When a tree is not a tree - Page 3




 
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February 27th, 2015  
BritinAfrica
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Queensman
Haig was actually ore careful with the lives of his soldiers than some people think, field marshal French was replaced with hair, French was a bitter man who gained pleasure from belittling one of his better subordinates dorien-smyth.
He ruined his subordinates reputation and his own through blaming others for his mistakes and not following orders as well as being uncooperative with his French allies.
Having one of his subordinates took over because French had already besmirched dorien smyth.
With the nature of the fighting on the western front, how could haig of done differently?
The French replaced there generals constantly, but every time it all ended up the same, hundreds of thousands dead and injured for a few miles of land.
The truth is that Britain didn't have anyone who could replace him and do any better, the end results would of been the same. However the backs against the wall message and steadfastness of haig certainly helped save the british army in 1918.
My Granddad served with the Middlesex Regiment on the Somme, he was there when hill 60 was blown up. The stories he told were horrific, the loss of life horrendous.

As you will know troops advanced through no mans land at a walk carrying heavy kit, in the face of machine guns??? Sandhurst Military Academy did quite a lot research into this tactic using modern training aids, they found less lives would be lost if kit was dumped and short dashes across open ground.

He did the same in the Boer War, he sent thousands of troops across open ground against well entrenched Boer riflemen. Again the slaughter was horrific.
February 27th, 2015  
JOC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BritinAfrica
My Granddad served with the Middlesex Regiment on the Somme, he was there when hill 60 was blown up. The stories he told were horrific, the loss of life horrendous.

As you will know troops advanced through no mans land at a walk carrying heavy kit, in the face of machine guns??? Sandhurst Military Academy did quite a lot research into this tactic using modern training aids, they found less lives would be lost if kit was dumped and short dashes across open ground.

He did the same in the Boer War, he sent thousands of troops across open ground against well entrenched Boer riflemen. Again the slaughter was horrific.
My great uncle Jack was in the British army and said they had to eat their own horses and boot leather to keep from staving. He said trench life was horrific sometimes flooded, sometimes filled with snow. From the way he spoke it was a miracle any of them survived. Over the top was virtually a death sentence. I believe he lost 3 or 4 brothers on the western front. The details are a bit fuzzy since he passed some 40 years ago. It amazing how well these guys did for themselves after the war considering the strain this must have but on their nerves.
February 27th, 2015  
BritinAfrica
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOC
My great uncle Jack was in the British army and said they had to eat their own horses and boot leather to keep from staving. He said trench life was horrific sometimes flooded, sometimes filled with snow. From the way he spoke it was a miracle any of them survived. Over the top was virtually a death sentence. I believe he lost 3 or 4 brothers on the western front. The details are a bit fuzzy since he passed some 40 years ago. It amazing how well these guys did for themselves after the war considering the strain this must have but on their nerves.
My Granddad was wounded three times, gassed and frostbitten, he totally lost his sense of smell. "

Without a doubt it was a miracle any of them survived.

A very senior officer visiting the front line for the first time was heard to remark, "Good God, are you telling me men live and fight in these conditions.

The propaganda of the time, they were fighting for, Land Fit For Hero's". Many of those Hero's ended up selling matches on street corners to survive. My Granddad couldn't find work and had to succumb to what was called "The means test." A government official came to where he lived and told him to sell what little furniture her had, the icing on the cake was, he told my Grandmother to sell her wedding ring. My Grandfather assaulted him and threw him out. By some miracle he survived collecting scrap metal and selling it.
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February 27th, 2015  
lljadw
 
The Polish cavalry was in reality mounted infantry which was not used against tanks but against German supply forces,besides,the Germans had also a calry division,and Britain and France had also cavalry units .
February 28th, 2015  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOC
My great uncle Jack was in the British army and said they had to eat their own horses and boot leather to keep from staving. He said trench life was horrific sometimes flooded, sometimes filled with snow. From the way he spoke it was a miracle any of them survived. Over the top was virtually a death sentence. I believe he lost 3 or 4 brothers on the western front. The details are a bit fuzzy since he passed some 40 years ago. It amazing how well these guys did for themselves after the war considering the strain this must have but on their nerves.
All those soldiers living in conditions like that and with the livestock behind the lines brought something nasty with them when they returned back home. This little nasty thing killed more people than the war. This little nasty thing did something odd. Usually the mortality rate of an outbreak of a flu kill the young and the elderly. The graphs of the mortality rate and age usually have an U shape, the flu pandemic in 1918-19 has a W shape. The first sign of this killer appeared in 1916 when it decimated British units at one part of the front line. The living conditions during the Great War contributed to the pandemic. Packing a lot of people together for an extended period of time in conditions like the trenches and then send them back home.
March 1st, 2015  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetvet
We always think of Germany invading Poland when in fact Russia was also in on the invasion , why didn't France and England declare war on Russia ? , politics make's for strange bedfellows .
Umm I have read a rather odd story about this that claimed because Germany had all but destroyed Poland the Russian invasion was not considered an invasion as Poland had ceased to be a functioning state by the time they crossed the border.

I imagine that no matter what the story really was there would have been a lot of hand ringing to come up with the answer.
March 1st, 2015  
BritinAfrica
 
 
I have to agree with Tetvet, but remember Chamberlain was a hand wringing appeaser.

Two people realised war was imminent, Churchill and R.J. Mitchell the designer of the Spitfire. R.J. Mitchell spent a lot of time in Germany, he realised what was happening. He cut short his time in Germany then rushed back to Super Marine to carry on with his work.

What was disgusting, at the VE Day march past in London, the Poles were not allowed to take part.
March 1st, 2015  
LeEnfield
 
 
Now General Haig learnt slowly, but what happened when the Americans joined the war. They made the same mistakes and advanced in open order across no mans land and got cut to ribbons even when they were told about the losses they would face if they did it, they reckoned that they knew best and carried on doing this for the last year of the war right up to and including the 11th November.
March 1st, 2015  
BritinAfrica
 
 
To be honest matey, I don't think Haig ever learned. You only have to look at his record during the Anglo Boer War, he should have learned from that, but he didn't.
March 1st, 2015  
JOC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetvet
We always think of Germany invading Poland when in fact Russia was also in on the invasion , why didn't France and England declare war on Russia ? , politics make's for strange bedfellows .
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Umm I have read a rather odd story about this that claimed because Germany had all but destroyed Poland the Russian invasion was not considered an invasion as Poland had ceased to be a functioning state by the time they crossed the border.

I imagine that no matter what the story really was there would have been a lot of hand ringing to come up with the answer.
I believe England realized that Germany posed the real treat. France was a natural enemy to Germany. Also the USSR was considered to have an army that was not nearly so threatening as that of the Germans at this point in time. What's surprising is their declaration of war meant virtually nothing. It became known as the sitzkrieg or phony war until Germany invaded Norway.
 


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