Joint Combat Pistol - Page 2




 
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January 23rd, 2006  
5.56X45mm
 
 
The 5.7x28mm and the 4.6mm are both horrible rounds.

They work great on armour but not soft targets. It's like shooting a .22 Magnum cartridge. A standard M882 NATO Ball (9X19mm FMJ) cause a larger wound cavity than the new two "super anti-armour" rounds. They are good for limited applications. The military needs a good all around cartridge. Rifles are for armour. Pistols are for self defense.

The 9X19mm round is a good cartridge if you use the right ammo. I shoot a +P JHP 147 Gr. 9x19mm round. That's what my department issues me. That's what I use.

Luckly police have no issues with the ammo that they use.
January 23rd, 2006  
major liability
 
 
5.56, since you seem to be so knowledgable, what do you think of the Gyurza round?
January 23rd, 2006  
5.56X45mm
 
 
Well, it's a larger caliber so it will inflict a larger wound cavity, but most of it's energy will leave the body. A bullet kills not by simply making a hole. It kills by the transference of energy. It's like when you get in a traffic accident. The energy of the impact is transfered into the body and that cuase hydrostatic damage. The object of a well made cartridge is penetration of the target and transfer of energy. If the bullet just zips throu the target, it makes a nice pretty hole. You can bleed out because it it but it will not stop you dead in your tracks. That is the purpose of bullets. To drop you right there and then.

Most militaries are still looking at fighting a war in 3rd generation warfare tactics. Most wars of the next century will be 4th generation warfare. Conflicts of modern hi-tech armies against simple armed terrorist. No body armour, no tanks, nothing like that.

What you need for that type of combat is a cartridge that will simply stop and disable the target in one shot. And the older calibers do that quite well.

.45 ACP is a prime example. It's a large, slow, sub-sonic round. When it hits a target. It's like getting smacked with a baseball bat.
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January 26th, 2006  
sven hassell
 
 
PS - What does England issue as a standard issue combat pistol. I forgot, I know it's something, I think the High Power. But I forgot.__________________

Browning High Power Mk. III - modern military/law enforcement variation
Browning L9A1
The Browning L9A1 is a semi-automatic pistol, firing a 919 mm cartridge from a 13-round magazine. It has been the standard sidearm of the British Army since 1957, succeeding the Enfield No 2 Mk I revolver. The weapon is a variation of the Browning Hi-Power (FN GP35).
The name with an Army designation, L9A1 - Land use, 9 mm, mArk 1.

However Special forces units have started using:
SigSauer P226 (Switzerland)


SigSauer P226



Trigger: Double-Action or Double-Action Only
Caliber: 9 mm Luger, 9x21mm, .357 SIG, .40SW Length, overall: 196mmBarrel length: 112mmWeight unloaded : 742g (9mm), 840g (.40 and .357)Capacity: 15 rounds (9mm); 12 rounds (.40 and .357)
February 23rd, 2014  
Remington 1858
 
 
I don't think that there will be a replacement for the Beretta anytime soon.
Reasons:
1. Budget cuts. There will be no room for wish list items.
2. The U.S. Government has purchased and owns 4.5 million Berettas.
3. 9mm remains the NATO standard pistol cartridge.
February 24th, 2014  
BritinAfrica
 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sven hassell
PS - What does England issue as a standard issue combat pistol. I forgot, I know it's something, I think the High Power. But I forgot.__________________

Browning High Power Mk. III - modern military/law enforcement variation
Browning L9A1
The Browning L9A1 is a semi-automatic pistol, firing a 919 mm cartridge from a 13-round magazine. It has been the standard sidearm of the British Army since 1957, succeeding the Enfield No 2 Mk I revolver. The weapon is a variation of the Browning Hi-Power (FN GP35).
The name with an Army designation, L9A1 - Land use, 9 mm, mArk 1.

However Special forces units have started using:
SigSauer P226 (Switzerland)


SigSauer P226



Trigger: Double-Action or Double-Action Only
Caliber: 9 mm Luger, 9x21mm, .357 SIG, .40SW Length, overall: 196mmBarrel length: 112mmWeight unloaded : 742g (9mm), 840g (.40 and .357)Capacity: 15 rounds (9mm); 12 rounds (.40 and .357)
It was the Browning Hi Power during my time, they also issued the Sig, I have heard that the British military are now considering issuing the Glock, which in my opinion is not a wise move.

The Browning was issued well before 1957, it actually saw service in British hands during WW2
February 24th, 2014  
Remington 1858
 
 
BritinAfrica:
You are correct the Browning P-35 Hi-Power pistol was issued to British forces during WWII. The version used had been manufactured in Canada by the Inglis Company. The Canadian version had originally been produced to arm Nationalist Chinese troops and was equipped with a detachable shoulder stock that also served as the holster. British paras and special forces managed to get a hold of some and they were used in small numbers from D-Day onward.
The newest British military pistol is a slightly modified version of the Glock 17. I agree that it is a poor choice because there will be a large number of negligent discharges if troops are allowed to carry a chambered cartridge. In time I'm sure that they will not be allowed to carry a chambered cartridge, in which case, there is no justification for replacing the Browning.
The safety issue with Glocks is that the pistol cannot be dis-assembled without pulling the trigger to release the striker. The pistol can't be dis-assembled with the striker cocked. Most people know enough to remove the magazine, but they forget about the cartridge in the chamber and that's the one that get them. The Browning has a magazine-disconnect safety so that when the magazine is removed the pistol can't be fired even if there is a cartridge in the chamber. That feature has prevented countless negligent discharges. Also, AFAIK, in armies equipped with the Browning, troops were prohibited from carrying the pistol with a chambered cartridge.