pixiedustboo
Redfidelboo
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sy38Dt0dXoc&list=UU1yBKRuGpC1tSM73A0ZjYjQ&index=20&feature=plcp"]Occupy DC Protester Tased & Overnight Camping Ban - YouTube[/ame]
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Occupy DC
pixiedustboo
Redfidelboo
Who is RT?
Yossarian
Forum Resistance Leader
Russian Tv,
About bi monthly they call in interviews with not so well known authors or economist from America predicting the eventual finacial collaspe of this country as a consequence of greed fueled relationships between private mega banks and investment like dealings with Congress...
In short.
And it's cheaper than HBO.
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pixiedustboo
Redfidelboo
AH! Russian TV, yes, I've heard about them. 
Quite.
Quite.
rattler
Active member
They are not going to get this under control (see my sig) as long as there are so many contradictions unexplained:
For example (one of sooo many): Today (here in Spain) it was published that 90% (!) of the additionally (compared to 2010) spent public (i.e. my tax) money during 2011 was spent to rescue banks in problems.
Now, those same banks (and even more so the ones that make money: Santander announced that after writing off their real estate losses they last year *only* made a profit of 3.000 Million Euros, 30% less than 2010) are not only not helping to solve the crisis we find ourselves in (according to the "markets"), they are part of the problem: They dont hand out loans. And without credits and loan lines even healthy companies with a full order book cannot buy e.g. material to produce, in concsequence make less money and have to set free workers, and in the long run go bankrupt (simplifying a bit here to keep it short).
Why dont the banks that we "rescue" with thousands of millions of Euros hand out loans even if bonity is guaranteed? Simple: They make less profit with a loan (even to a healthy "AAA" company) than with speculations on the financial markets. And as they are obliged (by their share holders) to maximize profits, they feel obliged to direct the money they have elsewhere, but not into the economy.
One of the points the "indignados" of 15M (the name for the movment here in Spain) make is that we need a law change which obliges banks to give out loans in a certain percentage of their gains (30% might be a good start), after all, thats what they were founded for and the original reason of their existence. Alternatively we have to tax the financial speculation revenues to a point where it becomes interesting again to give out a loan at e.g. 4% interest (and this tax income might help getting some off the rescue money back).
Another thing people like me who still pay taxes are getting more and more obsessed with is that the top charges of the banks that failed so dramatically in their speculations that they need our tax Euros to be "rescued" still assign themselves mega salaries: In our new "bad" bank (founded by the government to concentrate all the losses of the other banks to make thier balances black again - and of course paid by our tax money) the top directors have salaries of between 12 and 30 Million Euros *per year* (!), explain this to the simple worker who cannot even decide whether he wants to pay taxes or not (as tax is automatically deducted from his salary before he gets the rest paid out every month).
And so on, and so on, it seems that people bit by bit wake up and realize how they are getting pulled over the table by people they did not even elect, this movement will grow and not go away, I am sure.
FWIW,
Rattler
For example (one of sooo many): Today (here in Spain) it was published that 90% (!) of the additionally (compared to 2010) spent public (i.e. my tax) money during 2011 was spent to rescue banks in problems.
Now, those same banks (and even more so the ones that make money: Santander announced that after writing off their real estate losses they last year *only* made a profit of 3.000 Million Euros, 30% less than 2010) are not only not helping to solve the crisis we find ourselves in (according to the "markets"), they are part of the problem: They dont hand out loans. And without credits and loan lines even healthy companies with a full order book cannot buy e.g. material to produce, in concsequence make less money and have to set free workers, and in the long run go bankrupt (simplifying a bit here to keep it short).
Why dont the banks that we "rescue" with thousands of millions of Euros hand out loans even if bonity is guaranteed? Simple: They make less profit with a loan (even to a healthy "AAA" company) than with speculations on the financial markets. And as they are obliged (by their share holders) to maximize profits, they feel obliged to direct the money they have elsewhere, but not into the economy.
