Where is the wikileak-thread? - Page 2




 
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Boots
 
December 11th, 2010  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chukpike

It would be very foolish not be prepared to find other leaks.
Coming from you I find that somewhat amusing. For someone with so much to say, you don't really have a very good grasp of what is news and what's out of date in world events do you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by George
One problem found after 9/11 was that there were a lot of pieces of the puzzle scattered around various Agencies. Had they been put together...So they decided to have greater sharing of intel, & with greater sharing one leak spills more secrets & nonsecrets. double edge blade.
Yes,... you are quite right George, is is an ongoing problem, it was also the case with Pearl Harbour, and 9/11 to name but two of the more notable examples, neither of which would have needed information sharing outside of the US intelligence community. It appears that you have enough internal problems without worrying about "outsiders". The probable cause of this type of ongoing oversight is being demonstrated with this Wikileaks business, where the people who are in fact ultimately responsible for the leaks, are too busy diverting attention away from themselves to people like Assange. It's no wonder they keep occuring, I feel that more attention needs to be directed inwardly rather than outward as is the case here. Blame shifting is ensuring that the problem will be on going.
December 11th, 2010  
Seehund
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted
Frankly, I am quite surprised that the whole wikileak-affair is about as lively as Grace Jones on this forum. Has it been dealt with on another thread or is there no interest to talk about it?
After some digging I found this interesting soundbite and personally think he getting to the point: Re: Wikileaks- In a free society, we are supposed to know the truth. In a society where truth becomes treason, we are in big trouble.- Ron Paul


The only thing which became obvious is that the corps diplomatique are gossiping like a bunch of school girls and get angry (instead of embarrassed) when their gossiping is out in the open... Why don't they write their reports as professionals instead of wannabe journalists of the Daily Telegraph? And the saddest part of all is that they want to crucify someone because their ego's got bruised.
The problem with Wikileaks is that they completely uncritical pour large amounts of unedited material out in public without taking a position of relevance. This makes it all perceived as 'revelatory'.


There are of course cases where the public needs to know the information - even when they are stamped secret. Be it in connection with revelations of Danish soldier’s extradition of Iraqi prisoners to torture in Iraq.

But there are also cases where confidentiality and secrecy actually serves a purpose. There are cases that are so delicate that neither the media nor public is entitled to or need to know what is happening, or what is at stake. Secrecy and confidentiality is not something to be avoided in international relations between countries. It's not all the public is entitled to know. Not all information should land on top of the media agenda.

The discussion is particularly difficult for whom to decide when something should be announced to the public and when something should remain secret? Who mediates between the public and the secret, political process?

Wikileaks presents an immediate solution to the problem by throwing all available material into the public domain. But the question is whether Wikileaks massive dissemination of classified information is responsible? Is the proliferation of information responsible if it "only" damage the state? Or is the line drawn by information potential harm to individuals? It is - as things now stand – up to Wikileaks to judge in these cases.

Politicians have in an unprecedented degree managed to blur the decision-making, shirk responsibility and hide behind spin doctors in this decade, and as I see it, is what Wikileaks really wants to deal with. The only problem is that it is a double-edged sword and it is a dangerous game Wikileaks have started.

As for the diplomats.

Why should diplomats not write what they mean in what they expect is a confidential forum? Naturally one should expect a high degree of professionalism among people with such positions of responsibility, but it does not mean that in some cases you canīt say your honest opinion when you write confidentially with colleagues.
December 12th, 2010  
George
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by senojekips
Coming from you I find that somewhat amusing. For someone with so much to say, you don't really have a very good grasp of what is news and what's out of date in world events do you?

Yes,... you are quite right George, is is an ongoing problem, it was also the case with Pearl Harbour, and 9/11 to name but two of the more notable examples, neither of which would have needed information sharing outside of the US intelligence community.
Same thing with Pearl Harbor. One reason the OSS was created was to coordinate & evaluate intel from Army & Navy Intelligence, FBI ect. Eventually they're just another Agency competing for funds & each other.
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Boots
December 12th, 2010  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by George
Same thing with Pearl Harbor. One reason the OSS was created was to coordinate & evaluate intel from Army & Navy Intelligence, FBI ect. Eventually they're just another Agency competing for funds & each other.
Now that sounds pretty typical of government agencies all around the free world,... more interested in ways of increasing their next year's budget than actually doing what they were set up for.
December 12th, 2010  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seehund
Why should diplomats not write what they mean in what they expect is a confidential forum? Naturally one should expect a high degree of professionalism among people with such positions of responsibility, but it does not mean that in some cases you canīt say your honest opinion when you write confidentially with colleagues.
Well this one is easy, the minute you put something in a record-able form is the minute you can expect it to eventually enter the public domain.

I am on the whole a little concerned with the Wikileaks thing, on one hand I am a firm believer in public knowing what is being done in "our" name but if that information is endangering people (and as yet there is nothing to say that it is) then it needs to be withheld until such times as it wont endanger them.
December 12th, 2010  
A Can of Man
 
 
Apparently the names of informants in Afghanistan have been leaked, so that would be a current danger to lives.
December 12th, 2010  
Ted
 
 
I reckon that you can secure as much as you'd like, but it won't help. There will always be people, with access, that will leak. The tragedy if mankind is that too many have no self-reflection and too fragile an ego. When they are by-passed or something, they feel the need to "get even". Leaking secret info is one way. And you can never eliminate the human factor in all this work, so the leaking won't stop, no matter what.
December 12th, 2010  
Chukpike
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Can of Man
Apparently the names of informants in Afghanistan have been leaked, so that would be a current danger to lives.
It does not have to be just informants. Diplomats or citizens that speak out or comment confidentially that they disagree with Al Qaeda, the Taliban, or any other radical group would find themselves targets.

Look at the bombing in Sweden. Bombing claimed to be because of a cartoon.
December 12th, 2010  
A Can of Man
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chukpike
Look at the bombing in Sweden. Bombing claimed to be because of a cartoon.
Not just the cartoon.
Probably has more to do with Swedish troop presence in Afghanistan.
December 12th, 2010  
Chukpike
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by A Can of Man
Not just the cartoon.
Probably has more to do with Swedish troop presence in Afghanistan.
The point is the cartoonist has been marked for death. Muslim groups have called for his death. In talking about names being mentioned in the leaked information, it will be the terrorists who read the names that decide who and when to attack.
The bombers gave two reasons for the bombing, can't really assign a level of importance to either.
 


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