A tribute to France.




 
--
Boots
 
November 15th, 2004  
Duty Honor Country
 
 

Topic: A tribute to France.


A tribute to France.

Ever since Operation Iraqi Freedom, relations between the United States and France have been strained. Officially, the governments of each nation say they are still close allies and will continue to work together on international affairs. The people of those two nations have taken a harder line. Since I am an American, I do not know everything that goes on in France. The news reports that I do hear seem to show there is an anti American feeling running through France. That same feeling is apparent here in the United States.

After France went against the United States at the UN regarding military action against Iraq, Americans turned anti French. The congress cafeteria, along with many other businesses, changed the names of curtain foods. French fries and French toast became freedom fries and freedom toast. The cries went out to boycott everything made in France, including their good tasting wine. Soldiers and veterans began to grumble. “Have they forgotten what we did for them in World War II,” some people said. “Have they forgotten about the thousands of lives and countless dollars we spent to give France her freedom back,” others said. These are all valid complaints, but my fellow Americans have forgotten the sacrifices France made to America before she was even a country.

The British fleet was stopped from relieving Lord Cornwallis at Yorktown by a French fleet. The British troops were bombarded by siege guns that were supplied by the French. At the battle of Yorktown, 3,000 of George Washington’s troops were French. Washington felt the need to honor the French by letting them commence the first shots at Yorktown. And it was the French who forced Washington to attack Yorktown by sending the French fleet south of New York, where Washington was planning to attack the British. When Washington first heard of this, he was furious. Yet, the French set in motion a series of events that would lead America to her independence from England. And it was a French general who refused to take the British surrender at Yorktown, saying “we are subordinate to the Americans. General George Washington will give you your orders.”

My fellow Americans, before you bash France again, please remember the sacrifices France made to make our land the United States of America.

SGT Doody
November 15th, 2004  
03USMC
 
 
I agree the French did make sacrifices. However remember the U.S. Quasi-War against the French in the 1790's? When they started seizing U.S. Flagged Merchant vessels and impressing U.S. Merchant sailors because we would not declare war on Great Britian.

And I believe the debt should be called paid after WW1 &WW2. So I am a bit tired of the we owe our indepedence to them saw.

That being said I won't bash them.
November 15th, 2004  
A Can of Man
 
 
I don't owe my independence to France so I can keep on bashing away. lol.
--
Boots
November 15th, 2004  
Redleg
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_13th_redneck
I don't owe my independence to France so I can keep on bashing away. lol.
But not in this forum!
November 15th, 2004  
dougal
 
 
Ya it was hard for them especialy since most of the ongoings was at the annaversery of Normandy.
November 16th, 2004  
USAOwnz
 
France, arghh, what's more is that it is usually too liberal.
November 16th, 2004  
Italian Guy
 
 
Nobody owns anything to France, guys.
November 17th, 2004  
Duty Honor Country
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03USMC
I agree the French did make sacrifices. However remember the U.S. Quasi-War against the French in the 1790's? When they started seizing U.S. Flagged Merchant vessels and impressing U.S. Merchant sailors because we would not declare war on Great Britian.
Our American history textbooks will say that the French seized our vessels and almost brought us to war, but the books do not explain France's position.

The honeymoon between France and the United States was short lived. The American Congress put 3 men in charge of negotiating with England; John Adams, Jay and Benjamin Franklin. Franklin's apparent fraternization with the French made him distrusted by others. In the end, Franklin would play a minimal roll in the treaty between America and England. Adams and Jay had been in Europe for 3 years and did not trust the French. Those 2 did not know the roll the French played at Yorktown. Congress had ordered the American delegation to include France in all negotiations with England. I think Adams said, "it would be an honor not to follow this order." I will save the gritty details. In the end, the treaty between the United States and England reflected only British and American interests. France was a little ticked off that her interests were left out of the treaty. What a way to reward an ally who did quite a bit for the American revolution.

The amount of debt that America had because of the war was extreme. One figure I came across was over $200 million dollars. That was reduced to $60 million dollars by congress saying that the gold dollar would be worth $40 paper dollars. France was the one who loaned the most to the US, and she had every right to that money. The US congress did not know how to pay back France, UNTIL after the French Revolution. Then the Americans dicided not to pay the new French government. The Congress said that since the loans were with the King and not the new government, America did not have to pay the French back.

And that is why the French attacked American shipping. In my opinion, the attacks were warrented since what the American government did was pretty messed up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Italian Guy
Nobody owns anything to France, guys.
not so much owe as remember. I can bet you some serious money that that a majority of Americans do not know much, if anything, about the facts I have been stating.
November 18th, 2004  
03USMC
 
 
Okay I'll take your point about the debt. But lets not fool ourselves into thinking that the French aided the colonies out of a love of liberty or any high minded notion.

They aided the Colonies because it suited their purposes. Keeping large amounts of the Royal Army and Navy tied up with rebellious colonials kept them out of Europe.
November 18th, 2004  
Young Winston
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03USMC
Okay I'll take your point about the debt. But lets not fool ourselves into thinking that the French aided the colonies out of a love of liberty or any high minded notion.

They aided the Colonies because it suited their purposes. Keeping large amounts of the Royal Army and Navy tied up with rebellious colonials kept them out of Europe.
But doesn't any country act out of self interest? Surely America has done this throughout their history!