Prisoner Photos by Navy SEALs - Page 2




 
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December 6th, 2004  
RnderSafe
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by egoz
i meant they got caught degrading POWs. now it's being investigated because there is photographic evidence of what they were doing.
Again, you assume they got caught "degrading" EPWs because the media tells you to. You don't know the facts behind the photos, you don't know the circumstances .. and from a professional point of view, the majority look like intelligence photos. Your judgements do not come from anything more than a knee jerk reaction.
December 6th, 2004  
Kane
 
I'm stumped on those photos, no comment.....................
December 6th, 2004  
egoz
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RnderSafe
Again, you assume they got caught "degrading" EPWs because the media tells you to. You don't know the facts behind the photos, you don't know the circumstances .. and from a professional point of view, the majority look like intelligence photos. Your judgements do not come from anything more than a knee jerk reaction.
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/20...8781507524.jpg
ok, let's say you're right and they are intel photos. explain how sitting on a tied up prisoner while smiling and posing for a camera is professional. i'm not an intel agent but from a professional point of view maybe you could tell me how this particular situation fits in. you're right, a majority of the photos look like intel photos. but that doesn't change the fact that some of them are questionable.

i admit the source of these photos is questionable, since it is a chinese news agency. and the possibility is there that we can take these photos out of context. but how far out of context could someone possibly be in some of these situations?Edited to remove photo
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December 6th, 2004  
RnderSafe
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by egoz
ok, let's say you're right and they are intel photos. explain how sitting on a tied up prisoner while smiling and posing for a camera is professional. i'm not an intel agent but from a professional point of view maybe you could tell me how this particular situation fits in. you're right, a majority of the photos look like intel photos. but that doesn't change the fact that some of them are questionable.

i admit the source of these photos is questionable, since it is a chinese news agency. and the possibility is there that we can take these photos out of context. but how far out of context could someone possibly be in some of these situations?
I see a photo of an operator .. nothing more, nothing less. How do you know he is posing .. did you ask him? Were you there? Do you know why he may be sitting as he is? Do you know why he's smiling? Is smiling a crime by those sitting in the safety of their living rooms, passing judgements on nothing more than a few images? Do you know this particular team's OPTEMP? Do you know the circumstances of which this particular photograph was taken? Do you know the events prior? It is always a good idea to know the facts before passing judgement.

I've said enough on this, debating this with those who like to think they know it all, yet, have never been there, is a fruitless effort.

Btw, these men's faces are posted on enough sites .. you need only have provided the link, there is no need to continue this careless and ignorant violation of PERSEC.


To get back on topic, the photos in question, thanks to the media elites - will deliver a blow to SOF operations, however, I do not see this causing a lasting problem with the rapport already built between various SOF units and Iraqis. They will continue to garner trust, collect intelligence, work with the indigs, and make positive contacts.
December 6th, 2004  
Bratwurst
 
Quote:
To get back on topic, the photos in question, thanks to the media elites - will deliver a blow to SOF operations,
Yeah, poor SOF... What a blow...

It is interesting how you dismiss these pictures as violation of security, while sparing not a single thought on their content.

Was Abu Ghraib a big media show as well?

I personally hope the "media elites" will dig even deeper and will display their findings without any censorship and with all due consequence.

edit: false tag
December 6th, 2004  
A Can of Man
 
 
A picture is worth a thousand words, and it also tells a million different stories. You need to know the context behind the photo
December 6th, 2004  
Bratwurst
 
Quote:
You need to know the context behind the photo
Precisely. So I hope it will be investigated in detail by objective eyes...
Some feel this isn't done (including myself of course ).

Take a look at this weird procedure:
http://newstandardnews.net/content/?...em&itemid=1259
December 6th, 2004  
RnderSafe
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bratwurst
It is interesting how you dismiss these pictures as violation of security, while sparing not a single thought on their content.
I have dismissed nothing. In fact, if you had actually read what I've written, you will see I'm refraining from passing judgment on the photos until I have all of the facts. Something you are not doing, yet, you cry for an objective investigation. Hypocrisy is a funny little thing.

Quote:
Was Abu Ghraib a big media show as well?
What does that have to do with this discussion? Nothing, and I can think of no reason why you brought it up.

Quote:
I personally hope the "media elites" will dig even deeper and will display their findings without any censorship and with all due consequence.
I cannot even comment on this statement. Unless of course, you really do feel the media should be the convening authority over soldiers lives. By your comment .. who needs courts and investigations, simply let the media decide who is guilty and who isn't! That's a great idea!

Quote:
Precisely. So I hope it will be investigated in detail by objective eyes...
Some feel this isn't done (including myself of course
Of course you don't, because you, yourself are biased and not objective. You feel this isn't being done, yet, you have no idea as to what is being done.

Quote:
Yeah, poor SOF... What a blow...
This comment shows how little you understand of the bigger picture, regardless of this particular team's guilt or innocence .. operations still have to be carried out - lives are still at risk, on both sides. The way you casually you dismiss this shows your complete lack of understanding as well as juvenile pettiness.
December 6th, 2004  
egoz
 
I never said I knew it all. I was making a comment on how the photo was perceived. Seeing as how it can obviously be perceived in a negative light and it has warranted an investigation then others must have seen it the same way I have. If I was wrong then an investigation done by those who understand the circumstances of the situation would correct me.
I've said before that most of the photos there were very professional looking, but you have to see it from the other point of view. There must have been hundreds of pictures taken and we haven't seen nearly all of them. That can be interpreted in two ways, either the rest of the photos really are intel photos and professionally done, or they could show scenes in which the operators look like they are behaving unprofessionally.
December 6th, 2004  
RnderSafe
 
 
Which is why judgement should be reserved.