John Bolton on Ahmadinejad and the UN

[MontyB]

I only care about the United States of America.

Did you miss that in my Post?

I do not like the President of Iran, I believe the World would be a better place without the President of Iran on it, but, do I believe removing the President of Iran from the Earth is worth the loss of American Military life? No, I do not believe such.
Like I said I see Iran as a Sideshow when it comes to the World Stage, and, right now just another front for US Defense Contractors to make more money.

Oddly enough I agree, as much as some people on these boards may like us to think that Iran is threat to the world the reality is that they are nothing more than "a sideshow", even with nukes the balance of power will remain static in the region as Pakistan, India and Israel all have their own anyway.

But hey I guess without the bogeyman the nightlight sellers would be out of business I guess.

 

[Infern0]

see if you can name this country:


: have nuclear weapon + ballistic missiles

: Have made war on their neighbours

: ruled by a military dictator

: large fundamentalist Islamic population

: US ally

 

[Gator]

If Iran nukes Israel then Israel can nuke them back, if Iran nukes Saudi then.... well someone else will have to Nuke them back.

Tossing Nukes around will cause Nukes to be returned from all over the place.

I believe that if Israel were to give up her Nukes, then perhaps the United Nations could more effectively enforce the UN Mandate that the region become and stay a Nuclear Weapons Free Zone.

Right now all the other nations in the area need to do is say there is a double standard in play, which there does seem to be.

see if you can name this country:


: have nuclear weapon + ballistic missles

: ruled by a military dictator

: large fundamentalist islamic population

: US ally

I'll take who is Pakistan for 500.

 

[senojekips]

I must agree with Gator, I feel that he is right on track. Look after number one by defensive means rather than offensive. It would not please the Military Industrial sector, but it would save tens of billions of taxpayer dollars and thousands of American lives. It seems that the poor old "Grunt" is just another resource to be frittered away to achieve the political ends of a few politicians.

Of course if there were no "Bogeyman", the Neoconservative "con" would fall flat on it's face and wouldn't that be a pity?

I feel that given a little time and lack of external interference, the much of the Middle east will self destruct anyway. They will be so busy watching one another, they won't have time to worry about us Infidels.

 

[MontyB]

I must agree with Gator, I feel that he is right on track. Look after number one by defensive means rather than offensive. It would not please the Military Industrial sector, but it would save tens of billions of taxpayer dollars and thousands of American lives. It seems that the poor old "Grunt" is just another resource to be frittered away to achieve the political ends of a few politicians.

Of course if there were no "Bogeyman", the Neoconservative "con" would fall flat on it's face and wouldn't that be a pity?

I feel that given a little time and lack of external interference, the much of the Middle east will self destruct anyway. They will be so busy watching one another, they won't have tine to worry about us Infidels.

Exactly, the "radical Islamic threat" is little more than terrorist actions which most competent police forces can handle.

 

[senojekips]

I've said almost from the start, "Just lock the doors and let them pull each other apart"

If it were not for outside influences, I reckon they would be well "Into it" by now. When the West does pull them apart they just turn on us anyway, I say let 'em go then clean up the mess later. To be honest, they are just not worth the biscuit.

In the mean time, the money we are wasting trying to get them to see sense could be well spent on any perceived threat within our own respective countries.

 

[Gator]

I've said almost from the start, "Just lock the doors and let them pull each other apart"

If it were not for outside influences, I reckon they would be well "Into it" by now. When the West does pull them apart they just turn on us anyway, I say let 'em go then clean up the mess later. To be honest, they are just not worth the biscuit.

In the mean time, the money wear wasting trying to get them to see sense could be well spent on any perceived threat within our own respective countries.

Well, be nice to exact our pound of flesh from Iraq before the end of it, but, taking 500 billion in Oil off them and calling it a day would be better than nothing.

 

[senojekips]

Well, be nice to exact our pound of flesh from Iraq before the end of it, but, taking 500 billion in Oil off them and calling it a day would be better than nothing.

It might just start to pay for some of the US lives and effort that have been expended trying to save them from themselves.

I just reckon we should have stayed right out of it, there is no logic in their thinking. As phoenix80 said in another thread, they have a culture that revolves around such odd values as being acceptable to lie to people. I know we in the West have individual people who tell lies, but there is no way that it can be said that our culture acknowledges that it is an acceptable thing to do.

