Russia 'could destroy NATO ships in Black Sea within 20 minutes'

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Russia's Black Sea Fleet is capable of destroying NATO's naval strike group currently deployed in the sea within 20 minutes, a former fleet commander said on Friday.

Russia's General Staff said on Tuesday there were 10 NATO ships in the Black Sea - three U.S. warships, the Polish frigate General Pulaski, the German frigate FGS Lubeck, and the Spanish guided missile frigate Admiral Juan de Borbon, as well as four Turkish vessels. Eight more warships are expected to join the group.

"Despite the apparent strength, the NATO naval group in the Black Sea is not battle-worthy," Admiral Eduard Baltin said. "If necessary, a single missile salvo from the Moskva missile cruiser and two or three missile boats would be enough to annihilate the entire group."

"Within 20 minutes the waters would be clear," he said, stressing that despite major reductions, the Black Sea Fleet (Image gallery) still has a formidable missile arsenal.

However, Baltin said the chances of a military confrontation between NATO and Russia in the Black Sea are negligible.

"We will not strike first, and they do not look like people with suicidal tendencies," he said.

In addition to its flagship, the Moskva guided missile cruiser, Russia's Black Sea Fleet includes at least three destroyers, two guided missile frigates, four guided missile corvettes and six missile boats.

NATO announced its decision to deliver humanitarian aid to Georgia after the conclusion of hostilities between Tbilisi and Moscow over breakaway South Ossetia on August 12. Moscow recognized on Tuesday both South Ossetia and Abkhazia, another breakaway Georgia republic, despite being urged by Western leaders not to do so.

Russia's General Staff later said the alliance's naval deployment in the Black Sea "cannot fail to provoke concern", with unidentified sources in the Russian military saying a surface strike group was being gathered there.

According to Russian military intelligence sources, the NATO warships that have entered the Black Sea are between them carrying over 100 Tomahawk cruise missiles and Harpoon anti-ship missiles.

http://en.rian.ru/russia/20080829/116377956.html
 
Hell I dare em to attack any NATO vessel. It's saber rattling. I don't believe Putin is that crazy.
 
Russians know, just know, that Georgia (minus the Russian occupied regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia) will be admitted to NATO, so they're just playing all bully and aggressive and trying to avoid that. But chit could really hit the fan if Georgia doesn't recognize those breakaway regions' independence and it's admitted to NATO anyway. That'd mean boom!, Russia is illegally occupying a NATO country. :(
 
Russians know, just know, that Georgia (minus the Russian occupied regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia) will be admitted to NATO, so they're just playing all bully and aggressive and trying to avoid that. But chit could really hit the fan if Georgia doesn't recognize those breakaway regions' independence and it's admitted to NATO anyway. That'd mean boom!, Russia is illegally occupying a NATO country. :(
Don't recognize the breakaway regions, and don't let Georgia recognize them. Bring Georgia into NATO. That will force the Russians to back down, or start a war.
 
I think at its simplest form, what Russia is telling to Georgia is this: "No business without taxation. I will let you join NATO. But you'll have to pay for it by giving me one third of your land."

Going to war with Russia (EU's largest energy provider with other significant international partnerships, especially with China, Iran, Syria, Libya, Venezuela...) over a couple of small breakaway regions doesn't make sense from NATO's perspective either. Russia knows this. It's a fight of two strong bluffs.
 
Don't recognize the breakaway regions, and don't let Georgia recognize them. Bring Georgia into NATO. That will force the Russians to back down, or start a war.

Do you seriously think either side will win in a full on confrontation?

Both sides are playing games over Georgia but when push comes to shove are you seriously prepared to risk a nuclear confrontation over the place which is the only remaining step after the two sides engage and one side gets to the stage of losing.
In terms of a conventional war I am confident that western forces are more than a match for Russian forces but I am not as confident that any western force has the logistical capability to take on Russia in its own back yard.

Waving a big stick and pretending to be tough by demanding things be done your way only works until you meet someone prepared to call your bluff and I would suggest that Russia is getting damn close to calling that bluff.
 
No. Nor do I expect one to happen.

Then why rattle the sabre, if you posture and back down it does as much damage as if you hadn't done anything at all.

In the case of warships in the Black Sea Russia is right the internationally recognised Montreux Convention says they can only stay 21 days, so you have a few options:
A) You can ignore the treaty but then don't ***** when some other country decides to break treaties to suit their own needs.
B) You can follow the rules, sail out of the black sea turn around and sail back in for another 21 days.
C) You can reach an agreement with the countries of the Black Sea that allows you to stay by mutual consent (which I would suggest is the more mature option) and if that fails then you fall back to option B.

One thing I would be interested in knowing though is how much "aid" Georgia actually needs and how much of this is the US playing political games as well.
 
I have no doubt that Russia could "crap cinderblocks" if the had a square @rsehole. But until then, I believe it's all just hot air.

Brinksmanship that only a lunatic would follow through on.
 
I agree nothing will come of any of this chest beating because no one is going to risk global destruction over a worthless piece of rock but what is worrying is this constant effort of"one up-manship" that seems to be gripping the region, eventually they may get stupid enough to talk themselves into a war.
 
Funny that Russia believes such a thing. Turkey has a good navy force and also other NATO navy forces will not watch Russia attacking to NATO forces there. Greece and Italy is not far from Blacksea. New NATO members Romania and Bulgaria may not watch the conflict in Blacksea. I think someone is dreaming...
 
Funny that Russia believes such a thing. Turkey has a good navy force and also other NATO navy forces will not watch Russia attacking to NATO forces there. Greece and Italy is not far from Blacksea. New NATO members Romania and Bulgaria may not watch the conflict in Blacksea. I think someone is dreaming...
I think that Russia is certainly capable. Whether they actually will is speculation. If they do, there very well could be a large war.

Which is why I don't think they will. Russia isn't ready to fight NATO, and they know it.
 
Yes, but also, not all such things end up in a full blown war. As long as both sides keep possessing arsenals full of nuclear weapons and intercontinental missiles, I doubt there'd ever be a full blown NATO/Russia war. It'd easily destroy the world as we know it. Nukes are just too big of a deterrent.

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So one tell me why a strike group is delivering humanitarian supplies not much room on USCGC DALLAS for those supplies I served 3 years on her sister ship USCGC JARVIS. They can carry some supplies but not all that much.
 
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