, 2014  
moxen
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinktk
I have some questions about Iran.

What would happen in Iran if a citizen spoke openly against something the government did wrong?

What would happen if someone wrote an article that criticized the political apparatus in Iran.

What would happen to a group of people that assembled to talk about problems they see in their own country(Iran)?
The answer isn't easy. It's not as simple as what will happen to someone that will study holocaust in france.
I'm not happy with the circumstances in my country.
In the years after Revolution we had a unstable Gov and our security organizations were working like Savak something badder than eastern Germany. After Rafsanjani the khatami Goverment changed many things. And we try to make an open society. But "Might is Right"! Who has power uses that to silencing his opposites such as your country and such as everywhere else.
But our law isn't so complicated. Talk against the existance of government isn't Expected. Talk against islam is a crime. Talk against something wrong that's occured isn't a crime but if mixed with lie or insult it's a crime. And if you're related to MKO or other terroris Groups everything you said can be used against yourself.
December 10th, 2014  
brinktk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by moxen
The answer isn't easy. It's not as simple as what will happen to someone that will study holocaust in france.
I'm not happy with the circumstances in my country.
In the years after Revolution we had a unstable Gov and our security organizations were working like Savak something badder than eastern Germany. After Rafsanjani the khatami Goverment changed many things. And we try to make an open society. But "Might is Right"! Who has power uses that to silencing his opposites such as your country and such as everywhere else.
But our law isn't so complicated. Talk against the existance of government isn't Expected. Talk against islam is a crime. Talk against something wrong that's occured isn't a crime but if mixed with lie or insult it's a crime. And if you're related to MKO or other terroris Groups everything you said can be used against yourself.

That brings forth the point I want to make.

In the west, we are able to talk against our government and even assemble against our government through protest. There is also a blue print within our constitution to force governmental change through either peacefully, or violently if necessary, if it is the will of the people. I can give two examples of how the people can control the actions of the government, Vietnam and Syria. During the Vietnam war, the massive protests here in the US forced the government to a point where they had to pull out of that country because the intensity of the protests escalated almost to the point of revolution. Also, last year when the president was suggesting he was going to openly strike against the Assad regime, the massive public backlash against that decision forced him to back off.

We can openly speak out against any religion or we can practice any religion we choose. We have the choice. As long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of any other person then someone could hypothetically worship Darth Vader if they wanted to. However, in order to ensure there is no preference by the government of one religion of another, the government cannot officially or unofficially endorse ANY religion. Again, this is a check on potential persecution against any citizens individual rights that are guaranteed by the constitution.

In the US, the idea of "might is right" is usually vehemently pushed back against because there is an understanding of what happens when that thought process prevails. Again, we are not perfect and we don't proclaim to be perfect. However, the tools to rectify any problems we have are guaranteed by our constitutional rights that the government cannot infringe upon. If they do, then we have an appeals process that allows for any circumstances of unconstitutional behavior to be reviewed and if it is deemed unconstitutional by whatever court is reviewing it, the original determination will be thrown out.

I can call any government member, including the president, a complete and total idiot to their face and there is absolutely nothing they can do to me legally speaking. They also reserve the right to call me one too.

I can post whatever thoughts or ideas I have online, in the paper, or through any source of media and people are free to determine if it makes sense or not on their own. Those same people are free to counter my thoughts with their own arguments in whatever open forum of their choosing and it is again guaranteed by the constitution and bill of rights.

Therefore, I think we are fundamentally talking about two different things with two different sets of cultural values at play. I believe this will cause us to talk past each other instead of addressing the issues at hand.

