Obliterating Islamic State (ISIS) - Page 23




 
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Obliterating Islamic State (ISIS)
 
December 5th, 2015  
JOC
 
 
Obliterating Islamic State (ISIS)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Why are the Iranians coming after me again?
With luck I will get to visit Iran the few Iranians I have met seemed perfectly normal to me and the little I have seen of Iran on TV make it a country I would like to see.

In my travels I have visited Turkey, Bosnia, Egypt, Jordan, Morocco, Maldives, United Arab Emirates, Palestine, Malaysia and Indonesia and at no stage did I ever feel threatened and strangely enough in every one of those countries I found a relatively friendly people who despite having different lifestyles and priorities were no different to any other people I have met anywhere in the world.

However to any Iranians planning to come after me, bring dates.
We get a lot of Iranian dates in New Zealand and they are very nice.

It must be a bastard living in fear of everything different I feel for ya.
It might be different if you were an American. They have regularly taken Americans hostages since the hostage crisis in 81 and continue to do so right to the present day.
December 5th, 2015  
MontyB
 
 
Ever asked why?

One thing I have learned in life is nothing ever happens in a vacuum there is always cause and effect, even perceived.
December 5th, 2015  
lljadw
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Why are the Iranians coming after me again?
With luck I will get to visit Iran the few Iranians I have met seemed perfectly normal to me and the little I have seen of Iran on TV make it a country I would like to see.

In my travels I have visited Turkey, Bosnia, Egypt, Jordan, Morocco, Maldives, United Arab Emirates, Palestine, Malaysia and Indonesia and at no stage did I ever feel threatened and strangely enough in every one of those countries I found a relatively friendly people who despite having different lifestyles and priorities were no different to any other people I have met anywhere in the world.

However to any Iranians planning to come after me, bring dates.
We get a lot of Iranian dates in New Zealand and they are very nice.

It must be a bastard living in fear of everything different I feel for ya.
1)You know what happened at San Bernardino? And,this is only a beginning :there is no reason why,what's happening in Europe , will not happen in the US .
2)That's your fundamental flaw : people in Turkey, Egypt, etc..are TOTALLY different from other people in the world and especially from people living in the West :the ideals of the Islam are totally incompatible with those of the West,and that's why the average Muslim is hostile to the West .

3)You talked to people who live in Egypt,etc...,who knewEnglish (a minority) and who,of course, were answering what they knew you would ask ,and were fortifiying your bias,after all you were a tourist,and noone is saying the truth to a tourist,because noone likes a tourist,but everyone likes the money of a tourist .


4)The average Muslim remains impassible while ISIS is committing horrible atrocities against other Muslims,thus, why should they react negatively when ISIS is committing atrocities against people who are for the average Muslim only unclean pigs = non Muslims ?

5)A lot of people in the West (especially in the US) are that convinced of the superiority of their political/social system that they can't understand that the majority of the world refuses to adopt this system : the truth is very simple : the West constitutes only a very small part of the world population and the majority of the world population is indifferent/hostile to the enlightenment and the lessons of the Founding Fathers;what more is: the Third World (the majority of the world population) has started WWIII= the invasion of the West .
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Obliterating Islamic State (ISIS)
December 5th, 2015  
JOC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
Ever asked why?

One thing I have learned in life is nothing ever happens in a vacuum there is always cause and effect, even perceived.
Sure they view us as the great Satan, as well as an ally to Israel. Note of course we are also an ally to the other side as well Saudi Arabia, Kuwait UAE, Jordan, etc.
December 5th, 2015  
JOC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lljadw
1)You know what happened at San Bernardino? And,this is only a beginning :there is no reason why,what's happening in Europe , will not happen in the US .
2)That's your fundamental flaw : people in Turkey, Egypt, etc..are TOTALLY different from other people in the world and especially from people living in the West :the ideals of the Islam are totally incompatible with those of the West,and that's why the average Muslim is hostile to the West .

