Most impressive military achievement in the 20th Century? - Page 13




View Poll Results :Most impressive military achievement in the 20th Century?
The Japanese victory over Russia, 1905. 6 2.47%
The Allied victory in WWI, 1914-1918. 3 1.23%
The Finnish stand against the USSR, 1940. 46 18.93%
The Axis victories in the first half of WWII, 1939-1942. 29 11.93%
The Allied victory in WWII, 1939-1945. 39 16.05%
The Israeli victory in the Israeli Independence War, 1948. 11 4.53%
The UN/USA victory in the Korean War 1950-1953. 2 0.82%
The Israeli victory in the Six Days War, 1967. 30 12.35%
The Arab relative succes in the Yom Kippur War, 1973. 3 1.23%
The Israeli Victory in the Yom Kippur War, 1973. 10 4.12%
The North-Vietnamese Victory in the Vietnam conflicts, 1945-1975. 20 8.23%
The Mujahidin victory in the Afghan War, 1979-1989. 7 2.88%
The Hizballa succses in the Invasion of Lebanon,1982-2000. 4 1.65%
The UN/USA victory in the Gulf War, 1991. 11 4.53%
Other. 22 9.05%
Voters: 243. You may not vote on this poll

 
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March 25th, 2009  
Del Boy
 
But never forget that the German's remain history's biggest losers, big -time; I cannot recall returning allied troops applauding anything other than their desperation during and after WW11.

A great deal of pie in the sky has been stacked up since, and at the time, they were never even accorded the title of gallant losers, simply big, big, losers.

They chose their opponents, they chose the motivation, they chose the ground, they chose the time, they chose war, they chose wrong. By any measurement, that is no accident; in reality, that is disaster. Big.
March 25th, 2009  
BritinAfrica
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Boy
But never forget that the German's remain history's biggest losers, big -time; I cannot recall returning allied troops applauding anything other than their desperation during and after WW11.

A great deal of pie in the sky has been stacked up since, and at the time, they were never even accorded the title of gallant losers, simply big, big, losers.

They chose their opponents, they chose the motivation, they chose the ground, they chose the time, they chose war, they chose wrong. By any measurement, that is no accident; in reality, that is disaster. Big.
You could say that about the Japanese, taking on the worlds biggest industrial might was a bit daft to say the least.
March 25th, 2009  
Del Boy
 

Yes. As it happens, i do not deny the fighting credentials of the German troops. Just trying to inject a little balance into the subject. Just deflecting deification!
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March 25th, 2009  
AB_Shorts_Momma
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Boy
Just deflecting deification!
Better to deflect it than to shovel it!
March 26th, 2009  
Wallabies
 
Quote:
In every of these engagements Germans were outgunned, outnumbered and yet they've put extremely strong defence to a point where to overtake German positions significantly greater numbers were required, that hardly makes allied effort impressive.
Obviously you have had no military training to know how strong you can make your defence, especially given the months and even years the Germans had to prepare some of their lines.
March 26th, 2009  
Del Boy
 
True. Regarding strong defensive positions, Monte Cassino was referred to; it was a tough nut crack for sure. My close family had representaives on BOTH sides of that engagement, so I had first-hand opinion. In fact, now I come to think about it, I guess that is true of WW2 battles for those of my age; and WW1 in many cases, such as Gallipoli, where an everyday workmate lost a leg, and now I recall that my uncle Alf was gassed in the trenches of Europe. I was unimpressed by Panzercracker's generalisations; in the army I worked closely with a man who survived 5 years as a prisoner of the Japanese, and was still going strong as a smart soldier, although still ailing in the early 1950's. These conflicts are not just names in a book to me and I do not care to see the efforts of the Allies denigrated as inferior to those they put down.
March 26th, 2009  
Doppleganger
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Boy
But never forget that the German's remain history's biggest losers, big -time.
I'm not so sure about that Del Boy. Which country in the EU is the most politically powerful, has the largest economy, is the biggest exporter (only recently overtaken in the world by China), has the largest population, is the largest importer. It isn't the UK, who were bankrupted by 2 world wars and shrank from being a great power to a tier 2 power.

Germany may have lost 2 world wars but they seem to have done a bit better than the UK (and every country bar the US and Japan) since 1945.
March 27th, 2009  
Del Boy
 
Hi Doppleganger, good to hear from you. You will be pleased to know that I have now learned to make links and to copy and paste, which means that I will no longer have to type out Winston's speeches in full to respond to you!

I withdraw, conditionally! See below.

However, actually I agree with your argument. I am a great admirer of modern Germany and Germans. On that basis I would never seek to consider them as losers in any sense of the word. As I said in my recent post, I had relatives on both sides at Monte Cassino, and I enjoyed happy time in Hamburg round about 1950. The relative current positions of Germany and Britain has not passed me by. Regarding the quotation you have chosen, please allow me to withdraw it as a general comment, it refers only to the two 20th World Wars, militarily and politically; you know the old cliche joke - 2-0. That was the context in which I wrote, nothin more.

Please do not misunderstand my attitude, my comments are always based on rebuffing any glorification of Hitler's regime and all it stood for. Never think that I wish to denigrate the fighting achievements of the soldiers of Germany; I simply make efforts to ensure that the efforts of the Allies are not presented as in any way inferior, when thank God, they actually won the day. Those days are far behind us. We now have different challenges.
March 27th, 2009  
LeEnfield
 
 
As a lad I grew up in Southern England during WW 2, the preparations for D Day has left a lasting impression on me. Every field for 50 miles was packed with troops, a convoy of trucks could take half a day to pass a given spot, The aircraft filled the skies to such an extent that the noise from all those engines would be felt in your body. I saw some of of invasion fleet getting ready and I can just about imagine what 5.000 ships would have looked like in convoy, it is a sight that will never be seen again.
March 28th, 2009  
Del Boy
 
And your personal experience, Le, is something that may never be heard again, straight from the horse's mouth. I am glad to see it recorded here.

My big recollections are of the fighting men gradually returning with their demob suits and the welcome they received in their localities of London. The great bonfires built by kids like me on bomb sites, the wives leading the dancing in the streets. The peoples' flags were flying and little terraced houses were painted red,white and blue to welcome heroes home - 'Welcome Home Bill' painted big across the front; thaty decoration remained for many years after the war, as did the bomb sites.

Remember that none of those I have mentioned were organised celebrations - it was a lion licking its wounds. Something a kid never forgets.