President Obama breaks another campaign promise

[03USMC]

BTW, I disagree with your example of Lincoln, Lincoln was hugely popular for us Yankees. A better example to what you are saying would be Harry Truman. Unpopular when he left office rehabilitated by History.

quote]

Dunno Lincoln was pretty damn unpopular in your home town and other parts of the North in mid 1863 to the extent that it looked like McClellan might end up as POTUS things turned around but it was touch and go for awhile. His martyrdom kind of clouds that.

 

[The Other Guy]

That at present is only an assumption on your and others parts. History judges presidents. What your saying now is what was said of Lincoln and others. Time and history will judge it in retrospect.

True, but do take into account that when Lincoln left office the war was over.

 

[mmarsh]

BTW, I disagree with your example of Lincoln, Lincoln was hugely popular for us Yankees. A better example to what you are saying would be Harry Truman. Unpopular when he left office rehabilitated by History.

quote]

Dunno Lincoln was pretty damn unpopular in your home town and other parts of the North in mid 1863 to the extent that it looked like McClellan might end up as POTUS things turned around but it was touch and go for awhile. His martyrdom kind of clouds that.

You are correct about New York, but remember as OTG stated he had just won the war, and there is nothing more popular than a president who has had victory on the battlefield. His martyrdom only elevated his popularity to devine level.

Chukpike

You are assuming that presidents are not allowed to change their minds. Once again, you are exhalting another fatal flaw of the previous administration as some kind of twisted virtue. Refusing to listen to another point of view, being stubborn, and not constantly reevualating your own ideas and opinions is a surefire way to disaster. For someone claiming not to have liked Bush, I would have thought in the 8 past years, you'd have been sick of this type mindless "shoot-from-the-hip" approach. "Shoot-yourself-in-the-foot" is a more accurate description.

I dont care if Obama doesnt keep his campaign promise, as I said all campaign promises get broken sooner or later. I just hope his course of action is correct (which we will find out soon enough). If Obama felt that the Military Tribunals was the way to go and that meant changing his mind from what he said in 2008 then I support his decision. At the moment Obama hasnt done anything to make me question his judgement.

 

[A Can of Man]

Maybe we should be glad that he's being flexible and isn't being bound by his election "promises." Even where he does move to correct things, he's moving forward using a lot of caution. There's still a lot of time left but currently his actions do strike me as that of a centrist.

 

[Chukpike]

Chukpike

You are assuming that presidents are not allowed to change their minds. Once again, you are exhalting another fatal flaw of the previous administration as some kind of twisted virtue. Refusing to listen to another point of view, being stubborn, and not constantly reevualating your own ideas and opinions is a surefire way to disaster. For someone claiming not to have liked Bush, I would have thought in the 8 past years, you'd have been sick of this type mindless "shoot-from-the-hip" approach. "Shoot-yourself-in-the-foot" is a more accurate description.

I don't care if Obama doesn't keep his campaign promise, as I said all campaign promises get broken sooner or later. I just hope his course of action is correct (which we will find out soon enough). If Obama felt that the Military Tribunals was the way to go and that meant changing his mind from what he said in 2008 then I support his decision. At the moment Obama hasn't done anything to make me question his judgment.

So, you accept that Obama will break all his promises. So, knowing that no campaign promise will go unbroken, any thought of President Obama bringing Change is just smoke and mirrors. The good thing is if President Obama can just be mediocre he will leave office with a higher approval rating than President Bush. Not a very lofty goal.

To you breaking his promises is no big deal. Just politics as usual. I thought you had higher expectations from this President than the last one. I stand corrected.

 

[A Can of Man]

I don't think many people here ever saw him as some kind of political miracle drug.
I think there is a bit of a change going on, but it's slow and steady. A measured sort of change. Putting some regulation on stuff that ought to be regulated - such as credit.
But again, it's too early to tell. I think in a year or two we'll have a better idea of where things are going.

 

[Rob Henderson]

So, you accept that Obama will break all his promises. So, knowing that no campaign promise will go unbroken, any thought of President Obama bringing Change is just smoke and mirrors. The good thing is if President Obama can just be mediocre he will leave office with a higher approval rating than President Bush. Not a very lofty goal.