P.S. again, it doesn't help when you say you want us to fall under your belief system or when you say my children need to pay in blood for what is happening in your part of the world. I think I understand what you mean, but that does not mean I am not going to violently protest ANYONE trying to hurt my children. I'm sure a fathers rage and willingness to kill for their child is much the same over in Iran as it is here in the US.
December 10th, 2014  
crazytanker
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by moxen
The answer isn't easy. It's not as simple as what will happen to someone that will study holocaust in france.
I'm not happy with the circumstances in my country.
In the years after Revolution we had a unstable Gov and our security organizations were working like Savak something badder than eastern Germany. After Rafsanjani the khatami Goverment changed many things. And we try to make an open society. But "Might is Right"! Who has power uses that to silencing his opposites such as your country and such as everywhere else.
But our law isn't so complicated. Talk against the existance of government isn't Expected. Talk against islam is a crime. Talk against something wrong that's occured isn't a crime but if mixed with lie or insult it's a crime. And if you're related to MKO or other terroris Groups everything you said can be used against yourself.
"If mixed with a lie or insult"... Who determines this? Also, what is the consequence? I'm sure it's not just a slap on the wrist?
December 10th, 2014  
moxen
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinktk
That brings forth the point I want to make.

In the west, we are able to talk against our government and even assemble against our government through protest. There is also a blue print within our constitution to force governmental change through either peacefully, or violently if necessary, if it is the will of the people. I can give two examples of how the people can control the actions of the government, Vietnam and Syria. During the Vietnam war, the massive protests here in the US forced the government to a point where they had to pull out of that country because the intensity of the protests escalated almost to the point of revolution. Also, last year when the president was suggesting he was going to openly strike against the Assad regime, the massive public backlash against that decision forced him to back off.

We can openly speak out against any religion or we can practice any religion we choose. We have the choice. As long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of any other person then someone could hypothetically worship Darth Vader if they wanted to. However, in order to ensure there is no preference by the government of one religion of another, the government cannot officially or unofficially endorse ANY religion. Again, this is a check on potential persecution against any citizens individual rights that are guaranteed by the constitution.

In the US, the idea of "might is right" is usually vehemently pushed back against because there is an understanding of what happens when that thought process prevails. Again, we are not perfect and we don't proclaim to be perfect. However, the tools to rectify any problems we have are guaranteed by our constitutional rights that the government cannot infringe upon. If they do, then we have an appeals process that allows for any circumstances of unconstitutional behavior to be reviewed and if it is deemed unconstitutional by whatever court is reviewing it, the original determination will be thrown out.

I can call any government member, including the president, a complete and total idiot to their face and there is absolutely nothing they can do to me legally speaking. They also reserve the right to call me one too.

I can post whatever thoughts or ideas I have online, in the paper, or through any source of media and people are free to determine if it makes sense or not on their own. Those same people are free to counter my thoughts with their own arguments in whatever open forum of their choosing and it is again guaranteed by the constitution and bill of rights.

Therefore, I think we are fundamentally talking about two different things with two different sets of cultural values at play. I believe this will cause us to talk past each other instead of addressing the issues at hand.

P.S. again, it doesn't help when you say you want us to fall under your belief system or when you say my children need to pay in blood for what is happening in your part of the world. I think I understand what you mean, but that does not mean I am not going to violently protest ANYONE trying to hurt my children. I'm sure a fathers rage and willingness to kill for their child is much the same over in Iran as it is here in the US.
Hey guy , I have language problem, who will read this , please write short after to this.
In the west? Ok, you're claiming something and the truth is another. Just for test Can you have a protest as comunists or Holocaust denier.s and I saw the pictures and videos from fergusen, armored vehicles and m16s, this is your human right. And with respect for victims of "kent state shootins" , davidians , the singer of "Bloody Sunday", and other people that killed as protestors in US, You can find a wonderful list by searching "Bloody riots US/Bloody Protests" and everything similar. So enjoy your freedom. About your religion you a human made religion , You're on Liberalism and your holy book is "Universal Declaration of Human Rights" , but not human as human , the right of human as a god. With a holly story like holocaust. If you can tell me if US troops get back in their homeland can US be the Empire again. you can read about your gov's censeurship and media control and think about if someone can't know what's happening can he try to make problems. And i again prefer you to watch "Stat De Siege", And about the UK, David kelly is a good example , and about Germany it's name was "The Government of Secret Murdering" and Cobra 11 movies built to cover this. I think you should get close to Political Cinema.
December 10th, 2014  
crazytanker
 
 
Uh....what? Did you just blame three different things that didn't happen in the US on the US? Forgive me for being a little confused here...
 


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