What about the t-95? - Page 2




 
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April 26th, 2009  
tommy_gunn
 
 
yes i do think you are right, i do know that tanks is not an urban fighter thats why u have tank like the "BRADLEY from the USA, ROOIKAT from the RSA." Tanks are more for the open fields like desserts and grass plains. That gun will be great in open field warfare and yes not in urban.
April 26th, 2009  
tommy_gunn
 
 
Yes with that gun it will kill the rest"ww2 the tiger and king tigers 88guns was the best" crappy tank though. abr, leo2 merka. good tanks in this case the 1 with da bigger stick wins the fight. Flop i don't think so the Russians build damn good tanks sold the most too the world than any other country.
April 27th, 2009  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tommy_gunn
yes i do think you are right, i do know that tanks is not an urban fighter thats why u have tank like the "BRADLEY from the USA, ROOIKAT from the RSA." Tanks are more for the open fields like desserts and grass plains. That gun will be great in open field warfare and yes not in urban.

Well the Bradley isn't really classified as a tank, it's an IFV and the Rooikat is officially classified as an Armored car/AFV.

IMO if we should have kept with the M551 or M8, which are the perfect size with MOUT. Mod an M551 with a 105mm and a few other additions and you'd be golden.
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April 27th, 2009  
Sinnr
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FO Seaman
Well the Bradley isn't really classified as a tank, it's an IFV and the Rooikat is officially classified as an Armored car/AFV.

IMO if we should have kept with the M551 or M8, which are the perfect size with MOUT. Mod an M551 with a 105mm and a few other additions and you'd be golden.
Except for the fact that an RPG can punch straight though its extremely light armor and do very bad things to the inside. And these days every bad guy and his brother knows how to make EFPs and they can slice through aluminum like a hot knife through butter. However, I think that if you take an M551 chassis and rebuild it with modern armor and survivability features it could work. But with the Stryker Mobile Gun System and its 105mm gun already in service I doubt they would consider it.
April 27th, 2009  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinnr
Except for the fact that an RPG can punch straight though its extremely light armor and do very bad things to the inside. And these days every bad guy and his brother knows how to make EFPs and they can slice through aluminum like a hot knife through butter. However, I think that if you take an M551 chassis and rebuild it with modern armor and survivability features it could work. But with the Stryker Mobile Gun System and its 105mm gun already in service I doubt they would consider it.
The armor for the M551 was made to withstand 30mm hits and bolt-on armor is not hard to produce or even a redesign on the turret, as shown with the M60 Sabra the Isreali's have. Your also forgetting the Bradley has armor similar to the M551 and in-order to defeat EFP's, seconday and even a third armor package was require. the Stryker is made to withstand 14.5mm it is extremely, thinly armored and even with Slat armor to protect against RPG's it's still like rolling a tin-foil covered car into town, the MGS is a good system but it is far from a tank, something light with treads is needed.

Personally I don't think slapping a 105mm on a IFV is definatly not a way to out match something such as a modified and updated M551A1 (TTS). It's like the issue with the HMMVEE, using a vehicle made for rear-enchlon cargo and troop transport for front line urban combat. Fourtunatly the HUMVEE has held up like a champ, and cetainly owe's no one anything.
April 28th, 2009  
Sinnr
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FO Seaman
The armor for the M551 was made to withstand 30mm hits and bolt-on armor is not hard to produce or even a redesign on the turret, as shown with the M60 Sabra the Isreali's have. Your also forgetting the Bradley has armor similar to the M551 and in-order to defeat EFP's, seconday and even a third armor package was require. the Stryker is made to withstand 14.5mm it is extremely, thinly armored and even with Slat armor to protect against RPG's it's still like rolling a tin-foil covered car into town, the MGS is a good system but it is far from a tank, something light with treads is needed.

Personally I don't think slapping a 105mm on a IFV is definatly not a way to out match something such as a modified and updated M551A1 (TTS). It's like the issue with the HMMVEE, using a vehicle made for rear-enchlon cargo and troop transport for front line urban combat. Fourtunatly the HUMVEE has held up like a champ, and cetainly owe's no one anything.
It would require a costly and relatively significant series of upgrades to make the M551 a suitable combatant on todays urban battlefield. Off the top of my head it would require a modified turret, modern electronics and targeting systems, new armor packages, and modified ammo storage so the crew doesn't get burned alive after a hit. It could be done and would probably even be highly effective once they finally got on the ground. The real question is - would it be cost effective to upgrade the limited number M551s we still have in our inventory? We have thousands of Bradley IFVs and CFVs still in service and that alone makes it cost effective for the Army to keep upgrading them. Don't get me wrong, personally I'm a big fan of the Sheridan and light tanks as a whole. But I think that Army brass would be more inclined to spend money on a new modern design instead of the ugly stepchild mainsteam generals never really liked.

I agree with you about the Stryker. Like the Humvee it's being forced into situations it wasn't designed to handle. I think it's just a matter of time before the bouncing baby Stryker gets an armor overhaul.
April 28th, 2009  
A Can of Man
 
 
The Sheridan's armor is pretty woeful and the addition of a 105mm might even throw the tank off balance.
April 28th, 2009  
SHERMAN
 
 
What you need is not a light tank, its a medium tank. somwhere in the 25-35 ton catagory. You must have an active protection system for this thing. Probably a 105mm gun is enough, provided with the correct ammunition for urban warfare.
April 28th, 2009  
FO Seaman
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinnr
It would require a costly and relatively significant series of upgrades to make the M551 a suitable combatant on todays urban battlefield. Off the top of my head it would require a modified turret, modern electronics and targeting systems, new armor packages, and modified ammo storage so the crew doesn't get burned alive after a hit. It could be done and would probably even be highly effective once they finally got on the ground. The real question is - would it be cost effective to upgrade the limited number M551s we still have in our inventory? We have thousands of Bradley IFVs and CFVs still in service and that alone makes it cost effective for the Army to keep upgrading them. Don't get me wrong, personally I'm a big fan of the Sheridan and light tanks as a whole. But I think that Army brass would be more inclined to spend money on a new modern design instead of the ugly stepchild mainsteam generals never really liked.

I agree with you about the Stryker. Like the Humvee it's being forced into situations it wasn't designed to handle. I think it's just a matter of time before the bouncing baby Stryker gets an armor overhaul.

I keep thinking our military thinks outside the box, in an inventive way, but what you say is very true, top brass would laugh you out of the building if you brought something like that up.

I keep forgetting we may be a very lucrative and rich country, but we tighter fisted than a miser.

In the long run though re-activating and upgrading Sheridan's night be a bit less cost worthy than actually putting together team to draw out and plan a dedicated, brand new, vehicle that would probably end up being a clusterf**k.

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_13th_redneck
The Sheridan's armor is pretty woeful and the addition of a 105mm might even throw the tank off balance.
Maybe, I don't know. That 152mm has some umph.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SHERMAN
What you need is not a light tank, its a medium tank. somwhere in the 25-35 ton catagory. You must have an active protection system for this thing. Probably a 105mm gun is enough, provided with the correct ammunition for urban warfare.
I think another good candidate is the M8 Buford. Excellent vehicle.
April 29th, 2009  
Sinnr
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FO Seaman
I think another good candidate is the M8 Buford. Excellent vehicle.
Amen brother. A version of the M8 Armored Gun System with an urban survival kit would be a great asset to ground forces. And it has the advantage of fitting in with modern Army doctrine.

We seem to be off topic though.