Not to say that EVERY campaign promise will be broken, but that, as I stated before, politics is a game of give and take. And perhaps President Obama now knows something he didn't know before taking office. The thought of President Obama bringing change (it's not a proper noun) is NOT smoke and mirrors, it's an ideal. You have to have a little faith that he will take the correct action. A CHANGE from the last 8 years we've lived through... Some of us, anyway.

To you breaking his promises is no big deal. Just politics as usual. I thought you had higher expectations from this President than the last one. I stand corrected.

I have higher expectations of a chimpanzee running this country than I do our last President. That's not a very lofty goal to achieve either.



I would rather have a President who broke campaign promises for the good of the country than a President who would stick to his promises and send the country in a downward spiral.

 

[Chukpike]

I dont care if Obama doesnt keep his campaign promise, as I said all campaign promises get broken sooner or later. I just hope his course of action is correct (which we will find out soon enough). If Obama felt that the Military Tribunals was the way to go and that meant changing his mind from what he said in 2008 then I support his decision. At the moment Obama hasnt done anything to make me question his judgement.

Not to say that EVERY campaign promise will be broken, but that, as I stated before, politics is a game of give and take. And perhaps President Obama now knows something he didn't know before taking office. The thought of President Obama bringing change (it's not a proper noun) is NOT smoke and mirrors, it's an ideal. You have to have a little faith that he will take the correct action. A CHANGE from the last 8 years we've lived through... Some of us, anyway.

Better to match your argument, that President Obama will not break every campaign promise to the man who said he would.

I have higher expectations of a chimpanzee running this country than I do our last President. That's not a very lofty goal to achieve either.

I hope you are not making a racial slur against our President. That is a little low.

 

[A Can of Man]

Chupike, you're not even focusing on the ideas and concepts involved in the argument. You're dallying on "technicalities." Usually something favored by people who realize they're out of ideas.
Rob, sometimes I realize what you're trying to get at but you have to use words that don't use such a broad brush. Think twice before using words like "all" and "every" and then I think you'll get closer to the point you're trying to make.

 

[Rob Henderson]

Better to match your argument, that President Obama will not break every campaign promise to the man who said he would.

I'm not the one who said that particular statement. But it's like I said before, I'd rather him break a campaign promise (read: lie to win) than to bend over while the hardline Democrats have their way with him and his course of action.

I hope you are not making a racial slur against our President. That is a little low.

Where'd you get that idea from? I was merely saying that I believe a chimpanzee to do a better job running the country than our last President. I never liked him, and never will. Even a chimp learns that you don't touch the oven when it's on after he touches it the first time.


Redneck... The problem with being vague is that you have folks like Chukpike here who will misinterpret (whether accidentally or on purpose) your views.

 

[Partisan]

As far as I can see Obama is trying to do the right thing, but is being stymied by politicians who are due for re-election, next year.

Gitmo has been a blot on the American escutcheon since it opened, so he want's to correct that - well done.

But what happens to those interns that other countries don't want? Good question, so let's look at the facts.

Who paid the bounties for these people, let's not review that dubious methodology. Who has held these people without trial for between 2 - 4 years? Now my country (GB) is as complicit in this whole situation, but I think that before the American politicians start wringing their hands and saying that everyone else needs to take on these people they need to look at the situation and who has created it.

Terrorists aren't special - they're criminals & as such should be tried under the rule of law (which is after all what we're promoting). If they're convicted then they take the appropriate sentence, if not then send them to their home country. If their home country doesn't want them then you have to accept the consequences & just monitor them.

 

[Chukpike]

I'm not the one who said that particular statement. But it's like I said before, I'd rather him break a campaign promise (read: lie to win) than to bend over while the hardline Democrats have their way with him and his course of action.

Your talking about people not reading. A if you read the statement you would see it was mmarsh his name is at the top.

It is you who doesn't read, then you go off pleased with your self about how stubborn the Republican Donkey is. You need to quit blaming others for not understanding your posts. They are poorly written, off topic or just wrong like you Rolling Stone Bush interview or you not realizing the Democratic mascot is a Donkey. In short get your head out of your A**. While the donkey statement isn't on this thread, your going on and on about chimpanzees to cover your statement is.

Trying reading your own posts before entering them, use the preview button.

Redneck... The problem with being vague is that you have folks like Chukpike here who will misinterpret (whether accidentally or on purpose) your views.

