Winston's Courage

D

Del Boy

Active member
In the summer of 1915 Winston Churchill's political ambitions were in tatters following his championing of the catastrophic Gallipoli campaign. Out of government but still anxious to serve his country, he volunteered for the Western Front and he wrote a letter to be opened in the event of his death. Given the chances of surviving the blood-drenched Flanders field , he showed no pessisism; he wrote to his wife: 'You have taught me how noble a woman's heart can be. Do not grieve for me too much... death is only an incident, and not the most important which happens to us in this state of being'.

'Someday I should like the truth to be known' - confident history would vindicate him over Gallipoli, the failed attempt to to gain a sea route to Russia.

Churchill was part of the Asquith Liberal government when he lost his post as First Lord of the Admiralty. Having seen combat in India, the Sudan and the Boer War, he was posted to Flanders as a major in the 2nd Battalion, Grenadier Guards.

By December 1915 he was lieutenant -colonel commanding the 6th Battalion, Royal Scots Fusiliers. He gained the respect of his men with his bravery , including dozens of forays across No Man's Land. They never got accustomed to his insatiable desire to 'stir up the Hun'.

His officer's recalled that he never flinched under fire. " It's no use ducking: the bullet has gone a long way past you by now".

His stint in the trenches came to an end when, because of high casualties, his Battalion was merged with another and his orders were to return to Britain and resume work in the Commons.
(ref: A. Levy D.M. - letter on display in The Churchill Museum in the Cabinet War Rooms, London from November 6th 2008.)

'A man who saves a nation is guilty of nothing ' - Napoleon.
 
Last edited:
Now after reading a biography of Churchill recently I do believe he was unfairly blamed for Gallipoli.
 
Churchill had flaws but he was truly a great man. I was amazed to read in Gilberts book that whenever Churchill spoke in Parliament the place was packed. Even his enemies were captivated by his speeches.

In social issues (late 1890's early 1900's), he was ahead of his time. Churchill had an incredible grasp of intricate problems. He was a great problem solver. Unfortunately he didn't have much time for Australians, particularly in WW2, when he and Curtin disagreed over the us of Australian soldiers in Asia.
 
Last edited:
I have never seen or heard of Churchill have a go about the Australian Armed Forces, this appears to be another myth that has grown up from no where
 
That is just what I wished to say - I have never heard that, and would find it hard to believe. The Aussies have never been held anything other than the highest respect as fighting men, in Britain, and their attitudes were legendary.

Churchill - anyone who can uncork 42,000 bottles of wine and win a war is OK by me.:smil:
 
From what history I learned at school, Winnie wanted a plan to save Britain first, if necessary allowing part of Australia to be allowed to fall to the Japanese, this was discussed between him and Roosevelt at the Arcadia Conference.

There is plenty of supporting material on the 'net.

I have never bothered to go into the "nitty gritty" as no doubt there is all manner of self indulgent reporting on both sides along with political back stabbing behind the scenes. But on the surface there does appear to be some truth to the matter.

At no time have I ever read that he denigrated the Aussie troops, the dispute was between he and PM Curtin.
 
Last edited:
senojekips..........Yes there was a plan if the worse came to to worse for Japanese to take the northern part of Australia and for them to be stopped in the central desert regions. Chips Rafferty made a film about them driving the cattle south to avoid them falling into Japanese hands...........The problem was we did not have the man power to cover all the coast of Australia. This plan was abandoned when America enter the war and sent a large number of troops to Australia and MacArthur decided to fight them in New Guinea. We had started to ship large number of spitfires out to Australia to help in it's protection. The problem was we were trying to do to much on many fronts and we just could not raise the man power at this time.
 
Aussies

My uncle Charlie served in North Africa with the Long Range Desert Group, he had nothing but praise for the Aussies, he always said, “Aussies were bloody good fighters, tough as nails.”

A sentiment still held by British service personnel.
 
Right. My uncles were there too. Desert Rats with the Rifle Brigade. At one stage they were following the Scots troops who were advancing so fast that his guys were taking responsibility for dealin with their dead. I never heard anything but praise for the Aussies.
 
Saw the link. Churchill was a Liberal party man as well. Tory - Liberal - Tory.

As he famously said :- "Anyone can rat - it takes a real man to re-rat".
 
If it were possible, I wonder how Churchill would have wished to utilize the Australian Divisions in Europe in 1944.