 

[phoenix80]

Oddly enough I agree, as much as some people on these boards may like us to think that Iran is threat to the world the reality is that they are nothing more than "a sideshow", even with nukes the balance of power will remain static in the region as Pakistan, India and Israel all have their own anyway.

But hey I guess without the bogeyman the nightlight sellers would be out of business I guess.

Like I said, it is hard to admit to having an enemy who has waged war on the west and its own people for the past 30 years. It's extremely tough to admit to it. Takes lots of guts, you know.

 

[Gator]

It might just start to pay for some of the US lives and effort that have been expended trying to save them from themselves.

I just reckon we should have stayed right out of it, there is no logic in their thinking. As phoenix80 said in another thread, they have a culture that revolves around such odd values as being acceptable to lie to people. I know we in the West have individual people who tell lies, but there is no way that it can be said that our culture acknowledges that it is an acceptable thing to do.

It's a Religious thing, in my opinion it is what happens when the State is the same as the Religion of the Nation.
Same thing happened here, as a matter of fact we slaughtered many "Godless Savages" on our way to the top..... here it's like Noah and his Ark, Adam and Eve, ect, ect, ect, there (Iran, Iraq, and such) its whatever that Religion holds as Truth.

Our Government by Force of Law has moved this Nation past all that, but, not very long ago such was not the case here in the US, even with the separation between church and state, and if the Religious Right ever gets their way we could very well move back to the days of teaching Noah, Adam and Eve, and the rest of it in Public School as Historical Fact.

 

[Infern0]

^^^
AND HERE IS THE CRUX OF IT (grrr caps)


it's fundamentalism of ALL shades that is the enemy here....doesn't matter if it's islam, or christianity...or the flying spaghetti monster. LIBERAL religion and personal faith is fine...but once you start using dogma to govern, or to drive policy, you go down a dangerous path


unfortunately, when attacked people do tend to retreat into their own fundamentalisms, especially when it comes to country...and religion.

 

[Del Boy]

I only care about the United States of America.



"As for your views on the contribution of our boys in Iraq and Afghanistan, you can stick 'em where the sun don't shine, you arse-hole"

If I lived in Nation that calls for an Offensive War, and then plans to leave a supposed Ally in that same Conflict on the Battlefield, well I may become unhinged as well.
And, seems the UK having the back of the United States of America is more in doubt at the present time.
You will also no doubt notice that I did not mention the Afghan Op, because such is a NATO Operation, and Great Britain, as a Full NATO Member, is Treaty Bound to participate as needed.[/ unquote




Gator - I am very pleased to note that my instincts are correct, as you have confirmed above that you are indeed removed by admin

The prime-minister here is just announcing our latest casualties.
You take the absolutely hypocritical stance of whinging that by arrangement Gt Britain is now reducing its numbers in Iraq, although still replacing troops and at same time you complain that the USA should run immediately, and throw nukes from distance. There is a name for that. I'd rather have John Bolton at my back than you, then I'd have only the enemy to worry about, and not being shot in the back. Are you simply disappointed that we now seem to be in the final stages of the Iraq conflict, and that the tide might be turning. How terrible for you would that be; Iran is the only obstacle. (Oops )



FOR THE RECORD.
UK PRIME MINISTER SPEAKING TODAY:-

:: The Prime Minister also announced that the Ministry of Defence would place an order for an additional 140 patrol vehicles.

:: He said there would be a new development commission to help investment and economic growth in Basra.

::Gordon Brown announced that Iraqi staff who have been employed by the British armed forces for more than five months will be able to apply for aid to help them resettle in Iraq, or elsewhere in the region "or, in agreed circumstances, for admission to the UK."

:: The Prime Minister said, after discussions with military commanders, that the number of British troops in Iraq would be reduced to 2,500 next spring.
:: "In the first, the British forces that remain in Iraq will train and mentor the Iraqi army and police force, secure supply routes, police the Iran and Iraq border and they will come to the assistance of the Iraqi security forces when called upon."

:: "The next important stage in delivering our strategy is to hand over security to Iraq and it is to move from a combat role to the west of Basra province, to overwatch which will have two stages."

:: "Our message to the government of Iraq and to the leaders of all Iraqi communities and parties is that they must make the long-term decisions needed to achieve reconciliation."

:: "We will discharge our duties to the international community and the people of Iraq."

:: "There can be little disagreement about the unanimous United Nations position affirming the right of the Iraqi people freely to determine their own political future."

:: The Prime Minister said the Government's strategy in Iraq was firstly political reconciliation, and secondly security.