Why they hate (U.S.)




 
--
Boots
 
July 9th, 2013  
Yossarian
 
 

Topic: Why they hate (U.S.)


I was sitting on the couch with the significant other tonight and one way or another the dead cat being foreign interventionism and the cost of empire got dragged up.

Upon her giving me the normal consensus of why we intervene so many places all around the word, is because they (they being the vague term for all other Non American inhabitants on this Earth) hate us.

When asked why although her answer was intelligently worded, her answer ran right back into the Catch 22 that is the typical consensus of them hating us for our freedom ( also a vague term in some regards) and prosperity.

Now, I am no stranger to challenging the common logic on America and more broadly the West's place in this world. And no stranger to being called every derogatory name in the book, and most oftenly called un American.

But this is my general question, the reason I find that so many grit their teeth is over the fact that I have a tendency to point out those swept little bits of history under the rug. I also ask the most difficult question.

If you were from ( Insert Your Country ) what would you think of the U.S. and why?

Some countries get new hospitals, new schools, some get predator drones, what do the witnesses on the ground think from these different actions by Americans and Westerners around the world?

The hardest thing it seems to do is to ask Americans and other Westerners to remove your flag from your train of thought for a moment. Look at why these (enemies) hate us, why they resist, and most importantly what actions that often go unreported lead to the complex international situations that lead to such violence?

In short, thinking deeper than what the papers say.

With over 55 military interventions in a half a century, hundreds of bases and installations around the world, and a incredibly strong sense of denial on consequences and amazing justification machine for use of force.

Also, the hardest thing I often see on American's faces when asked these difficult question is the normal inability to remove common morality and look at the events that have happened. I know this seems a little illogical but it is the easiest way I have learned in understanding why foreign populations often radicalize, for different reasons for violence against the U.S.

And why does American Public Opinion fight this trend tooth and nail? And will fight viciously to defend this comfort zone of denial?

For I love our armed forces, have family and friends serving, and they are some of the best people I know, why then do we create situations abroad that forces us to sacrifice the ones we love often for reasons that are rarely led with any moral conscience?

Maybe if we ponder these questions I can maybe find an easy answer that the general public can swallow on why "they" hate us. And why violence persist to this day against our fellow citizens abroad. And why the fighting never stops.
July 9th, 2013  
MontyB
 
 
Hmm I can give you a short answer:
We the 6.8 billion people that are not Americans don't think about the USA at all yet for some reason you the 316 million Americans are convinced we do.

I would suggest that the assumption that "we" hate you is more an American desire to think that you are somehow better when in reality I doubt that very few in the western world give a damn what goes on in America we have our own problems to deal with.

As for hating your freedoms well I think Edward Snowden has pretty much indicated that you don't have any freedoms for us to hate and the reality is that the majority of the western world have the same if not more so that is really an illusion as well.

Having traveled a sizable chunk of the world I cant honestly say that I have found anyone that has claimed to "hate" Americans I have found a lot of people that dislike your foreign policies, the support for dodgy dictatorships, the dictatorial nature toward nations when committing the same acts yourselves and the support of ideologies over human rights tend to annoy.

On the whole though I think most people are amused by the American desire to take yourselves so seriously when for the most part no one cares, you are like the person that always shows up at an informal gathering and tries to run it while every one else just wants to have fun.
July 9th, 2013  
Yossarian
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Hmm I can give you a short answer:
We the 6.8 billion people that are not Americans don't think about the USA at all yet for some reason you the 316 million Americans are convinced we do.

I would suggest that the assumption that "we" hate you is more an American desire to think that you are somehow better when in reality I doubt that very few in the western world give a damn what goes on in America we have our own problems to deal with.

As for hating your freedoms well I think Edward Snowden has pretty much indicated that you don't have any freedoms for us to hate and the reality is that the majority of the western world have the same if not more so that is really an illusion as well.

Having traveled a sizable chunk of the world I cant honestly say that I have found anyone that has claimed to "hate" Americans I have found a lot of people that dislike your foreign policies, the support for dodgy dictatorships, the dictatorial nature toward nations when committing the same acts yourselves and the support of ideologies over human rights tend to annoy.

On the whole though I think most people are amused by the American desire to take yourselves so seriously when for the most part no one cares, you are like the person that always shows up at an informal gathering and tries to run it while every one else just wants to have fun.

Just the napkin needed to wipe off my glasses. I already assumed as much that the majority of the world doesn't really care too much about U.S. Self Opinion or even gives us the thought of day.

However it's just a little frustrating hearing the same assumed lines about backlash for every act of aggression or violence against my country from our foreign policy.

On the whole the fact most people on Earth have no interest or opinion is what I kinda already guessed. Everyone at some point really by our very nature only follows what's in their own best interest. And I don't say that with any attached morality, it is what it is.
--
Boots
July 9th, 2013  
senojekips
 
 
Yo, to be perfectly blunt, America's foreign policy stinks and much of your civil policy is no better.

Americans as individuals are great people, but they have been fed a diet of BS and "we are" for so long that they now believe their own "puffing".

I have spent quite a bit of time in the US with a 9 month stay being my longest, and the one thing that I could never work out is why most Americans assume that other nations think they are great, yet in the same breath will tell you that no one gives their country the respect that they feel is due.

Essentially, I feel that the average US citizen has little or no idea of how the world really works, and even less idea of how they view the US.
July 9th, 2013  
Yossarian
 
 
The hype stops at the border, however when you swim in it all the time everyday it can be no wonder why so often my fellow citizens just start to eat it and ignore just looking at this country from the outside in on where we fit in the world, and how and why it is as such.

