Policy Change Possible On Photos Of Flag-Draped Coffins

Team Infidel

Team Infidel

Forum Spin Doctor
CNN
February 10, 2009
The Situation Room (CNN), 5:00 PM
WOLF BLITZER: Let's go to the Pentagon right now.
Barbara Starr is working a story involving showing the American public those caskets of fallen troops as they come back to Dover, the US Air Force Base in Delaware. It's a sensitive issue that came up yesterday at the news conference.
What's the latest?
What are you hearing from the military today -- Barbara?
BARBARA STARR: Well, Wolf, it is one of the most sensitive issues for America's grieving military families. It looks like there may be some movement on it.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) STARR (voice-over): Rare photographs of the fallen coming home for the last time -- solemn ceremonies at Dover Air Force Base pay tribute. But for years, the Pentagon has banned news coverage.
ED HENRY: Will you overturn that policy?
OBAMA: We are in the process of reviewing those policies in conversations with the Department of Defense.
STARR: Indeed, it was after this exchange that Defense Secretary Robert Gates asked for a review. He says the ban protects families.
DEFENSE SECRETARY ROBERT GATES: There were some privacy concerns. I think that looking at it again makes all kinds of sense.
STARR: Some family groups don't want anything changed.
KATHLEEN MOAKLER, NATIONAL MILITARY FAMILY ASSOCIATION: It would be -- we feel it would be very unsettling to other families to see pictures of the flag-draped coffins and not know whether it's their son, their daughter, their husband, their mother in those coffins.
STARR: The restrictions started tightening back in 1989, when the first casualties from the invasion of Panama appeared on television at the same time President George H.W. Bush appeared light-hearted. Five years ago, Senator Joe Biden suggested the ban was kept in place to keep Americans from seeing the Iraq War dead.
JOSEPH BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The idea that they are essentially snuck back into the country under the cover of night so no one can see their casket has arrived, I just think is wrong.
STARR: Congressman Walter Jones says it's a matter of paying respects.
REP. WALTERS JONES (R-NC): And one way to do that is when that flag-draped coffin is coming off that plane at Dover -- and you don't know the name, nor should you know the name, but you know it's an American hero. (END VIDEO TAPE)
STARR: Of course, all of this is coming as the Pentagon is telling American military families to get ready for the possibility of more casualties as the fighting is certain to ramp up in Afghanistan -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Yes, unfortunately. All right, Barbara. Thanks very much.
 
they must be out of there :cen:ing mind...does the privacy act do anything these day, or do people still believe that other peoples problems or losses concern them? media coverage on our fallen commrades is a horrible thing to do...***senario***you see these planes unload these coffins on the news and you havent heard anything from your husband/wife/brother/father/mother...ect for a week or even a couple of day, paranoia sets in and you start to think that maybe one of those coffins contain one of my loved ones...still think its a good idea?? all i see is it will lead to paranoia, anger, MORE protests, and pissed off military family members seeing our fallen unloaded from these planes... the media is really starting to piss me off...
 
Mayser said:
they must be out of there :cen:ing mind...does the privacy act do anything these day, or do people still believe that other peoples problems or losses concern them? media coverage on our fallen commrades is a horrible thing to do...***senario***you see these planes unload these coffins on the news and you havent heard anything from your husband/wife/brother/father/mother...ect for a week or even a couple of day, paranoia sets in and you start to think that maybe one of those coffins contain one of my loved ones...still think its a good idea?? all i see is it will lead to paranoia, anger, MORE protests, and pissed off military family members seeing our fallen unloaded from these planes... the media is really starting to piss me off...
Click to expand...
Your obvious distress over this issue is commendable .. however .. I think you are over-reacting by a factor which is astronomical.

While constant coverage of flag draped coffins being unloaded is unsettling, it is not the end of the world. During the Vietnam war, thousands of our military members were being returned on an almost daily basis via "graves" flights and the pictures were being used by anti-war forces to drum up resentment against the government and the United States. That is the scenario that I am most upset over. Our young men and women are being supported by most Americans, but that could change very quickly if there were a concerted effort by the anti-war wackos.

Limited coverage (not daily coverage of every graves flight though), if it were covered respectfully, would not be out of line. It would point out the fact that even though the total number of deaths isn't on a par with Vietnam, there is still a price our military is paying to make it possible for the Iraqi people to decide their own fate.