I wish I could find the source but I thought that Monty said he would have dearly wanted the ANZAC Divisions at Caen. He reckons they would have given the Germans plenty more to think about in that part of the Normandy campaign. The Caen fighting may have been concluded sooner.
 
Dday Dodgers.

My uncle Charlie was part of the 8th Army, serving in North Africa, Sicily, Italy finally finishing the war in Austria, what annoyed him greatly was being referred to as the Dday Dodgers by Lady Astor . A ballad was written in response to the tune of Lili Marlene.
Exactly who wrote The Ballad of the D-Day Dodgers is unknown, although it may have originated with Hamish Henderson.


We're the D-Day Dodgers out in Italy -

Always on the vino, always on the spree.
Eighth Army scroungers and their tanks
We live in Rome - among the Yanks.
We are the D-Day Dodgers, over here in Italy.

We landed at Salerno, a holiday with pay,
Jerry brought the band down to cheer us on our way
We all sang the songs and the beer was free.
We kissed all the girls in Napoli.
For we are the D-Day Dodgers, over here in Italy.

The Volturno and Cassino were taken in our stride
We didn't have to fight there. We just went for the ride.
Anzio and Sangro were all forlorn.
We did not do a thing from dusk to dawn.
For we are the D-Day Dodgers, over here in Italy.

On our way to Florence we had a lovely time.
We ran a bus to Rimini right through the Gothic Line.
On to Bologna we did go.
Then we went bathing in the Po.
For we are the D-Day Dodgers, over here in Italy.

Once we had a blue light that we were going home
Back to dear old Blighty, never more to roam.
Then somebody said in France you'll fight.
We said never mind, we'll just sit tight,
The windy D-Day Dodgers, out in Sunny Italy.

Now Lady Astor, get a load of this.
Don't stand up on a platform and talk a load of piss.
You're the nation's sweetheart, the nation's pride
We think your mouth's too bloody wide.
We are the D-Day Dodgers, in Sunny Italy.

When you look 'round the mountains, through the mud and rain
You'll find the scattered crosses, some which bear no name.
Heartbreak, and toil and suffering gone
The boys beneath them slumber on
They were the D-Day Dodgers, who'll stay in Italy.

So listen all you people, over land and foam
Even though we've parted, our hearts are close to home.
When we return we hope you'll say
"You did your little bit, though far away
All of the D-Day Dodgers, way out there in Italy."
 
Last edited:
errol.....The battle for Caen was a battle of attrition, the German Panzer had dug in deep and in great depth. To stop Monty breaking out there was one German defencive line after another. The German Hitler Youth Division fought to the death at Caen and I think that only 10 of the Hitler Youths were found alive when their position were finally over run. Now the Canadians are slouches on the Battlefield but these kids fought them back time and time again. Monty threw 1,000 tanks into one attack and lost 800 of them over all we lost 27.000 men trying take Caen if I remember rightly
 
A historian has all the use of hind sight. They can analyse the whole battle at a desk all safe and sound saying they should have done this or that. Now operation Goodwood did not go that well but by then the Germans were around Caen in force. There were 9 German Division in Normandy at this time and 6 of those were around Caen
 
errol said:
http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Soc/soc.history.war.world-war-ii/2007-05/msg00200.html

Churchill had no issues with the Australian fighting ability but believed they were trouble off the battlefield (not alone there). He had some big issues with the Australian Government during WW2. See above link.

My recent reading of Gilbert's book on Churchill has increased my admiration for this truly great person.
Click to expand...

Hey All.

It's the other way around.
Minzie, the Australian P/M during ww2 actually had big issues with Churchill, about the Singarpore defence and Churchill made a big mistake with the Grease project, but apart from that, he was a truely great leader.

Cheers!
 
LeEnfield said:
A historian has all the use of hind sight. They can analyse the whole battle at a desk all safe and sound saying they should have done this or that. Now operation Goodwood did not go that well but by then the Germans were around Caen in force. There were 9 German Division in Normandy at this time and 6 of those were around Caen
Click to expand...

The failure of any breakthrough at Goodwood should be blamed on the commanding officers in charge. From Montgomery right down to company captain's and Leutenants who should have known better to advance into an area without knowing where you are really going. Everytime I hear the word Goodwood, I get angry. It was all such a stupid waste of very fine men. Not to mention the armour. The Canadian Black Watch slaughter on Verrieres ridge especially irks me. I Know these things have happened and I wasn't even born yet but just once I'd like to see the brass get what they deserve. This was the operation where Simond's certainly proved to many Canadian soldiers that Monty was his mentor.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top