"Speak English" - Page 4




View Poll Results :Should the sign be taken down?
Yes 3 13.04%
No 20 86.96%
Voters: 23. You may not vote on this poll

 
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"Speak English"
 
March 26th, 2008  
mmarsh
 
 
"Speak English"
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03USMC
Because someone does not speak english does not make them illegal.

Fluency in english is not a requirement for legal entry into the United States. Nor is it a requirement for a Resident Alien ID (Green Card).

Your logic that a person of Latino heritage who does not speak english as well as you think or would like them to must be illegal. Is flawed at best and racist at worst. Unless you have checked their documentation you have no way of knowing.

It's called profiling.
Good Point.
March 26th, 2008  
03USMC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixiedustboo
I am speaking specifically about those who ARE here illegally.

I believe knowing the language should be a requirement for a green card. (Being that of a full time resident and planning on living in the country). In cases like that I totally understand and empathize with those that are trying to learn the language.
And yet you appear to be making blanket judgements concerning a persons level of ability in a second language.

I grew up speaking two languages. My grandmother (born in the United States) could speak english, not well but she could speak it. The reason was that the community we lived in spanish was the language used for most things everyday. You can go down on the border now and it's the same in some places still.

My mother in law and father in law are legal immigrants. Their grasp of the english language is rudimentry at best. My wife and my brother in law are bilingual they were both born in Mexico. They learned english as children.

For an adult with no exposure to a second language to learn that language at any speed is harder than for a child to learn it. I've been studying Dari for the last year and I'm probably not even +1/+1 in that language.
March 26th, 2008  
Damien435
 
 
Even here in South Dakota, which doesn't see a huge influx of immigrants, there are communities where few people speak English. Quite a few of the Hutterite colonies speak German and I think there's still one Welsh speaking town around here. I agree with 03 that the generalizations about all non-English speaking immigrants being illegal is quite ignorant. Plus such generalizations make it harder for those who want to do something about the immigration problem and want to differentiate between immigrants and illegal immigrants.
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"Speak English"
March 26th, 2008  
ASTRALdragon
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
For example he could put up a sign to say "This is my establishment and orders will only be taken in English"
Lol that's the tactful version of the guy's sign.

Taken from Wikipedia itself, "Although the United States has no official language at the federal level, English is the national language." I believe that the U.S. has not legislated an official language because it would shoot down the notion that the U.S. is a true melting pot of cultures and languages. The freedoms and liberties that the U.S. was built upon would mean little if they forced its citizens to learn the language of the land. However, it is sort of an unwritten requirement to learn the language if you are to survive in a country where 99.99% of its people speak it. A crafty and noble idea imho on behalf of the U.S. government.
March 26th, 2008  
A Can of Man
 
 
I'm a South Korean citizen with a rudimentary/Marine handle of Korean and speak American English as my first language. So what the heck am I supposed to be?
March 26th, 2008  
mmarsh
 
 
13th Redneck

Just to get off topic for a sec. I am confused you're South Korean, but speak only basic Korean, and English as a first language? How did that happen? Did you grow-up overseas?

Back to topic.

I agree with MontyB, the sign is Patronizing, condescending and smacks of Xenophobia. You don't need to treat people like they just got off the boat from outer Mongolia, especially when you are trying to sell your product to them. Its not a good business practice to be rude to your clientèle. Especially when the competition is literally across the street.

The sign could simply say, "When ordering, please speak English Thank you. -the Management". I seriously doubt the minority groups would have objected had it been phrased like this. The lack of 'please' and 'thank you' when addressing people is considered very rude in America.
March 28th, 2008  
Marinerhodes
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 03USMC
Because someone does not speak english does not make them illegal.

Fluency in english is not a requirement for legal entry into the United States. Nor is it a requirement for a Resident Alien ID (Green Card).

Your logic that a person of Latino heritage who does not speak english as well as you think or would like them to must be illegal. Is flawed at best and racist at worst. Unless you have checked their documentation you have no way of knowing.

It's called profiling.
So how are they to take the citizenship tests? Are they now produced in a foreign language of choice? Seems to me that even if you can not speak or read English "fluently" they should at least be able to communicate basic wants and needs. Some legal alien residents can not even do that. I have lived in CO and CA. I met alot of folks that could not speak english. It is utterly asinine to not expect a person that is a legal resident to not speak enough of the english language to be able to order from a menu.

Could the guy have said it differently? Sure. Should he have to say it differently? No. It is afterall a free country right? I mean that seems to me, reading a bit between the lines, what everyone is saying about a person not having to speak the english language. So he can say what he wants within reason, which I feel he has, and he should not be condemned for it.
March 28th, 2008  
A Can of Man
 
 
The free country argument does have its limits.
"Whites Only."
March 28th, 2008  
Marinerhodes
 
 
Whites Only? That is racism. We are talking about a language.

By free country I mean this:

If Person A should not be required to speak english then the reverse should hold true in that Person B, that may be unable to speak Person A's language should not be required to serve them.

This is not discrimination or racism as the law sees it. It is simply the proprietor's right to refuse service.
March 28th, 2008  
03USMC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marinerhodes
So how are they to take the citizenship tests? Are they now produced in a foreign language of choice? Seems to me that even if you can not speak or read English "fluently" they should at least be able to communicate basic wants and needs. Some legal alien residents can not even do that. I have lived in CO and CA. I met alot of folks that could not speak english. It is utterly asinine to not expect a person that is a legal resident to not speak enough of the english language to be able to order from a menu.

Could the guy have said it differently? Sure. Should he have to say it differently? No. It is afterall a free country right? I mean that seems to me, reading a bit between the lines, what everyone is saying about a person not having to speak the english language. So he can say what he wants within reason, which I feel he has, and he should not be condemned for it.
You are confusing Citizenship and Resident Alien Status. There is no test for RAS, an application and interview and investigation process. It's also the first step in the process for citizenship. Most aliens who are RAS and wishing to advance to Citizenship do learn the language in order to pass the citizenship process. However there are some who are content with RAS and leave it at that.

My argument was with the statements being made that painted persons with low english language skills as illegal. With no proof to back it up.

Further I could give a red p**s about what sign a business owner hangs in his place of business. It's his business he can run it however he wants.