One of the points the "indignados" of 15M (the name for the movment here in Spain) make is that we need a law change which obliges banks to give out loans in a certain percentage of their gains (30% might be a good start), after all, thats what they were founded for and the original reason of their existence. Alternatively we have to tax the financial speculation revenues to a point where it becomes interesting again to give out a loan at e.g. 4% interest (and this tax income might help getting some off the rescue money back).
Another thing people like me who still pay taxes are getting more and more obsessed with is that the top charges of the banks that failed so dramatically in their speculations that they need our tax Euros to be "rescued" still assign themselves mega salaries: In our new "bad" bank (founded by the government to concentrate all the losses of the other banks to make thier balances black again - and of course paid by our tax money) the top directors have salaries of between 12 and 30 Million Euros *per year* (!), explain this to the simple worker who cannot even decide whether he wants to pay taxes or not (as tax is automatically deducted from his salary before he gets the rest paid out every month).
And so on, and so on, it seems that people bit by bit wake up and realize how they are getting pulled over the table by people they did not even elect, this movement will grow and not go away, I am sure.
FWIW,
Rattler
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pixiedustboo
Redfidelboo
Rattler, I certainly hope so. I've been following the occupy news from TYT for a while now and I'm pulling for some major changes.
pixiedustboo
Redfidelboo
I wanted to double check with Lunatik, but I was right. A few months ago Lunatik had a Skype interview with Russian TV. They were asking him some questions about Turkey's satellite. If I am not mistaken they contacted him to ask about this article and get more information; http://www.trdefence.com/2011/10/19/turkish-satellite-rasat-becomes-operational/ . Don't quote me on that though.
(And it just so happens that TR Defence is run by Lunatik.)
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that's the problem with bailouts, instead of liquidating the failed Banks & having the survivors that were more responsible grow, the taxpayer funds the pay, perks & other things that should have gone away with the bankruptcy. There is a need for commercial banks that only do business loans & financial banks that invest in other things, with no cross polinaization & no guarantees for the financial banks. But if the young dupes think they are better off under a noncapitalist system they've been drinking the Kool-Ade too long.
Yossarian
Forum Resistance Leader
We don't live in a captialist system anymore, we live in a corporatist economy, they are not the same, and this change started decades ago.
Problem is politics. Politicians are supposed to make laws to regulate business and protect the consumer. I don't know how it is in other countries but in Belgium many (all?) politicians have a seat in big corporations and they do not want to lose their pay so bankruptcy is not an option.
But not all corporations are evil. In Spain the retail store Mercadona pays out a part of the profit to it's employees. Last year each one of them got about $3.000 extra.
But not all corporations are evil. In Spain the retail store Mercadona pays out a part of the profit to it's employees. Last year each one of them got about $3.000 extra.
Yossarian
Forum Resistance Leader
Along with societal preceptions of what is wealth, what it means, and what any good citizen is supposed to strive for, a least thats how it seems in the U.S.
As well as the notion of a limitless growth based perception of economics... even in a finite world with more and more people in it everyday.
We are all supposed to want and persue the "American Dream". And sometimes when I ask people why they want certian things (home ownership, a sterotypical marriage, a yard a dog) sometimes they can't even answer.
And you can't really blame them, it's paraded as what is wanted ever since you are born in this country, as what you need to strive for.
Even in the education systems nowa days, which I can really claim from experiance.
Everybody is learning about the hows of society, not the whys anymore.
As well as the notion of a limitless growth based perception of economics... even in a finite world with more and more people in it everyday.
We are all supposed to want and persue the "American Dream". And sometimes when I ask people why they want certian things (home ownership, a sterotypical marriage, a yard a dog) sometimes they can't even answer.
And you can't really blame them, it's paraded as what is wanted ever since you are born in this country, as what you need to strive for.
Even in the education systems nowa days, which I can really claim from experiance.
Everybody is learning about the hows of society, not the whys anymore.
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We have unfortunatly a highly distorted system That is getting way to close to socialism than is good for it. Not advocating a return to Lazie Faire(sp?) persay but the best would be simular to the traffic police, the Lsaws are set & the Cops generally stay in the background unless someone really screws up. The free market typically is best @ determing what will work, vs command decisions by Govt. the Obama decision that "Green" is the future & his attempts to force it are a total failure. No politician in high govt Office should be allowed positions in private companies. Paying/not paying a bonus does/doesn't determine weather a compny is "Evil" or not. In the case of Chrysler & GM Obama not only bailed them out but he violated Contract Law ripping off the bond holders(secured creditors) & then giving control to the Unions(unsecured debt holders) a socialist maneuver. the bailout so far has cost taxpayers billions in losses.
