Are new russian weapons up to nato standards? - Page 3




 
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November 21st, 2004  
EuroSpike
 

Topic: Re: Are new russian weapons up to nato standards?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowalker
I was just wondering this as the new members of the EU and NATO have to upgrade a lot of there equipment or replace it. Some countries such as the Czech Republic are upgrading there equipment and are buying in new stuff like the JAS39 Gripens. They seem to be under pressure from western governments to buy modern western equipment, but could they still buy russian weapon systems, such as BTR-80/90 and BMP-3 and still comply with NATO standards. Thanks
Russian crap isn't comply with NATO standards but some of that are quite good in right use. All MBT:s can be forgotten except for infantry support, but some of the APCs and IFVs can fill their job well but they aren't desinged to be used many years.

Russian electronics is technically much worse than western but all mechanical equipments such as infantry weapons are working quite well. Russian quality is piece s**t compared to western due ancient manufacturing systems and control of quality. Some good russian equipments i know are machineguns 7.62 PKM, 12.7 NSV and the reliable construction of AK.

In Finland Russian or actually from Germany origin equipments can be found in two armor brigades wich are going to be dispanded until 2008 because unit such as armor brigade has proven to be too sluggish unit in finnish terrain.
November 21st, 2004  
Missileer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by c/LtCdr
*Snort*...I think by now the Navy has had plenty of time to develop a counter for this weapon. That article does not mention the Phalanx I block II and Phalanx IIs that have been installed on Navy vessels, nor the F-14s with Phoenix missile capability that are intended for use against missiles and aircraft from a range of over 100 miles. If that doesn't get em, well, I'm sure there's something aboard those ships that we don't know about that'll catch a Sunburn...
There are long range electronic, laser, heat, and radar guidance jamming which is used as a first line of defense against anti-ship missiles. Not many are sophistocated enough to not be decoyed away.
November 22nd, 2004  
devilwasp
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
There are long range electronic, laser, heat, and radar guidance jamming which is used as a first line of defense against anti-ship missiles. Not many are sophistocated enough to not be decoyed away.
yes but how does the ships XO or warfare officer know when to turn them on.
when the plane appears?
doubt it, they wont know if the missile is in the air or is somewhere else. with that jamming the ships on S2A missles would be useless so leaving the ship vunerable.
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November 23rd, 2004  
Missileer
 
 
I'd tell you but then I'd have to kill you. This is not your Father's radar anymore. Ever hear of satellites?
November 23rd, 2004  
devilwasp
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
I'd tell you but then I'd have to kill you. This is not your Father's radar anymore. Ever hear of satellites?
satalites being used to track planes.
that would onnly work if the satalite knew the plane was there second the satalite would have to be in the right geosync orbit or on one of its flyby's.
radar can be passive but this flys below radar so i doubt that it could detect anyone and it has been proven.
November 23rd, 2004  
Missileer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devilwasp
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
I'd tell you but then I'd have to kill you. This is not your Father's radar anymore. Ever hear of satellites?
satellites being used to track planes.
that would onely work if the satellite knew the plane was there second the satellite would have to be in the right geosync orbit or on one of its flyby's.
radar can be passive but this flys below radar so i doubt that it could detect anyone and it has been proven.
Huh????
If a drone with proper optics can see you, then so can a satellite. They can count the buttons on your shirt. How do you think GPS works to find a street address for a certain house and put a Tomahawk in it?
November 24th, 2004  
devilwasp
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
Huh????
If a drone with proper optics can see you, then so can a satellite. They can count the buttons on your shirt. How do you think GPS works to find a street address for a certain house and put a Tomahawk in it?
they can see you fine but you need some one there to decifer it.
GPS works by sending a signal to multiple satalites and they triangulate your position from the direction the signal was sent from.
a satalite can only be used if it is in range or directly over the target. since water covers over 70% of the planet its doubtful there will be a satalite following every ship.
November 26th, 2004  
Missileer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devilwasp
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer
Huh????
If a drone with proper optics can see you, then so can a satellite. They can count the buttons on your shirt. How do you think GPS works to find a street address for a certain house and put a Tomahawk in it?
they can see you fine but you need some one there to decifer it.
GPS works by sending a signal to multiple satalites and they triangulate your position from the direction the signal was sent from.
a satalite can only be used if it is in range or directly over the target. since water covers over 70% of the planet its doubtful there will be a satalite following every ship.
Ah, I can now see your confusion. There are military sattelites, I don't know how many and each country has their own or share info from them. There are "footprints" on the Earth that is the active area of overlapping sattelite coverage areas. The information that they gather is filtered at many levels similar to a LAN. Sophistocated IFF or recognition of known ground, sea, and airborne equipment "signatures" are translated using updates as fast as 30 gigahertz for some systems. A lot of information can be used in real time in the particular theater. That is similar to passing information on ships, planes, and missiles using say, NATO coding. Much more is now gleaned from sattelites than "triangulation" coordinates. Remember, this is the same as DEW just better at a magnitude of 1000. We are coming very close to hitting a bullet with a bullet. Even the E3 will be scrapped in the near future and Global Hawks will take their place. I know this is verbose and I don't want to go a much further. Take care.
November 26th, 2004  
devilwasp
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer

