magnum bullets in handguns: practical or impractical? - Page 2




View Poll Results :practical or not?
yes 7 58.33%
no 5 41.67%
Voters: 12. You may not vote on this poll

 
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July 31st, 2005  
Kozzy Mozzy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ONERING
9mm can't pierce through car doors. it takes an average of 4 shots at the torso to kill an average man unless you hit him in the heart or the lungs. while for example, if we were able to use 9mm hps then it will reduced the shots to one if aim at the torso. Because the fragments will piece through organs and tear at the flesh, quickly and painfully killing them and saving your life. maybe perhaps you could use flatheaded rounds which will add a more kick to a target.
Where are you getting this?
August 1st, 2005  
Damien435
 
 
I have fired a .44 Magnum (You can call me Mr. Dirty Harry) and that thing has one hell of a kick. If you don't hit on the first shot you are SOL.
August 10th, 2005  
specialasiankid
 
i think pistols in warfare is more desperate. unless in close quarters. like take a glock 9mm full auto. thats def. useful in close quarters. but then again its a glock and somewhat unreliable. a colt .45 or a magnum would b useful, if we're thinking the other side is wearing kevlar or some other type of body armor. but then again ur armed with a m16
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August 11th, 2005  
5.56X45mm
 
 
The term of a mangum caliber is just a play of words. The best four combat pistol cartridges are from the smallest to largest.

1) 9X19mm Parabellum
2) .357 Sig
3) .40 S&W
4) .45ACP

1) The 9mm cartridge is actually a very fine cartridge. The problem with it is that currentrules of warfare limits the use of a full metal jacketed round. If a 147Gr. JHP was used, it would put someone down just as fast as a .45ACP.

2) The .357 Sig is a hot little cartridge and is currently gaining popularity in the US law enforcement community. It fires a .36 Cliber (9mm) projectile from a .40 caliber casing. What that means is that the bullet travels faster because the cartridge casing has more space for powder. Right now it's been the standard issue cartridge of the US Secert Service and is a personal choice of many law enforcement officers.

3) The .40 S&W in my opinion is the best cartridge on the market for all uses. It is becoming the number one issued police caliber in the USA. Right now, Glock holds sixty percent of the police firearm market for duty issue pistols. And it's model 22 and 23 is it largest seller. The reason is because you can still get a high capacity platform with the ballistic power of a .45ACP cartridge. This little round was born from the creation of the 10mm Auto cartridge. Back in 1989. there was a shootout in Miami Florida. A couple of FBI agents were killed. They were carrying their issued 9mm and .38 Special sidearms. THe scumbags had .45ACP caliber pistols. Well, the FBI did a study and created a new cartridge. The 10mm, well. Many of it's female agents couldn't handle the cartridge. So the FBI created the 10mm FBI load or what some people call the 10mm Lite. Well, Smith & Wesson took the 10mm FBI load and shortened the case. And There you have the birth of the .40S&W. I carry a Glock 23C every day chambered in that Caliber. And during my time in Afghanistan, I saw PMC (Private Military Companies) use the .40S&W cartridge. It's far better than the 9mm and .45ACP.

4) THe .45ACP is a much a part of America as the .30-30 Winchester cartridge is. It's a proven man stopper. And even when used as a FMJ round. It will stop a man and put him on his @$$. The only catch with that caliber is it's size. If you want to carry more than 8 rounds, you need to use a double stack magazine. The Problem with that is that the grip of the pistol is too large for most people. That is way the 1911A1 style pistol is still the favorite platform for the .45ACP and now the 10mm cartridge.