Yossarian
Forum Resistance Leader
Yessir!
Sgt. Shamar Thomas, you are the stuff!
Rattler
EDIT: Interesting interview with him:
Olbermann interviews marine veteran who shamed police - Sgt Shamar Thomas - Occupy Wall Street - YouTube
This is why I carry one of my most valued gifts around with me everywhere I go.
A pocket Constitution.
Everybody in America screams that they know their rights.
But to read them and know how to apply them is another thing, I believe that if any movement in this country is to succeed, then they should learn this truth and apply it, for if they don't understand how to,then they will have them walked all over.
And honestly I would not mind seeing this movement get some real cohesive goals and momentum. As long as it remains on the whole non voilent.
senojekips
Active member
Ooooh,.... I can feel the disapproving stares of the extreme right wing members here.
All of you Commies and socialists who believe this stuff,... Ooooh,... not good, not good at all,.... what's going on here, are we all turning into mad bombers and anarchists?
No doubt your names are all being scribbled in little black books somewhere, the "spooks" will be steaming open your mail as I speak.
How dare you tell the Big End of town that they've got it wrong,...:-D
Politics is only a problem so long as there are people who propagate the problems, because they won't dare speak out against the things they know are wrong. People who are too scared of being accused of being Commos and socialists and any of a dozen other derogatory terms used with no other reason than to stop people telling the truth.
All of you Commies and socialists who believe this stuff,... Ooooh,... not good, not good at all,.... what's going on here, are we all turning into mad bombers and anarchists?
No doubt your names are all being scribbled in little black books somewhere, the "spooks" will be steaming open your mail as I speak.
How dare you tell the Big End of town that they've got it wrong,...:-D
Politics is only a problem so long as there are people who propagate the problems, because they won't dare speak out against the things they know are wrong. People who are too scared of being accused of being Commos and socialists and any of a dozen other derogatory terms used with no other reason than to stop people telling the truth.
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Yossarian
Forum Resistance Leader
Principle can transcend party lines.
I agree to a solid point you have, It does annoy me to no end when I hear someone use the Socialist word or the dread "C" word (Commie) when they attempt to grab a term that they don't understand,.... to describe something they don't know why they don't like, for a reason they also don't understand....
You may not like apples but calling it an orange won't turn it into one.
Lastly I adore the peaceful practice of our rights as citizens, don't care if it's for better working conditions or gay marriage, I may not support every assembly but to see that people still exercise their rights even indirectly still shows support for the Constituition.
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rattler
Active member
When in Germany I discussed with (Neo)Nazis I always told them that I had served with a purpose, and consciously so: That they could say what they thought freely, even if they were working to abolish our constitution that I defended (I am from that generation after WWII where we - through the lessons learned by our parents the hard way - define our patriotism not through the nation but through the - our German - constitution: *My* "patria" has been and is the constituiton).
Now, with the 15M/occupy movment it seems they do it the other way round, and I must say even if those guys are far right, as long as they (in this case in the US of A) defend their constitution they got my placet and support from this angle.
Interesting (and unthinkable in Europe), also interesting one thing he says in particular (refering to Mexico): "We should work with our neighbours, and not against them".
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkE3GnsLF0w"]Occupy Phoenix Veterans with AR 15s keeping the Occupation safe - YouTube[/ame]
Rattler
Now, with the 15M/occupy movment it seems they do it the other way round, and I must say even if those guys are far right, as long as they (in this case in the US of A) defend their constitution they got my placet and support from this angle.
Interesting (and unthinkable in Europe), also interesting one thing he says in particular (refering to Mexico): "We should work with our neighbours, and not against them".
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkE3GnsLF0w"]Occupy Phoenix Veterans with AR 15s keeping the Occupation safe - YouTube[/ame]
Rattler
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