As far as the families of military members are concerned, advertisement that the families of the fallen members families have been notified of the return, would go a long ways towards eliminating the 'paranoia' that 'one of those coffins contain one of my loved ones'.
 
Chief Bones said:
While constant coverage of flag draped coffins being unloaded is unsettling, it is not the end of the world. During the Vietnam war, thousands of our military members were being returned on an almost daily basis via "graves" flights and the pictures were being used by anti-war forces to drum up resentment against the government and the United States. That is the scenario that I am most upset over.
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this is the biggest problem i have with the topic, this is what im afraid of happening all over again. even though we won the military portion of the war, the "war" at home is in my opinion only going to get worse with the war moving over to Afgan. and i really dont think that the media will have the common curtiousy of providing much privacy to these flights..it starts with pictures, and then videotapes and lastly documentaries and on scene reporting... do i have a problem acknowledging those who have fallen,no. but the respect for the families going through these tough moments in there lives is heartwrenching, speaking from experience, i dont like people talking about my family or friends who have fallen in battle. its kinda like asking a vetnam vet about his experiences over there and getting a calm and collect response...maybe 1-100 vets would have that response, but thats stretching it, you really wouldnt see that. thats how thin the topic is...
 
In my humble opinion... I believe it is WRONG to have media coverage of the flag drapped coffins arriving. There is a time and place for everything. When the news showed pictures in honor of the fallen soldiers each night a few years ago it was proper and respectful to both the fallen hero and his/her family.

The media's ego that it has the "right" to know _______ (just fill in the blank) is asinine!

Again, this is just my opinion, though.
 
Chief Bones said:
Your obvious distress over this issue is commendable .. however .. I think you are over-reacting by a factor which is astronomical.

While constant coverage of flag draped coffins being unloaded is unsettling, it is not the end of the world. During the Vietnam war, thousands of our military members were being returned on an almost daily basis via "graves" flights and the pictures were being used by anti-war forces to drum up resentment against the government and the United States. That is the scenario that I am most upset over. Our young men and women are being supported by most Americans, but that could change very quickly if there were a concerted effort by the anti-war wackos.

Limited coverage (not daily coverage of every graves flight though), if it were covered respectfully, would not be out of line. It would point out the fact that even though the total number of deaths isn't on a par with Vietnam, there is still a price our military is paying to make it possible for the Iraqi people to decide their own fate.
Click to expand...

What would happen if the current media restrictions were lifted?

1. Video media coverage would begin. Since the coffins don't speak the media would be apologized to add dialogue.
A. First days dialogue would cover the victory of the media over censorship. Since they may not have a list of those returned. The media would probably want full disclosure and talk about how they were still being excluded.
B. When the media wins the list of names, they will declare another victory for their right to know.
C. After four are five days of the same routine the broadcast coverage will decline as it is "old news"
D. Eventually the coverage will be used as a background for reporters to state their views on current world actions/political views. Most likely using old file footage as it is cheaper than going to Dover for fresh footage.

Chief Bones said:
As far as the families of military members are concerned, advertisement that the families of the fallen members families have been notified of the return, would go a long ways towards eliminating the 'paranoia' that 'one of those coffins contain one of my loved ones'.
Click to expand...

As far as advertisement goes, most all of the general population (and probably every military family) knows that the military makes every effort to notify families before it is released to the media. (The dreaded knock on the door by Dress Uniformed Military personnel).
Military families concern for their loved ones is NOT Paranoia.

The footage would be used for the news services political agendas as it has in the past.
Example from the original story:
"STARR: Of course, all of this is coming as the Pentagon is telling American military families to get ready for the possibility of more casualties as the fighting is certain to ramp up in Afghanistan -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Yes, unfortunately. All right, Barbara. Thanks very much."

Look at the mileage that this derives without the pictures. And while they state increased casualties in Afghanistan, they say nothing about the reduction as we leave Iraq.

The best thing that could be done with the footage is make every politician or political leader watch it for 1 hour before they go to bed each day. Hopefully, to make them think about their decisions.
 
Does that make sense?????

Evidently I didn't make my point very well.

