Stolen Valor




 
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July 5th, 2017  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 

Topic: Stolen Valor


I have been watching "Stolen Valor" videos on YouTube when veterans and active military personnel confronts these phony servicemen (and women)

Some of them are hilariously bad, they phonies don't know the difference between the US Army uniform, the Marine uniform, and/or the Air Force uniform. Some are mixing them or calling themselves Marines when they are wearing the ACU.

They phonies have bought the bronze star, the silver star, and the purple heart and all available ribbons. I cannot of obvious reasons recognize all US military medals and I don't know the exact regulations about wearing a US military uniform.

I don't add any videos, but do a search "Stolen Valor" on YouTube.

An ex Navy Seal calls out a lot of fake Seals and he has seen an increase of fake Seals.

How common is this? Have any of you faced phonies and how do you deal with it?
July 6th, 2017  
BritinAfrica
 
 
If I remember rightly there are or were moves in the UK to make wearing of uniforms and decorations by people who are not entitled to illegal.

If they like wearing uniforms and wearing medals, join up and earn them.
July 6th, 2017  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
I don't say anything if a person is wearing military apparel when they are out fishing, hunting, hiking, camping, and/or other outdoor activities. The clothes are much cheaper than civilian outdoor clothes and they are durable. I have been hiking a lot and it is common to see people wearing military pants, not the entire uniform, though.

When I came across the Stolen Valor thing (it is not common here, we had a mandatory military service) I checked how easy it is to purchase military medals, ribbons, badges, tabs and other things. It seems to be very easy to purchase the items. I checked American online stores and British online stores. I can as a civilian buy British regimental ties, bow ties, cuff links, badges for blazers etc.

The US has or had the Stolen Valor Act, but the law was according to the Supreme Court in conflict with the 1st Amendment. It is illegal here to pretend to be a soldier if you aren't. Sweden doesn't have any economic benefits for the veterans and that might be the reason for why we don't see it here. Service personnel have discounts, but they must provide with the military ID to get and discounts.

According to the YouTube vids, US veterans get really upset and angry about phony servicemen. I understand why, it is an insult to the military, the injured, and the dead. Why some people do this? Oh well, they want the economic benefits, they want have the respect from the civilians. I also think many of the fake soldiers have mental issues.

Something I have reacted to is how US military veterans correct the wrongs about the phonies uniform and that is bad. Why to teach the fakes about how to wear a uniform
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July 7th, 2017  
BritinAfrica
 
 
I've no problem with civvies wearing combat clothing when shooting or fishing etc, I object strongly when the walts attempt to convince people they served when they haven''t.
July 7th, 2017  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by I3BrigPvSk
I don't say anything if a person is wearing military apparel when they are out fishing, hunting, hiking, camping, and/or other outdoor activities. The clothes are much cheaper than civilian outdoor clothes and they are durable. I have been hiking a lot and it is common to see people wearing military pants, not the entire uniform, though.

When I came across the Stolen Valor thing (it is not common here, we had a mandatory military service) I checked how easy it is to purchase military medals, ribbons, badges, tabs and other things. It seems to be very easy to purchase the items. I checked American online stores and British online stores. I can as a civilian buy British regimental ties, bow ties, cuff links, badges for blazers etc.

The US has or had the Stolen Valor Act, but the law was according to the Supreme Court in conflict with the 1st Amendment. It is illegal here to pretend to be a soldier if you aren't. Sweden doesn't have any economic benefits for the veterans and that might be the reason for why we don't see it here. Service personnel have discounts, but they must provide with the military ID to get and discounts.

According to the YouTube vids, US veterans get really upset and angry about phony servicemen. I understand why, it is an insult to the military, the injured, and the dead. Why some people do this? Oh well, they want the economic benefits, they want have the respect from the civilians. I also think many of the fake soldiers have mental issues.