Ah, I can now see your confusion. There are military sattelites, I don't know how many and each country has their own or share info from them. There are "footprints" on the Earth that is the active area of overlapping sattelite coverage areas. The information that they gather is filtered at many levels similar to a LAN. Sophistocated IFF or recognition of known ground, sea, and airborne equipment "signatures" are translated using updates as fast as 30 gigahertz for some systems. A lot of information can be used in real time in the particular theater. That is similar to passing information on ships, planes, and missiles using say, NATO coding. Much more is now gleaned from sattelites than "triangulation" coordinates. Remember, this is the same as DEW just better at a magnitude of 1000. We are coming very close to hitting a bullet with a bullet. Even the E3 will be scrapped in the near future and Global Hawks will take their place. I know this is verbose and I don't want to go a much further. Take care.
being able to see them and hit them is something but being able to BE there to see and hit them is something else.
remember that if the military forces had satalites covering ever area then nothing could move with out someone knowing now as the man power required to translate this data is rather LARGE that would require more people than at maryland or the pentagon. unless every one can decript a map every lets say 1 minute?
now it takes less than a few minutes to fire a missle and for it to hit the target. as much as i respect the naval intelegence sector of info there is absolutely no chance that they can get a map checked and exsamined for a missile. the sheer physics of the zoom and the ammount of raw data is far too large.
also it is doubtful they cover every square inch of the planet in an overlapping layer of satalitles or iraq could have been totaly covered by tomahwaks and the enemy units would not have been in combat with coalition forces.
sorry but the physics are just not with this.
also i dont think i am confused its simple physics.
November 27th, 2004  
Missileer
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devilwasp
Quote:
Originally Posted by Missileer

Ah, I can now see your confusion. There are military sattelites, I don't know how many and each country has their own or share info from them. There are "footprints" on the Earth that is the active area of overlapping sattelite coverage areas. The information that they gather is filtered at many levels similar to a LAN. Sophistocated IFF or recognition of known ground, sea, and airborne equipment "signatures" are translated using updates as fast as 30 gigahertz for some systems. A lot of information can be used in real time in the particular theater. That is similar to passing information on ships, planes, and missiles using say, NATO coding. Much more is now gleaned from sattelites than "triangulation" coordinates. Remember, this is the same as DEW just better at a magnitude of 1000. We are coming very close to hitting a bullet with a bullet. Even the E3 will be scrapped in the near future and Global Hawks will take their place. I know this is verbose and I don't want to go a much further. Take care.
being able to see them and hit them is something but being able to BE there to see and hit them is something else.
remember that if the military forces had satalites covering ever area then nothing could move with out someone knowing now as the man power required to translate this data is rather LARGE that would require more people than at maryland or the pentagon. unless every one can decript a map every lets say 1 minute?
now it takes less than a few minutes to fire a missle and for it to hit the target. as much as i respect the naval intelegence sector of info there is absolutely no chance that they can get a map checked and exsamined for a missile. the sheer physics of the zoom and the ammount of raw data is far too large.
also it is doubtful they cover every square inch of the planet in an overlapping layer of satalitles or iraq could have been totaly covered by tomahwaks and the enemy units would not have been in combat with coalition forces.
sorry but the physics are just not with this.
also i dont think i am confused its simple physics.
I can't belabor this past this point. You are thinking in 1970. I have been in the defense industry, pretty well cutting edge, for 40 years last September. You could be right.