Murphy's Law: Greece And Turkey

[Lunatik]

Greece And Turkey

Since the end of the Cold War, Greece has shifted its military orientation away from the north (and former Cold War opponents Bulgaria and Russia), and towards the east. The major military objective now is preparation for a war with fellow NATO member Turkey, a war Greece has little chance of winning. The Aegean sea region, and Cyprus, supplies a number of potential conflicts between Turkey and Greece. Despite this, the two nations have been slowly developing a warmer relationship. But the underlying dispute goes back nearly a thousand years.

As part of the festering feud, Greece has been improving its air force (which is equipped, like the Turkish air force, largely with U.S. built F-16 fighters) and navy. The two countries share a 206 kilometer land border, which is fortified and manned by army units on both sides.

Turkey is much less concerned about a war with Greece, partly because there are still preoccupied with Kurdish separatist rebels in eastern Turkey, and partly because the Turks still consider themselves more formidable fighters than the Greeks. While tensions have been reduced over the last decade, the Greek and Turkish air forces still aggressively patrol the naval border, some of it disputed, in the Aegean. This produces regular opportunities for armed incidents, and escalation.

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htmurph/articles/20081108.aspx

Short little sum up of how things are between the two rivals. :smil:​

 

[rock45]

Tough region

I have read though many Greece-Turkey threads in many forums and in most very strong will and proud people fight.

Sadly I could never just compare weapons platforms and etc without fighting breaking out. For me it's a aviation jackpot Greece's MK2 vs late model Vipers training against each other, F-4 vs F-4, A-7, F1, Turkey's Vipers running patrols against Greece Mirages and Vipers, MICA vs ARRAMS, different type radar's used, both NATO trained, and more. For every three or four good useful posts seven or eight useless posts were made, fights broke out with both sides putting each other down. I know one forum where so many people were banned it killed the forum. Here I was reading every word Turkish and Greece pilots were saying to nothing pretty quickly.

Greece's F-16's I think are a little bit more modern or at least some are and they have a bunch of Mirage 2000-5 mk2 fighters as well. Turkey still has more F-16s and I believe a larger standing army as well.

I hope peace comes between the two for many years to come.

 

[Lunatik]

I hope peace comes between the two for many years to come.

Cheers to that Rock.

Having seven times the population, Turkey's army is actually a lot larger and in the past few years the country has been gaining a lot of industrial and technological capabilities and going indigenous. Projects on new generation APCs, the national MBT, various guided missiles and naval corvettes signal not only a rapid expansion of its firepower, but also the means to sustain that growth without hurting the economy, thanks to many export prospects. Companies like Aselsan, Roketsan, TAI, Havelsan and Mikes are well known contractors taking part in many international defence projects, like the F-35 (TAI manufactures the center fuselage and various parts) and A400M.

 

[hetfield15]

Turkey focuses on the numbers not on the tecnology . for me turkey needs better tecnology in less numbers .

 

[rattler]

I have read though many Greece-Turkey threads in many forums and in most very strong will and proud people fight.

Sadly I could never just compare weapons platforms and etc without fighting breaking out. For me it's a aviation jackpot Greece's MK2 vs late model Vipers training against each other, F-4 vs F-4, A-7, F1, Turkey's Vipers running patrols against Greece Mirages and Vipers, MICA vs ARRAMS, different type radar's used, both NATO trained, and more. For every three or four good useful posts seven or eight useless posts were made, fights broke out with both sides putting each other down. I know one forum where so many people were banned it killed the forum. Here I was reading every word Turkish and Greece pilots were saying to nothing pretty quickly.

Greece's F-16's I think are a little bit more modern or at least some are and they have a bunch of Mirage 2000-5 mk2 fighters as well. Turkey still has more F-16s and I believe a larger standing army as well.

I hope peace comes between the two for many years to come.

Amen.

Rattler

 

[Lunatik]

Turkey focuses on the numbers not on the tecnology . for me turkey needs better tecnology in less numbers .

Hi Hetfield, welcome to the forums. That's a correct general observation. But when you have a large population, you have to be able to take advantage of your numbers, as quantity is a quality in itself. You can only afford so many of the top-of-the-line stuff.

Mind you, though, Turkey's equipment is not 'older' or 'less capable' than that of Greece by any means, and in fact has the leading edge in many categories. Besides, currently there's a huge investment in indigenous defense products with quite a few export prospects, which will mean that in a long, future-war, Turkey will have the upper hand in replacing lost units with little or no international strings attached.

 

[KJ]

The beaches on Cyprus aren´t THAT great.
That´s the only thing I really can see these countries fighting over...

 

[A Can of Man]

Throw in some Dokdo-class amphibious assault ships and Turkey's power in the Mediterranean will be a force to be reckoned with.

 

[Lunatik]

Throw in some Dokdo-class amphibious assault ships and Turkey's power in the Mediterranean will be a force to be reckoned with.

The only thing that would make me as happy as having a Dokdo in TN is probably winning the lottery.

I just can't see TN without it in the long term. It's the perfect platform for our future F-35Bs, and the Koreans and Turks work on a hell a lot of other defense projects, from howitzers to jet trainers and even main battle tanks. Hell, Altay MBT will be basically a XK-2 with Turkish electronics and subsystems. I don't know what the SSM and Turk admirals are waiting for here. Dokdo and the JSF will be a new dawn for Turkish naval aviation. I really, really hope it'll win the LPD tender.

 

[Lunatik]

The beaches on Cyprus aren´t THAT great.
That´s the only thing I really can see these countries fighting over...

Probably not for its beaches, but more like its strategic location.

I think Turkey and Israel should make a deal about it. :smil:

 

[KJ]

Strategic bo**ocks, I still reckon they want their beaches..:roll: