if hitler was overthrown - Page 2




 
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April 21st, 2005  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien435
My understanding is that all the way back in 1942 the allies had decided to settle for nothing short of an unconditional surrender from Germany, Hitler I believe was determined to hold out as long as possible, this being why he continually pulled troops off the eastern front and put them on the western front, to slow down the allies. His theory was that it was 2500 miles to the eastern front and only 500 miles from Normandy to the Rhine (or is it Berlin?) so he could afford to place fewer troops on the eastern front and still hold out. (Of course he also thought that FDR's death was a sign that victory for Germany was imminent.) Had Hitler been overthrown I believe the people who overthrown him would have made a deal with the western allies (Britain and America). Germany would surrender to the western allies under the condition that they (US and GB) would not allow any parts of Germany to fall under the control of the communists. Stalin was after all considered to be the enemy in the 1930's, not Hitler.
Indeed, I think the terms for unconditional surrender were set at the Casablanca conference in January 1943.
I think regardless of what had happened to Hitler the allies would have maintained the demand for unconditional surrender.
April 30th, 2005  
Young Winston
 
 
The demand for unconditional surrender would have remained but I think the fighting would have ended quickly between the Germans and the Western allies. Not sure how the SS fighting units would have responded though. Maybe Dopps would like to comment on this.

The Russians would probably have still kept coming as their thurst for revenge would have been immense. Racial hatreds were great on the Eastern Front like Dopps said.


The American hatred for the Japanese was huge in the Pacific War but not for the Germans. The Americans may have cut a deal but I don't think the Germans would have been in any position to ask for too much.

Maybe the Western Allies could have got hold of all of Berlin before the Russians did.
April 30th, 2005  
Doppleganger
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by aussiejohn
The demand for unconditional surrender would have remained but I think the fighting would have ended quickly between the Germans and the Western allies. Not sure how the SS fighting units would have responded though. Maybe Dopps would like to comment on this.
Good point and one that's hard to answer IMO. It wasn't just the Waffen SS units that swore an oath of loyalty to Hitler it was all Wehrmacht units, though granted the Waffen SS tended to be a bit more fanatical generally. I think some Waffen SS units would have laid down their arms but many would have continued fighting for a bit. Equally, the same could be said for some Heer units also. It all depends on who the commander is for each unit. Someone like Paul Hausser, commander of II SS-Panzerkorps probably would have ordered his men to lay down their arms as he was very sensible and pragmatic. But then, one of his divisional or regimental commanders could have disobeyed him.
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April 30th, 2005  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppleganger
Quote:
Originally Posted by aussiejohn
The demand for unconditional surrender would have remained but I think the fighting would have ended quickly between the Germans and the Western allies. Not sure how the SS fighting units would have responded though. Maybe Dopps would like to comment on this.
Good point and one that's hard to answer IMO. It wasn't just the Waffen SS units that swore an oath of loyalty to Hitler it was all Wehrmacht units, though granted the Waffen SS tended to be a bit more fanatical generally. I think some Waffen SS units would have laid down their arms but many would have continued fighting for a bit. Equally, the same could be said for some Heer units also. It all depends on who the commander is for each unit. Someone like Paul Hausser, commander of II SS-Panzerkorps probably would have ordered his men to lay down their arms as he was very sensible and pragmatic. But then, one of his divisional or regimental commanders could have disobeyed him.
I think a large proportion of the foreign units would also have fought on especially the Russian ones as the were in trouble no matter what they chose to do.
May 1st, 2005  
Strongbow
 
 
Yes, the big concern when they tried to kill Hitler in 44, was to get quick control of the SS.

Himmler was always going to be a major obstacle.