USS Liberty - Israel's "War of Self Defense" - Page 21




 
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December 19th, 2009  
viewer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hmmm
Funny how no one ever liked the Jews, and that's going back thousands of years.
Maybe there's a reason (and I don't think it'd be biblical)?
sure, a few reasons:
1.they started ww1 and ww2
2.they brought hitler to power (panzercracker TM)
3.they dropped 2 A-bombs on japan
4.they stand behind the 11/9
5.they stole the lands of the Indigenous Australians, hey but those suckers were primitives and they got the health care in return so its okay (seno TM)
7.they stole your cookies!!! this one is their most horrible atrocity:<

I can continue, but now you have enough reasons to hate those nasty jews.
---> goes back to reading and laughing mode
December 19th, 2009  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hmmm
Funny how no one ever liked the Jews, and that's going back thousands of years.
Maybe there's a reason (and I don't think it'd be biblical)?
Oddly enough I think the reason is a lot more simple than you would expect and it doesnt only apply to Jews, it applies to all minorities.

Basically they are easy targets, when you have a group that does not assimilate into local culture and are visibly different (looks, clothing, practices, [insert any difference here]) then you have food for discontent.

I will back this up with other examples:
- The Yugoslav breakup (Bosnia and Kosovo).
- Tribal conflicts throughout Africa.
- Jews throughout history.
- Chinese minorities throughout Asia.

These were all about picking on an easy target to take the focus off failure elsewhere or to provide unity against a common cause (not necessarily a justifiable one).
December 19th, 2009  
EladBell
 
 
Again a little precentage of the world population is to be blamed for everything.
lets forget the radiclas:P
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December 19th, 2009  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by viewer
5.they stole the lands of the Indigenous Australians, hey but those suckers were primitives and they got the health care in return so its okay (seno TM)
Yeah, the difference is that we never used the Military, we never bulldozed their houses and fruit orchards, beating stoning and murdering them if they did not comply. Also our ancestors had given it up by the second half of the 19th century and are not still doing it today. Had we have not colonised the country, the Dutch, Spanish or Indonesians would have, and the Aborigines know what that would have meant for them.

You should study some history before you put your foot in your mouth in future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EladBell
Again a little precentage of the world population is to be blamed for everything.
lets forget the radiclas:P
Why,.... they are the ones who are causing the troubles, and the Israeli Government supports them. If you want the world to respect you , you have to clean up your own act first.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Oddly enough I think the reason is a lot more simple than you would expect and it doesnt only apply to Jews, it applies to all minorities.

Basically they are easy targets, when you have a group that does not assimilate into local culture and are visibly different (looks, clothing, practices, [insert any difference here]) then you have food for discontent.

I will back this up with other examples:
- The Yugoslav breakup (Bosnia and Kosovo).
- Tribal conflicts throughout Africa.
- Jews throughout history.
- Chinese minorities throughout Asia.

These were all about picking on an easy target to take the focus off failure elsewhere or to provide unity against a common cause (not necessarily a justifiable one).
But bearing in mind that this has been going on for 2000 years can you think of any of these groups that have caused as much bloodshed and distrust over so long a period as the Jews, pretty much being despised and distrusted wherever they go.

I do admit that some Jewish habits regarding dress, grooming and religious practices do cause others to look at them differently.
December 19th, 2009  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by senojekips
But bearing in mind that this has been going on for 2000 years can you think of any of these groups that have caused as much bloodshed and distrust over so long a period as the Jews, pretty much being despised and distrusted wherever they go.

I do admit that some Jewish habits regarding dress, grooming and religious practices do cause others to look at them differently.
More so than I would believe they have a 3000 year old plan to destroy the world.

The simple reality is that humans have a history of using and persecuting minorities whether it was the Nero blaming the Christians for burning down Rome or Hitler blaming the Jews for the German General Staffs failure to win WW1, we are not a species that tolerate differences well especially when whipped up by religion or political means.
December 20th, 2009  
senojekips
 
 
Perhaps i have led a sheltered existence, but I have never heard of this "Plan",..... well,... not outside the ramblings of the lunatic fringe.

But can you think of one single minority who has been displaced, distrusted and despised on such a huge scale ovr such a long period almost without let up, right through to the present day in many places?

Many branches of christianity have been persecuted, so too many other ethic and religious minorities, but these periods of persecution generally lasted no longer than a few generations. If these minorities migrated, that was usually the end of their troubles in their adopted country, not so the Jewish people, they seem to take their troubles with them. Plus there are many more minorities in the world that don't attract anything like the distrust that has been heaped upon the Jews.

Just Google about a little, and I think even you will agree, that if the amount of material found on the Internet is any indication, it would be very fair to say that the Jews are probably only second to the Muslims in the US in the distrust stakes, prior to 9/11 they would surely have been outright winners. This is a world wide trend, but I feel it is most noticeable in the US.

OK,... so people are paranoid about the Jews, but certainly on a seemingly disproportionate scale taking into account their percentage of the overall population,..... the question I ask is, why?