While I would prefer NOT to see one single picture or clip of flag draped coffins ... it would not be the end of the world if we did. It was a daily occurrence during the Vietnam War. Some of those coffins were coffins of friends I had the duty of accompanying to their homes, while I was still in the Army.

And CP, while I can agree to the insensitivity of the media people, don't you think that it is better to show the American public the price that is being paid by our military instead of allowing them to ignore the sacrifices of our comrades by sticking their heads in the sand (because they are NOT being reminded of the REAL costs). What bothers most Americans (those who can be bothered that is), is the monetary price tag. When you talk to a person who has never served in the military or has never lost a loved one to war, about the fighting and the deaths of our military members .. they get a glazed look in their eyes and they 'tune' you out. They don't want to be reminded of the price our young military members are paying - they don't want to be reminded of the human price - they treat it as something that has no meaning to them personally - they can't connect on a personal basis.

That is probably the one single thing that has come about in this "instant 24/7 war coverage" that irritates me the most. Americans switch channels when war footage is shown ... to them, it is nothing more than switching the movie channel to another movie that is better entertainment. It allows them to turn their backs and not be bothered by "bad news".

Perhaps what we need, are a few flag draped coffins to remind Americans that freedom isn't free ... that the price for freedom is measured by the number of our dead. It is the apathy of the American public that is disturbing to me.

Does that make sense?????
 
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Here in Spain we see them all, with the whole procedure, whenever they come in (luckily it is not daily, yet), and it is always very emotional acts to farewell our fallen:

King and/or Prince as CinC and career officers & their wives talking to and soothing the mourning families, handing out the posthumous awards, etc. (which in Spain are still *yellow* banded - for corageous action in civil life - instead of *red* for the same in combat, as we officially are on a civil mission in A´stan and were in Iraq), and then joining in to the tune "Death Is Not The End" which is the song used in protocol here (and which every soldier know by heart. I will attach a translation of the lyrics below...).

That is how we do it here: The Funeral
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFJO4wD6Sgg

It brings people closer to their troops to add faces to the numbers, and the weekly farewall acts are a national unity building means that cannot be understimated IMHO, never understood why in the US it is considered to undermine morale to show your fallen their proper respect and to have the public via TV participate (probably has to do with the vast numbers in Vietnam? Kind of a trauma not surpassed?)

Stuff for another thread actually: How Does Your Nation Honor/Farewell It´s Fallen?

I have written about the military procedure in Spain in another forum under the title above and do not want to re-invent the wheel in this respect, dont know whether it is legal to link to my article here (somebody advise this nOOb plz)?

Rattler

La Muerte No Es El Final (Death Is Not The End)

Spanish Lyrics in the vid, translation yours truly:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckTBNqvvj4k

When the pain reaches us,
(the pain) for the lost brother ("companion" in some versions).

When the painful goodbye,
searches for hope in faith.

(Then) we trust (in) Your word,
knowing, without doubt, that You:

- have already returned him to life,
- Have already brought him to the light.
(rep)
- Have already returned him to life,
- Have already brought him to the light.
 
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Chief Bones said:
That is probably the one single thing that has come about in this "instant 24/7 war coverage" that irritates me the most. Americans switch channels when war footage is shown ... to them, it is nothing more than switching the movie channel to another movie that is better entertainment. It allows them to turn their backs and not be bothered by "bad news".

Perhaps what we need, are a few flag draped coffins to remind Americans that freedom isn't free ... that the price for freedom is measured by the number of our dead. It is the apathy of the American public that is disturbing to me.

Does that make sense?????
Click to expand...

Think you answered your own question. People won't watch unless the media can spice it up with their own spin. When watching the news or reading the newspaper how far down is Afghanistan and Iraq in their reporting?
 
rattler said:
-snip-
Stuff for another thread actually: How Does Your Nation Honor/Farewell It´s Fallen?

I have written about the military procedure in Spain in another forum under the title above and do not want to re-invent the wheel in this respect, dont know whether it is legal to link to my article here (somebody advise this nOOb plz)?
-snip-
Click to expand...

Ok, as I haven´t heard back and did not find anything in The Rules, here the link to How Spain Honors/Farewells Its Fallen, more of the above but there I went in detail (MODS feel free to move and advise or reprimand):

http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/index.php?topic=831.msg2517#msg2517

D.E.P.

Rattler
 
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