Sights or Point Shooting in CQB Situations - Page 5

March 4th, 2010  
In fact, the answer is nope.

As to the index finger method, I think it's fair to say that the US Military's suppression of the finger pointing method from 1912 - 1941 due to the design fault of the 1911, kept it from becoming popular.

That's logical as the 1911 was the standard issue sidearm for US forces for a total of about 70 years. And even the very unbright probably can get "the message" when told to not do something for 30 to 70 years.

As to why a modest modification was not made to the 1911 to fix the design fault, I don't have a clue except to think that the Sight Only crowd held sway and the traditional way was their way.

Remember that in days of old people like Giodana Bruno was burned at the stake, and Galileo was sentenced to life under house arrest for going against the dogma - that the sun revolved around the earth. And how about the Salem witch trials.

Also, having been through boot camp long long ago, I don't think many privates would object to what they were being told to do by their NCO's.


In Shanghia, Fairbairn and Sykes had good success with their target focus method which was built upon by Applegate in WWII.

The Applegates method was even taught at the FBI Academy for a few years after WWII, until a new "boss" came around. Then it was pushed aside as the "MT" came into being and became the cats meow.

Since that time most all police were and still are trained to use the sights for shooting.

In the 1970's, the NYPD SOP 9 study of some 6,000 + police combat cases, and studies since then have established that: If you are going to be shot and/or killed there is a 90% chance that it will be at less than 15 feet.

In most all cases in the SOP 9 study, the sights were not used.

And Officers shot with one hand with few exceptions.

The MISS rate was 80% +/-

For more details see:

Or check out the RAND corporation study of the NYPD which was funded by the NYPD:

IMHO, a miss rate of 80+% is a very very bad joke.

And to not accept the truth and do something about it, such as making a study of shooting methods to determine factually what does and does not work in CQB, and then share that info with the law abiding gun owning public, is morally wrong on the part of "the Government", gun makers, and trainers.

At least the NRA has recognized the facts, and supprots the use of Point Shooting for CQ self defense.


So, as I said at the start, NO things have not evolved or gotten better. If anything, since the 1940's they are worse.

You don't have to like what is, but it is what it is.

Hopefully discussions such as this one, will lead to better understanding of what the situation is, and to improvments down the road.

I'm an optomist.
March 6th, 2010  
This thread is funny.
March 7th, 2010  
there is a conspiracy against sighted weapons? who would of thought...
March 8th, 2010  
Originally Posted by PJ24
This thread is funny.

So is the Air Force.
March 8th, 2010  
A Can of Man
Originally Posted by 03USMC
So is the Air Force.
March 8th, 2010  
Originally Posted by 03USMC
So is the Air Force.
Don't hate us 'cuz you ain't us.
March 17th, 2010  
You answer on your assigned punch.....was up wid dat?
May 12th, 2010  
Hi Guys,

Put together a simple video about the slide stop pin problem.

If you plan to use a 1911 for self defense, you may want to take a look at it. You can file it under: you can take a horse to water, but you can't make em drink.

Also, I just updated my page of WW II pics and fly-by videos.

For those interest in such, here's the link:

And here's a nice group pic:

June 17th, 2010  
Hi again folk. I didn't expect th video on the1911 to be received with smiles, but I thiink it is best to deal with what is.

Here's a link to an article on the fatal flaw of the 1911:

And to add a bit more fuel to the fire:

Here's a new U-Tube Video: EZ Point Shooting with a pistol.

And here's a link to a very brief article about the method that employs our natural ability to point at objects, and which the US Army says can be used to engage targets rapidly and accurately.

If you are satisfied with your ability to Point Shoot, the information may not be for you, but it might help others in getting comfortable with Point Shooting.
August 8th, 2010  
I do pretty well with the index finger method at the range, but I doubt I could do well with it under stress.

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