When the Vietnamese boat people landed here in Australia, they too suffered a great deal of distrust and hatred, (some of it richly deserved, some not) now a generation later it is minimal and I would say solely the province of the xenophobic minority whom we shall never educate or be rid of. In one generation these people have largely gained public acceptance, they are still perhaps not as accepted as the Jewish community, but given a similar amount of time and they will not even be noticed, whereas I still hear comments like , "They're Jewish" or "What would you expect, they are Jews".
December 20th, 2009  
MontyB
 
 
People are paranoid about difference, it doesnt matter if you are Jewish or not it is just human nature.

My suspicion would be that they have recieved a larger portion of suspicion simply because they have been a recognised and organised group a lot longer than most, for example it would be difficult to find a 300AD account of Muslim persicution since the religion did not show up until 700AD but by the same token you will see a leveling of the playing field once Europe decided they wanted to play in the middle east from 900AD onwards.

The fact remains that humans can not live together happily and will always look for differences to focus on.
December 20th, 2009  
-- Dusty
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by senojekips
As you say, there is an almost unbroken history of Jewish persecution for 2000+ years. It does beg the question, why is this one minority so despised, by so many other groups?

I don't hate the Jews, a great part of my family is Jewish, and I am of part Jewish descendency. My disagreement is with the Zionists among them, that preach hatred and murder.

All religions and ethnicities seem to be despised and treated with disdain at some period of their existence, however it rarely lasts more than a few generations. There must be some reason why the Jews have suffered this hatred for all this time.

If current problems in Palestine are any example of their religious character and the way they think and act, I now think I know why.

It's certainly food for thought.
I know that from my experience with today's Jews, I'm far from impressed. As I have found out first hand,
they are above the law;
if you don't agree with them 100% on everything, you're a nazi-supporter;
if you don't agree with them 100% on everything, you're a dirty racist bastard;
just because they are Jewish, they have the "god-given right" to the details of my/your personal life;
FEW, and I mean VERY FEW, have gone far enough to earn my respect. And they call me anti-semetic? Well, I'm only as anti-semetic as they are anti-American. I don't love nazis, I don't support nazis, and if I'm the racist or nazi-supporter because I don't agree with them on everything, then who's the real bigot? Me or them?


Quote:
Originally Posted by EladBell
Again a little precentage of the world population is to be blamed for everything.
lets forget the radiclas:P
No worries, mate. We won't forget about you!
December 20th, 2009  
senojekips
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
People are paranoid about difference, it doesnt matter if you are Jewish or not it is just human nature.

My suspicion would be that they have recieved a larger portion of suspicion simply because they have been a recognised and organised group a lot longer than most, for example it would be difficult to find a 300AD account of Muslim persicution since the religion did not show up until 700AD but by the same token you will see a leveling of the playing field once Europe decided they wanted to play in the middle east from 900AD onwards.

The fact remains that humans can not live together happily and will always look for differences to focus on.
Possibly true, but I'm not convinced that you are correct for the reasons that I've outlined regarding other minorities around the world. I recognise "differences" in many people, but not on anything like the scale seen with the Jewish people. I worked for years on ships with Russian Officers and Mates, and Chinese crews, they were certainly different, but that did not mean that the great majority of them were not really decent people with whom I enjoyed my time very much.

I am going to drop this line of enquiry for the moment, as I believe that although nothing discussed so far has been in anyway untrue or unfair, it is a very contentious issue that could easily turn ugly very quickly. But it has certainly left me with a lot of food for thought.

I have my suspicions that if I got anywhere near as truthful, with the Zionists, as has been done with various Chinese and Somali forum members, this thread would be locked, and some of us would face possible banning. It is for this reason only, that I am "pulling my punches".
December 25th, 2009  
3dgeo
 
 
Israel paid $13 million compesation for attack on USS liberty, the US TAXPAYER doles out over $10 million per day to Israel and the ship cost over $60 million.Where are the accountants??
According to the Christian Science Monitor,the cost of Israel to America has been over $1.6 TRILLION since 1973.http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/1209/p16s01-wmgn.html

But let's get back to Israel's attack on USS LIBERTY.
2 important notes that might not have been mentioned:
Previous1950's Israeli black flag operation code named Operation Susannah,(see Lavon Affair).
Egyptian Jews were recruited by infamous Mossad to firebomb US and UK targets in Egypt and pin blame on Nasser regime.Aim Of Israel leaders was to foment friction if not war with an Islamic country.US Eisenhower administration forcing Israel,France and UK to withdraw following their combined 1956 invasion of Egypt was building some goodwill
in the Arab world. This was intolerable for Israel.
So Liberty attack with unmarked Israeli planes was a continuation not an exception of Israel modus operandi.
War with the Islamic world has been policy for Israel.
Secondly on June 8,1967 USS Liberty with her state of the art eavdropping equipment was within 13-14 miles off of the newly captured Sinai town of El Arish were the IDF was carrying out mass executions of 300 unarmed Egyptian POW's.
Benyamin Ben Eliezar,future housing MK was in command of IDF Shaked Recon. group and is implicated in the El Arish massacre.
James Bamford's Body of Secrets claims one of the reasons the attack on Liberty was ordered by DM,Mohse Dayan was to coverup the war crime
The other was Israel's impending move on the much covetted headwaters of the Golan Heights.Water is the most precious in mideast.