So why do people hate Israel? - Page 111




 
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December 20th, 2012  
VDKMS
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScarabVenom
Are you sure about that? If so, please explain the Bahr El-Baqar massacre committed by the IAF during 1970. Israelis claim that they thought the school was a military installment. In reality, yes it was a primary school, the school was completely destroyed with 46 children dead and about 60 wounded. Not a war crime? That's one out of many crimes done by them.
That's not a war crime, that's an accident.

This is a war crime : Kfar Etzion massacre, May 13, 1948
"When the remaining defenders surrendered, they assembled near the school where they were photographed waving white flags with their hands in the air. The Arabs opened fire and killed many on the spot. Those who remained alive were stabbed to death. Hand grenades were thrown into a cellar, killing a group of 50 who were hiding there. The building was blown up. Only four members of Kfar Etzion survived. They were taken prisoner and transferred to Transjordan. Immediately following the surrender on May 13, the kibbutz was looted and burned."
December 21st, 2012  
Del Boy
 
VDKMS - Were the Irgun made up of British trained underground troops in Europe WW11? Determined not to allow such a situation to occur again.
December 21st, 2012  
lolwhassup
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScarabVenom
Are you sure about that? If so, please explain the Bahr El-Baqar massacre committed by the IAF during 1970. Israelis claim that they thought the school was a military installment. In reality, yes it was a primary school, the school was completely destroyed with 46 children dead and about 60 wounded. Not a war crime? That's one out of many crimes done by them.
Oh but when Americans do similar things, It's a war crime, When the Russians do it, It's a war crime, hell when NATO does it, it's a war crime. What makes it not a war crime when Israel does it?
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December 21st, 2012  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lolwhassup
Oh but when Americans do similar things, It's a war crime, When the Russians do it, It's a war crime, hell when NATO does it, it's a war crime. What makes it not a war crime when Israel does it?
Actually there is a very fine line between "war crimes" and "accidents", if they genuinely thought they were bombing a military installation then it isn't a war crime.

Just as I am not sure throwing hand grenades into a cellar killing people hiding in there is a crime either as troops are allowed to keep themselves safe as well, had the cellar dwellers surrendered that would have been a different story but as they were hiding you can assume they hadn't.
December 21st, 2012  
Del Boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lolwhassup
Oh but when Americans do similar things, It's a war crime, When the Russians do it, It's a war crime, hell when NATO does it, it's a war crime. What makes it not a war crime when Israel does it?
And when Arabs do it??

As for the question you pose - VDKMS has answered it in detail already on this thread. Try reading it.
December 21st, 2012  
ScarabVenom
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VDKMS
That's not a war crime, that's an accident.

This is a war crime : Kfar Etzion massacre, May 13, 1948
"When the remaining defenders surrendered, they assembled near the school where they were photographed waving white flags with their hands in the air. The Arabs opened fire and killed many on the spot. Those who remained alive were stabbed to death. Hand grenades were thrown into a cellar, killing a group of 50 who were hiding there. The building was blown up. Only four members of Kfar Etzion survived. They were taken prisoner and transferred to Transjordan. Immediately following the surrender on May 13, the kibbutz was looted and burned."
So, they really thought it's a military installment? Worst case scenario, even if it's an accident, doesn't mean that we should just forgive and forget, right? Even when you not purposely kill someone, you get a sentence.

The warcrime you mentioned was done by the Jordan army. I guess you talk with the Jordanians about this one...
December 21st, 2012  
ScarabVenom
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lolwhassup
Oh but when Americans do similar things, It's a war crime, When the Russians do it, It's a war crime, hell when NATO does it, it's a war crime. What makes it not a war crime when Israel does it?
I called it a warcrime. I think you didn't mean to direct your post to me?
December 21st, 2012  
ScarabVenom
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Actually there is a very fine line between "war crimes" and "accidents", if they genuinely thought they were bombing a military installation then it isn't a war crime.
Well...how would we know that they really thought it was a military installation? And still, even if it's an accident it doesn't have to be acceptable. Still whoever is responsible had to be represented to justice.
December 21st, 2012  
ScarabVenom
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VDKMS
That's not a war crime, that's an accident.

This is a war crime : Kfar Etzion massacre, May 13, 1948
"When the remaining defenders surrendered, they assembled near the school where they were photographed waving white flags with their hands in the air. The Arabs opened fire and killed many on the spot. Those who remained alive were stabbed to death. Hand grenades were thrown into a cellar, killing a group of 50 who were hiding there. The building was blown up. Only four members of Kfar Etzion survived. They were taken prisoner and transferred to Transjordan. Immediately following the surrender on May 13, the kibbutz was looted and burned."
Accident, too?

Historian Gabby Bron wrote in the Yediot Ahronot in Israel that he witnessed Israeli troops executing Egyptian prisoners on the morning of June 8, 1967, in the Sinai town of El Arish. Bron reported that he saw about 150 Egyptian POWs being held at the El Arish airport where they were sitting on the ground, densely crowded together with their hands held on the back of their necks. Every few minutes, Bron writes, Israeli soldiers would escort an Egyptian POW from the group to a hearing conducted by two men in Israeli army uniforms. Then the man would be taken away, given a spade, and forced to dig his own grave. "I watched as (one) man dug a hole for about 15 minutes,?Bron wrote. afterwards, the (Israeli military) policeman told him to throw the shovel away, and then one of them leveled an Uzi at him and shot two short bursts, each of three or four bullets.? Bron says he witnessed about ten such executions, until the grave was filled. Then an Israeli Colonel threatened him with a revolver, forcing him to leave the area.

December 21st, 2012  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScarabVenom
Well...how would we know that they really thought it was a military installation? And still, even if it's an accident it doesn't have to be acceptable. Still whoever is responsible had to be represented to justice.
There is a famous case of the Luftwaffe bombing a school in 1943 and how reprehensible the action was but a few years ago one of the survivors wrote a book because he had discovered that until a few months earlier the building had been used by the war department and had only recently been returned to use as a school.

Just as there are numerous reports of allied troops clearing cellars in towns they are capturing with grenades only to find that some were inhabited by civilians, I imagine that these instances are simply put down as "fortunes of war" incidents.


Some times not everything is as clear cut as reports indicate.
 


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