3)You talked to people who live in Egypt,etc...,who knewEnglish (a minority) and who,of course, were answering what they knew you would ask ,and were fortifiying your bias,after all you were a tourist,and noone is saying the truth to a tourist,because noone likes a tourist,but everyone likes the money of a tourist .


4)The average Muslim remains impassible while ISIS is committing horrible atrocities against other Muslims,thus, why should they react negatively when ISIS is committing atrocities against people who are for the average Muslim only unclean pigs = non Muslims ?

5)A lot of people in the West (especially in the US) are that convinced of the superiority of their political/social system that they can't understand that the majority of the world refuses to adopt this system : the truth is very simple : the West constitutes only a very small part of the world population and the majority of the world population is indifferent/hostile to the enlightenment and the lessons of the Founding Fathers;what more is: the Third World (the majority of the world population) has started WWIII= the invasion of the West .
lljadw you really have to drop this WW3 thing. It sound preposterous and makes you out to be an delusional extremist. Sorry for the name calling but I'm being honest. Terrorist attacks from groups based in the ME have been going on since the 70's, even earlier. They have gotten more frequent, but likely culminated with the 9-11 attack. Still the total deaths to N Americans, Europeans and Africans is in the lower thousands. This hardly constitutes a world war. In WW2 ~60 million died in 6 years in the European theater alone.

Yes some people may not accept democracy, but some ME countries will take Tunisia and Turkey for example. One cannot lump all ME peoples together as enemy's of the west. Also to say the average Muslim remain impassive while ISIS devastates his land and livelihood is ludicrous. Many of these average Muslims are held at gunpoint to work the oil wells and work in power and munitions plants. they are beaten and shot if the show the least resistance. They hate ISIS,
December 5th, 2015  
lljadw
 
You can't qualify a war as world war by using as norm the number of casualties .

Turkey is not a democracy.


Yes,the average Muslim remained impassible while ISIS was teaching children of 5 year to behead people :there were no millions demonstrating in Turkey or Iran,or Egypt (countries with each 70/80 million inhabitants).And it was the same in Europe: there were no mass demonstrations from Muslims protesting against the terrorist attacks in Europe,what happened was that thousands of Muslims were going to the ME to join ISIS .

Europe is invaded by Muslims ,their presence (10 % of the population in France, in Britain,in Germany) constitutes an electoral power which prevents any effective action against ISIS : Germany will send 1200 men and 6 aircraft to "fight" against ISIS,but they have not the right to join the fighting,and,even this meaningless gesture is to much for the central council of Muslims in Germany .

France sends 26 aircraft (not all fighters) this also is meaningless,because Hollande can not survive politically without the Muslim vote .

And within one or two generations, it will be the same in the US .

There is a third world war going on,because (as even the NYT was forced to admit) :the south is going northward,and if we continue to do nothing,we will be swallowed up .

We are as the Roman Empire in the 4th Century AC,when the Barbarians invaded the Empire .

If we do nothing,we will disappear,as Rome disappeared .
December 5th, 2015  
Easy-8
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lljadw
And,who will do this ? Not the US, not the Iraqi "army" (which is not good at all),not Iran ,because the presence of ISIS in Iraq is benefiting to Iran .
Of course the US. Iran doesn't like ISIS. They are Shi'ites ISIS is Sunni both of whom hate one and have done so since about the Middle Jurassic Period.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyB
But in doing this you are almost recognising them as a nation which is dangerous in itself.

I think our mistake is that we are still trying to "understand" them and are treating them with caution when the simple fact is that they are little more than a cult of death, they are either killing or dying and I would prefer it be the later.
screw the political garbage wipe ISIS from the face of the earth. ISIS is a state regardless of if we want to act like it exists or not.
December 5th, 2015  
MontyB
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOC
Sure they view us as the great Satan, as well as an ally to Israel. Note of course we are also an ally to the other side as well Saudi Arabia, Kuwait UAE, Jordan, etc.
This is where I think you have missed the point, certainly support for Israel plays a part but not a great one even the Palestinian opinion on the matter indicate that it so much about being supportive of Israel but that you are actively supporting Israeli actions that are displacing and killing Palestinians on a daily basis and protecting them at the international level while they do it.