People here just plain out don't seem to like the idea of looking at things from another person's perspective to highlight why we face the challenges abroad that we do.

Or at least with notion that those who do challenge our interest do not share the same morals nor admire the same qualities we get fed since childhood when we do find confrontations elsewhere.

I am not calling anybody ignorant nor stupid. Not in the slightest, I am no genius nor do I have it anywhere near all figured out. Just a observation, nothing more.
July 9th, 2013  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yossarian
People here just plain out don't seem to like the idea of looking at things from another person's perspective to highlight why we face the challenges abroad that we do.

Or at least with notion that those who do challenge our interest do not share the same morals nor admire the same qualities we get fed since childhood when we do find confrontations elsewhere.
But this tends to happen when the data you are receiving does not match the answer you want, instead of re-evaluating the your answer it is easier to determine that the data must be wrong.

This is I believe where the "everyone hates us" mentality comes from you are fed the idea that you are the worlds shining example at everything yet the developed worlds response is pretty much "meh".
Rather than accepting you are not in our every thought it is easier to draw the conclusion that everyone else is wrong and is just so jealous that it has become hate.

Now obviously I use the terms western world and developed world as the views of the third world are somewhat different in that given the chance they would be flag waving card carrying Americans in a heartbeat but I am prepared to bet that most of the third world will take what ever they can get over what they have now.
July 10th, 2013  
Yossarian
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
But this tends to happen when the data you are receiving does not match the answer you want, instead of re-evaluating the your answer it is easier to determine that the data must be wrong.

This is I believe where the "everyone hates us" mentality comes from you are fed the idea that you are the worlds shining example at everything yet the developed worlds response is pretty much "meh".
Rather than accepting you are not in our every thought it is easier to draw the conclusion that everyone else is wrong and is just so jealous that it has become hate.

Now obviously I use the terms western world and developed world as the views of the third world are somewhat different in that given the chance they would be flag waving card carrying Americans in a heartbeat but I am prepared to bet that most of the third world will take what ever they can get over what they have now.

The reason I posted this is if you are like me, you look at the causes, and the effects to why people

A: Have the opinions that they do, both Americans and our adversaries.

And

B: What is the reality, the actual events that have occurred to lead to this. Not the rehashed "official" opinions we are all fed.

I look for what is truly happening and look for logical and thought based answers, not opinions or overly simplistic or emotionally charged ones.

All I am asking, is how do you get people to "think" before slinging one of those lines you listed above?

Once again, many of the people who choose that route are not cretins, they are smart people, It's just there is the constant resistance to change of thought.

That's pretty much the nutshell I am trying to crack here. I understand and pretty much surmised as much as both you gentlemen are telling me. Just don't know how to tell that to many of my fellow citizens...

I love America, my country, but I just wish for a more Aware and conscience nation. And I feel we shouldn't have to sacrfice national pride and patriotism to be a little more thoughtful on the world stage should we? You don't have to be the center of attention to be proud.
July 10th, 2013  
MontyB
 
 
Here ya go get them to watch this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mCDZMWVWuc
July 14th, 2013  
udaka
 
YOSS, I believe you are a Pacifist like many Ameircan, why USA launch many war against other countries after world war 2?


ONE VIEW on internet of China , USA politician launch war is for defend the dollar and financial hegemony.

Americans in the past 40 years, found a way is the best way of national survival, that is to use financial instruments to transfer wealth from the global to the United States. Americans find that they do not need produce any products, produced only thing you can get rich, you can live better than all the world, this way is printing dollars. Americans can produce dollars to live a good life, in this sense, the American way of life is the most basic financial survival.


Of course, Americans are clear in this way to amass wealth," global industrial division of labor " is not enough, even coupled with oil pegged to the dollar is not enough, you also need a very powerful tool, if without this measure, the United States can't rob so much wealth from the people of world, this means is top1 military strength.


So I alway didn't like the JEWS of the Wall street , they always use financial tools or financial game cheat the moneys from the people of the world! The Jews produce nothing except arms! They are parasites and vampires!
July 14th, 2013  
VDKMS
 
I still have a favourable view of the US, allthough Obama politics is starting to reverse that view.

I've had some American friends back in Germany and they were all nice people. They were there as a helping force against a Soviet invasion, not an occupation force.

The US kept Taiwan free. They were also the major force to safeguard the freedom of South Korea. They transferred Japan and Germany to powerfull economic nations. They gave us Rock n Roll, jeans and the internet and GPS. Up untill now they acted as a global superpower should act.

Sure, they installed right wing dictatorships because it was the only alternative to left wing dictatorships (communism) but they never annexed foreign countries like China did with Tibet or Russia with parts of Poland and Romania.

They forced France, Britain and Israel to back down after they invaded Egypt because of the nationalization of the Suez Canal.

They were the major force to drive Iraq out of Kuwait.

They used to be a reliable partner, until Obama surfaced.

According to the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development the US is by far the biggest donor in fanancial aid to foreign countries.

The reason why some hate the US is becaust the US goes (went) after the naughty boys to punish them. The naughty boys of today are the Islamic radicals. Onfortunately the US uses the wrong tools (Special OPS, drones) to combat them. A 15 year old Pakastani girl knows how, like I told you more than one year ago.

No country or nation is perfect, but few countries can match the US if you look at the bare facts. Wishful thinking does not change facts.

Unfortunately the president that promised to change the US is changing it in the wrong direction. Spying on its citizens, attacking political oponents through national institutions (IRS), reducing freedom of press (AP, Fox, Reuters), sacrificing american lives (including an ambassador) to get reelected, setting red lines with no action if crossed (now the whole world knows), waiting on the sidelines and side with the victor (Egypt).
 


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