USSR v Western Allies circa 1945 - who would win and why? - Page 5




View Poll Results :USSR v Western Allies circa 1945 - who would win and why?
USSR 12 46.15%
Western Allies 14 53.85%
Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll

 
--
 
November 27th, 2004  
Darcia
 
Aircraft can shoot down at tanks, Tanks cannot shoot up at aircraft
November 27th, 2004  
Damien435
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dameon
Aircraft can shoot down at tanks, Tanks cannot shoot up at aircraft
They can if they have a machine gun mounted on top of the turret, which many tanks did.
November 27th, 2004  
Darcia
 
For the most part however aircraft would have an uperhand on tanks.
--
November 27th, 2004  
Trevor
 
There's not a whole lot that a 50 cal mounted on a tank could do to an aircraft, let alone hit it. When you have a P-47 Thunderbolt or an Avenger, coming in to strafe you on a low run, you're worried about getting the hell out of there more than anything.
November 28th, 2004  
godofthunder9010
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger
Remember some points guys:

1. Would the USAAF have been able to drop any atomic weapons in May/June 1945?
Not immediately, which means that the Western Powers would have to hold them back as best as they could for awhile.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger
2. The Red Army had a BIG advantage in tanks, artillery and troops, plus a big swelling momentum pushing West.

3. The average US/UK soldier was better trained than his Soviet counterpart but as the Germans found the individual Russian soldier was extremely tough and by 1945, battle hardened in the fires of the Ostfront.
The Soviets had a big advantage in Tanks and Artillery. That means they definitely would be the ones on the attack -- the USA and UK couldn't have matched them in Quality, Quantity and Experience. However, the accumulated Western forces were immense, so we're not looking at any easy job driving them back. It would have been a very slow and costly retreat by the West. Gradually, Pershings, Fireflies, other more useful tanks, and more artillery show up in larger quantities and the balance begins to even out.

The Western Forces were probably better lead and their leaders were less likely to sacrifice their soldiers where they could help it.

Quote:
4. The Soviet Air force known as the Voenno-Vozdushniye Sily (VVS) in 1945 was much stronger than the Luftwaffe that faced the Allies was. Most people seem to forget that the USSR produced a total of 139,748 aircraft throughout WW2. That compares well with the US total of 160,070 for example.
Most of which were destroyed, because Germany was a lot more scared of the USSR than the West and focussed on them. I think that one of the very first things that happens in this hypothetical conflict is a vye for air superiority. The USA and UK had much better designed aircraft for air superiority missions. I think that the West would have taken control of the air within the first few months of conflict. During that time, Soviet tanks and artillery could do a lot of damage. Still, both sides were immense military machines, so I doubt that the USSR pushed the Western forces back very far all that quickly.

You could project things settling into something of a Stalemate after the West initially loses ground. After securing air superiority, the West would have started reversing the Soviet momentum -- again, very very slowly.
November 28th, 2004  
MadeInChina
 
ONe question, how big is russia????

even if the americans manage to destory russia, conqueroro it, which is unlikely becuase russian forces are not to be underestimated. The land of russia is very big, nazi germany fielded 5 millon + 5000 tanks and couldnt cover very muche ven belurus and ukraine, imagine all of soviet union

Us forcfes would be so spread out that a russian field army will roam freely to kill

supplies, sure, its very important, but dont forget that russians could sack american supply lines to steal and take.
November 28th, 2004  
airmanpatroler
 
 
well at 1945 the americans enjoyed one thing the russians didnt. The atom bomb. We would have leveled everything they had in the Pacific and by the time they had time to react and send in troops on the western front the russian army would be bombed into surrender.
November 28th, 2004  
Darcia
 
Russia may try to stay and not surrender no matter how bad they get wounded, they did it in WW2 and it worked so they may have tried to do that. However The Russians could not have survived combined efforts of America,Britian,and France would do pretty good, However France didn't realy have a Navy since most of it had been destroyed.
November 28th, 2004  
godofthunder9010
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYC88mm
ONe question, how big is russia????

even if the americans manage to destory russia, conqueroro it, which is unlikely becuase russian forces are not to be underestimated. The land of russia is very big, nazi germany fielded 5 millon + 5000 tanks and couldnt cover very muche ven belurus and ukraine, imagine all of soviet union

Us forcfes would be so spread out that a russian field army will roam freely to kill

supplies, sure, its very important, but dont forget that russians could sack american supply lines to steal and take.
Naturally, the USSR was enormous. Nobody is claiming that its an easy win for either side. But lets consider a few things:
1.) Unlike Germany, the West would be engaging Russia with relatively equal numbers. That's something that Germany never had. Not even close to it.
2.) Russia had lost an immense number of its military aged young men against Germany. They were bled dry, much moreso than the Western Allies. They still had more to give, but less depth in that category.
3.) Remember how the Ukraine welcomed the Germans as liberators? Well this time, the USA, UK and France would play their cards right ... it would be hard to play them wrong afterall. Any portion of the USSR that is taken would seize the opportunity to assist any movement that frees them of Stalin's tyrany.

The moment that the Atom Bomb is brought into the equation, it ends very quickly.
November 28th, 2004  
Darcia
 
and Russia was about 7 years away from getting the Bomb, plus during a war thier is no way they would have been able to undergo such a major thing without American Supplies. So they would have to choose what to spend money on.