The part I think you have completely failed to understand is "Allies of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE, Jordan etc." because you are assuming that being allied to the governments of these countries makes you allied to the people of those countries but missed the part where those governments are not all that popular with their own people who see them as little more than oppressive dictatorships.

Surely it is not all that hard to understand why you are not safe outside your borders when the people of these nations see you as supporting and maintaining their oppressors.

I think your rather black and white view is also indicated by your comments that I am "anti-American" yet I can honestly say I haven't met an American I didn't like but I find your governments foreign policy to be appalling.
December 5th, 2015  
lljadw
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy-8
Of course the US. Iran doesn't like ISIS. They are Shi'ites ISIS is Sunni both of whom hate one and have done so since about the Middle Jurassic Period.



screw the political garbage wipe ISIS from the face of the earth. ISIS is a state regardless of if we want to act like it exists or not.


I don't see it happen before january 2017,and if Hillary becomes president not before january 2021.

About Iran : I disagree : the hostility between Sunni and Shii has not the importance a lot of people in the West (who never heard of Sunni and Shii till a few weeks ago) are claiming : when in 1980 Saddam attacked Shii Iran,his army consisted mainly of Shii.

It is obvious that Iran is behind ISIS : ISIS is disturbing the statu quo in the ME,and there is only one country in the ME that want to change the statu quo : IRAN .

Iran is supporting ISIS in Iraq and Syria (who unless Iran is delivering weapons,etc to ISIS? ) and supports the Shii government of Iraq and the Alawite government of Syria . A win/win situation for Iran .

With the support of the Obama administration, Iran's plans to dominate the ME and to destroy Israel are progressing, very quickly .

And the plan to dominate the ME date from the time of the Shah .
December 5th, 2015  
JOC
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lljadw
You can't qualify a war as world war by using as norm the number of casualties .

Turkey is not a democracy.


Yes,the average Muslim remained impassible while ISIS was teaching children of 5 year to behead people :there were no millions demonstrating in Turkey or Iran,or Egypt (countries with each 70/80 million inhabitants).And it was the same in Europe: there were no mass demonstrations from Muslims protesting against the terrorist attacks in Europe,what happened was that thousands of Muslims were going to the ME to join ISIS .

Europe is invaded by Muslims ,their presence (10 % of the population in France, in Britain,in Germany) constitutes an electoral power which prevents any effective action against ISIS : Germany will send 1200 men and 6 aircraft to "fight" against ISIS,but they have not the right to join the fighting,and,even this meaningless gesture is to much for the central council of Muslims in Germany .

France sends 26 aircraft (not all fighters) this also is meaningless,because Hollande can not survive politically without the Muslim vote .

And within one or two generations, it will be the same in the US .

There is a third world war going on,because (as even the NYT was forced to admit) :the south is going northward,and if we continue to do nothing,we will be swallowed up .

We are as the Roman Empire in the 4th Century AC,when the Barbarians invaded the Empire .

If we do nothing,we will disappear,as Rome disappeared .
1st off Turkey has 3 branches of government that are all elected.

The people of Egypt supported the military in a big way when they replaced the terrorist Muslim Brotherhood organization. Better to have safety of a military government then a democratically elected government that lied and turned on it's own people.

I do believe your argument for a 3rd world war is very weak. You are merely stating some facts interlaced mostly with your opinions and calling it a world war.

In the US way over 10% of the population is Hispanic's some of these are gang members, drug dealers and gun runners. Many live in ghetto's. Do we lump them all together as an enemy of the USA, ridiculous. This sounds like what you are proposing for immigrant Muslims. BTW I do support screening the potential immigrants for potential terrorist.

This is exactly what the Nazi's did to the Jews , Gypsies and Slavs murdering > 20 million of them in less than 6 years. They were labeled as enemies to the state. Are you proposing a modern repeat? Nonsense such crimes most never be repeated!
 


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