Something I have reacted to is how US military veterans correct the wrongs about the phonies uniform and that is bad. Why to teach the fakes about how to wear a uniform
We have a similar attitude here to it in that most people just regard the individuals as sad more than criminal, we also don't have a great deal of it happening here as the military is seen as a career rather than some patriotic calling.

The only serviceman I have ever spoken to about it was in the medical corps and replied that he didn't understand it as he usually got far more woman at pubs and parties by telling them he was a doctor.
July 7th, 2017  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
We have a similar attitude here to it in that most people just regard the individuals as sad more than criminal, we also don't have a great deal of it happening here as the military is seen as a career rather than some patriotic calling.

The only serviceman I have ever spoken to about it was in the medical corps and replied that he didn't understand it as he usually got far more woman at pubs and parties by telling them he was a doctor.
Some of the American phonies have forged documents that gives them access to medical treatment, especially if they have forged the documents about the purple heart medal. The VA hospitals are backed up and cannot check the credentials when they are faked. The internet has caused the "copy, paste" issue

The military isn't really an occupation like others. It's different in what they are trained to do and what they do. That makes them different from other professions.
July 8th, 2017  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by I3BrigPvSk
Some of the American phonies have forged documents that gives them access to medical treatment, especially if they have forged the documents about the purple heart medal. The VA hospitals are backed up and cannot check the credentials when they are faked. The internet has caused the "copy, paste" issue
I would assume that would fall under the fraud category of the justice system though.

Quote:
The military isn't really an occupation like others. It's different in what they are trained to do and what they do. That makes them different from other professions.
I think that depends I think on where you are, every profession from accountants to zamboni drivers are trained to different things and have a specialist skill that few others have and "soldier" really isnt that different at its core, if we are solely talking about putting lives on the line then we have more fireman, police and emergency services personnel than we have military.

New Zealand is a relatively patriotic country but we are not bound to the trappings and idols of patriotism (flags, uniforms and anthems) so while the military is supported throughout the country we still see it as just another career, I think this is backed up by the fact that we tend to stay out of trouble so we are not dealing with death and injury figures on a daily basis.

As far as "Stolen Valour" goes I can understand people involved being upset about it and I personally struggle to understand the motives behind it but I believe most countries already have enough civil laws in place to deal with any fraud that may arise from it.
July 9th, 2017  
Remington 1858
 
 
Years ago I worked in the aerospace industry. In our laboratory there was a technician who talked endlessly about his experiences in the Vietnam War. He went into great detail about the operations, the conditions, the blood and gore. He claimed to have been a U.S. Marine at the Khe Sanh siege.
In later years I learned that the guy was a complete phony! The man had never even been in the military. He had read every book about the war and would drop names of people and places from his reading. He made it sound very realistic. Some of these posers are very good.
July 9th, 2017  
I3BrigPvSk
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington 1858
Years ago I worked in the aerospace industry. In our laboratory there was a technician who talked endlessly about his experiences in the Vietnam War. He went into great detail about the operations, the conditions, the blood and gore. He claimed to have been a U.S. Marine at the Khe Sanh siege.
In later years I learned that the guy was a complete phony! The man had never even been in the military. He had read every book about the war and would drop names of people and places from his reading. He made it sound very realistic. Some of these posers are very good.
We cannot see this kind of behavior here (what I know of) Would you say it is common in the US?

I have also pondered why this occur. There are many reasons, I guess. One seems to get the discounts at Starbucks, Taco Bell, and all the other fast food chains. They might be homeless and poor. Some might have mental issues, and others have only found a new way to scam people.

They can potentially make it harder for the real veterans and their organization to get support from the civilians. Especially, if the "vet" outside Walmart is a fake one and only scam people
July 14th, 2017  
Remington 1858
 
 
I don't think the phenomenon is limited to the U.S. In the U.K. posers such as described here are called "Walts". Short for Walter Mitty a fictional character who has a rich fantasy life in which he imagines himself as a heroic figure.
I think you will see the military phony in any country where the military is held in high esteem. That is not very many countries. In most places fakers prefer to pass themselves off as successful business people or celebrities.
 


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