Your posts are only vague sometimes, the rest of the time they are just off the wall. I see I am not the only one telling you this either.

 

[Rob Henderson]

And I don't see the reason for you quoting mmarsh if you weren't going to address him at all.


Couldn't that have been sent in a PM, seeing as NONE of it was actually dealing with the post I made towards Obama breaking a campaign promise?

 

[A Can of Man]

 

[Chukpike]

And I don't see the reason for you quoting mmarsh if you weren't going to address him at all.

Additional proof you don't read. Go back to post #25 and read mmarsh and my response. Then you threw your two cents in on post #27, apparently only reading what I wrote.

Couldn't that have been sent in a PM, seeing as NONE of it was actually dealing with the post I made towards Obama breaking a campaign promise?

Thanks for moderating and letting me know where I should make contact. And thanks for moderating and telling me I was off topic. You a very helpful. I will try and follow your guidelines.

 

[Rob Henderson]

I was referring to post number 28. You don't even read your OWN posts?!



Oh, and thank YOU for STAYING ON TOPIC. A rule I would argue MUCH more important than my attempts to keep you (vainly) on the topic.

 

[mmarsh]

So, you accept that Obama will break all his promises. So, knowing that no campaign promise will go unbroken, any thought of President Obama bringing Change is just smoke and mirrors. The good thing is if President Obama can just be mediocre he will leave office with a higher approval rating than President Bush. Not a very lofty goal.

To you breaking his promises is no big deal. Just politics as usual. I thought you had higher expectations from this President than the last one. I stand corrected.

I already answered this, I havent yet met the president who HASNT broken a campaign promise at some point, and that includes Bush. After all, how many Republican presidents forfilled their promises to the religious right and sought to actual end abortion? And yes that is just politics, Politics isn't ballet, its more like mud-wrestling, get used to it.

And BTW, by beef with Bush Administration was not that it broke its promises, it was that it was disceptive, abused its authority, and most importantly that it was totally incompetant.

 

[Chukpike]

I already answered this, I havent yet met the president who HASNT broken a campaign promise at some point, and that includes Bush.

Actually, what you said was.

I dont care if Obama doesnt keep his campaign promise, as I said all campaign promises get broken sooner or later. I just hope his course of action is correct (which we will find out soon enough). If Obama felt that the Military Tribunals was the way to go and that meant changing his mind from what he said in 2008 then I support his decision. At the moment Obama hasnt done anything to make me question his judgement.

This is the promise he made,"I also will reject a legal framework that does not work. There has been only one conviction at Guantanamo. It was for a guilty plea on material support for terrorism. The sentence was 9 months. There has not been one conviction of a terrorist act. I have faith in America's courts, and I have faith in our JAGs. As President, I will close Guantanamo, reject the Military Commissions Act, and adhere to the Geneva Conventions. Our Constitution and our Uniform Code of Military Justice provide a framework for dealing with the terrorists."quote from Obama's own Web page.
http://www.barackobama.com/2007/08/01/the_war_we_need_to_win.php

Still don't care if he breaks this promise?

 

[A Can of Man]

I have a question for you.
If you don't like what he promised and upon reflection he decided not to go ahead with his plan, or at least, proceed with a lot of caution, why are you so upset?

 

[mmarsh]

Actually, what you said was.



This is the promise he made,"I also will reject a legal framework that does not work. There has been only one conviction at Guantanamo. It was for a guilty plea on material support for terrorism. The sentence was 9 months. There has not been one conviction of a terrorist act. I have faith in America's courts, and I have faith in our JAGs. As President, I will close Guantanamo, reject the Military Commissions Act, and adhere to the Geneva Conventions. Our Constitution and our Uniform Code of Military Justice provide a framework for dealing with the terrorists."quote from Obama's own Web page.
http://www.barackobama.com/2007/08/01/the_war_we_need_to_win.php

Still don't care if he breaks this promise?

No I don't, that's just the point. I generally pay little mind to what a politician says regardless of his politicial stripes. If he breaks a promise or changes his mind that matters not. The only thing that matters to me is the results he gets.

I would much rather have a president who constantly breaks his promise or changes his mind but who gets it right, rather than one that remains steadfast to his word and the result ends in disaster.