If NATO or the US Militay was to switch to a different cartridge. I'd go with the .40S&W cartridge. But please remember. It's not the caliber, it's also the projectile that is used. if you need to stop a human with a 9mm cartridge. You need to use a expanding bullet. But since the Houghe Covention limits the use of ammountion to the FMJ. The 9mm will over penetrate the target.
August 11th, 2005  
5.56X45mm
 
 

Topic: Re: magnum bullets in handguns: practical or impractical?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kozzy Mozzy
Quote:
Originally Posted by ONERING
Currently today the standard 9mm is doing no good in a battlefield. Has there been a consideration of putting more power bullets like .357, .44 .50 in pistols instead? Is this practical and i dont mean impractical like taking a desert eagle .50 into a battlefield. Has there been consideration of a standard caliber change and conversions for magnum bullets?
Who said the 9mm is doing no good on the battlefield. Most problems with the M9 come from the magazines.
Well, you are correct with the magazine problem. When I was over in he sandbox. I took my own privately owned magazines. The Beretta 92FS/M9 is a very nice pistol. It's just that like everything else in the government armory. It's beat to sh!t and abused like a red headed stepchild. If you treat your equipment right, it will treat you right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ONERING
9mm can't pierce through car doors. it takes an average of 4 shots at the torso to kill an average man unless you hit him in the heart or the lungs. while for example, if we were able to use 9mm hps then it will reduced the shots to one if aim at the torso. Because the fragments will piece through organs and tear at the flesh, quickly and painfully killing them and saving your life. maybe perhaps you could use flatheaded rounds which will add a more kick to a target.
And the 9mm actually has a problem of over penetration. And the Four shots to a torso is complete bull. It comes down to the type of projectile being used. If you need to penetrate a car door. You use a 147Gr JHP. It will still expand once it hits a soft target, but it will also have the mass to force to punch through a thin sheet are steel. A car door in nothing but a soda can. Movies lie so much about what a bullet can do. Such as when a bullet penetrates a aircraft body. The plane will not explode. The gauges that the aircraft works with are actually bigger than a bullet hole. And I know about that because other than being a GI ground pounder. I'm also a firearms dealer and a former pilot (US Civil Air Patrol).

Added after posting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ONERING
if we were able to use 9mm hps then it will reduced the shots to one if aim at the torso. Because the fragments will piece through organs and tear at the flesh, quickly and painfully killing them and saving your life. maybe perhaps you could use flatheaded rounds which will add a more kick to a target.
"Flat Head" rounds are nothing more than FMJs. They just aren't round noised. The Hollow Point cartridge doesn't kill by fragmenting. They kill by Hydrostactic damage. A bullet does the same thing that a punch does. It is transfering the energy into the bidy. Which in turns trys to absorb the energy. That is where the organs fail. It's the same thing when to throw a water ballon at a brick wall. A hollow point will expand once it hits that target. Thus making the body stop the projectile from passing through and transfering the energy to the body. And painfully killing them has nothing to do with disabling a target. You want to disable a target. Not kill it. If that means that my shot breaks your back and prevents you from picking up your weapon. It's done it's job. A dead enemy is just that, dead. A wounded enemy requires medical attention which in turns cause two other enemy personal to remove the wounded one from the battle field. Thus aming my day easier. Dead enemy equals one removed scumbag, wounded enemy equals two removed scumbags.

I don't want to sound like a pain in the @$$. But if you don't live and work around firearms nor if you use them in your day to day operations. And if yo don't truly work in the field of combat (Military, Law Enforcement Secuirty, or Perosnal Defense) You won't understand combat and the purpose of a firearm. Killing your target is not the objetive. disabling the target is. Death is usally the result of that actions. But it is not the main objective of that action.
August 14th, 2005  
LeEnfield
 
 
Now who would want to go to war and have to rely on a pistol, a pistol is normally just a back up weapon in case you are getting over run and you don't have time to reload your main weapon or it has got a blockage and you need to keep there heads down.
August 28th, 2005  
pfcem
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by specialasiankid
i think pistols in warfare is more desperate. unless in close quarters. like take a glock 9mm full auto. thats def. useful in close quarters. but then again its a glock and somewhat unreliable. a colt .45 or a magnum would b useful, if we're thinking the other side is wearing kevlar or some other type of body armor. but then again ur armed with a m16
I just had to register & reply to this BS.

Glocks have proven to be among the most reliable handguns you can buy.

Handguns in the military are indended as a last resort weapon.

I do not see how forcing one to shoot an enemy 3 times with a FMJ round to incapacitate him is more humane than allowing one to shoot an enemy once with a HP round but that is what international law dictates.
August 31st, 2005  
EagleZtrike
 
 
They'd be pretty practical if they could control the heavy recoil