Japan First




 
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November 27th, 2011  
samneanderthal
 

Topic: Japan First


Roosevelt's military advisors (Marshall, King, etc,) concurred that Japan should be assigned priority since it had forced America into the war and Germany was already fighting the USSR and Britain. Japan had a very small industry and population, compared to Germany and was fighting China and Britzin.
It made a lot more sense to concentrate the American might on Japan in order to defeat it and then concentrate on Italy and then Germany, than for America to fight simultaneously on two large fronts.
Even the huge USSR refused to fight on two fronts along its borders, why should America fight across two great oceans siultaneously.
Moreover, if America dealt with Japan, Britain could concentrate all its forces on Germany and Italy and have the safety of its former and present colonies ensured.

Nevertheless, Roosevelt decided to assign priority to Germany, swayed in great part by Churchill. Moreover, to his generals and admirals dismay, throughout 42 and most of 43 Roosevelt allowed Britain to determine priorities and policies for the western allies in Europe and Africa. Worse of all, Roosevelt fell for Stalin's threat of a separate peace if he did not receive a lot of fuel, equipment, etc, and if the western allies did not open a second front. This threat or rather bluff by Stalin was completely unfounded, since Stalin knew that Hitler wanted the USSR and would not settle for a partial peace. So Stalin had to fight or die.

Furthermore, Roosevelt assigned priority in production and deliveries (airplanes, ships, tanks, etc,) to Britain, then to the US forces in Europe, then to Stalin and finally to the Pacific theater. This put an enormous burden on the American economy and prolonged the war at least a year.

Finally, Roosevelt closed a lot of diplomatic doors by stating early in the war that the US would not settle for anything less than unconditional surrender, thus prolonging the war.

Had Roosevelt assigned military priority to the Pacific, production and delivery priority to the US forces in the Pacific, then to Britain and then to Stalin and limited L-L to 10 Billion dollars for Britain and 6 billion for the USSR, Japan would have collapsed rapidly and all the personnel and equipment in the Pacific could have been used against Germany, rapidly destroying the LW and ensuring a swift victory in Germany.
November 27th, 2011  
VDKMS
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by samneanderthal
Roosevelt's military advisors (Marshall, King, etc,) concurred that Japan should be assigned priority since it had forced America into the war and Germany was already fighting the USSR and Britain. Japan had a very small industry and population, compared to Germany and was fighting China and Britzin.
It made a lot more sense to concentrate the American might on Japan in order to defeat it and then concentrate on Italy and then Germany, than for America to fight simultaneously on two large fronts.
Even the huge USSR refused to fight on two fronts along its borders, why should America fight across two great oceans siultaneously.
Moreover, if America dealt with Japan, Britain could concentrate all its forces on Germany and Italy and have the safety of its former and present colonies ensured.

Nevertheless, Roosevelt decided to assign priority to Germany, swayed in great part by Churchill. Moreover, to his generals and admirals dismay, throughout 42 and most of 43 Roosevelt allowed Britain to determine priorities and policies for the western allies in Europe and Africa. Worse of all, Roosevelt fell for Stalin's threat of a separate peace if he did not receive a lot of fuel, equipment, etc, and if the western allies did not open a second front. This threat or rather bluff by Stalin was completely unfounded, since Stalin knew that Hitler wanted the USSR and would not settle for a partial peace. So Stalin had to fight or die.

Furthermore, Roosevelt assigned priority in production and deliveries (airplanes, ships, tanks, etc,) to Britain, then to the US forces in Europe, then to Stalin and finally to the Pacific theater. This put an enormous burden on the American economy and prolonged the war at least a year.

Finally, Roosevelt closed a lot of diplomatic doors by stating early in the war that the US would not settle for anything less than unconditional surrender, thus prolonging the war.

Had Roosevelt assigned military priority to the Pacific, production and delivery priority to the US forces in the Pacific, then to Britain and then to Stalin and limited L-L to 10 Billion dollars for Britain and 6 billion for the USSR, Japan would have collapsed rapidly and all the personnel and equipment in the Pacific could have been used against Germany, rapidly destroying the LW and ensuring a swift victory in Germany.
Your view on this is quite simplistic. Roosevelt was right to put Europe on priority No1. Britain had to be saved by all means. The Japs were quickly over extending in the huge Pacific.

In every war every commander thinks he's not getting enough.

About that unconditional surrender, think Pearl Harbor and Bataan at that time and you'll know why.
November 27th, 2011  
George
 
Japan was technologicly not a big threat, but Germany was known to be working on atomic bomb research a good reason to knock them off sooner than later.
In the Maybe Dept...instead of building a huge Fleet & fighting across all those islands they had built/sent a large force of fighters & bombers to China & wrecked the Home Islands along with bombers @ Darwin to wipe out oil production @ Balikipan things might have been a lot shorter.
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November 28th, 2011  
samneanderthal
 
Hi George,
Had Japan had priority, I am pretty sure that's what Marshall intended, to liberate Burma first then with Chinese, Indian, American troops and thousands of planes, tanks, etc, quickly wipe the Japs out of the continent (including Korea). With a naval blockade operating from China and constant bombings Japan would have surrendered, burnt or starved, without doing much damage.

The Zeroes. Ki-43s, etc, were useless agianst the Corsair, which was available for land use before te Hellcat became available for carrier use, so it would have been invaluable produced in large numbers in 1942 for land attack. Instead of making the much inferior wildcat, P-40, Airacobra, etc, the US should have made only thousands of Corsairs, which could carry heavy bombs and fight like crazy.

Precisely by defeating Japan fast, Germany would have been defeated much faster (less time to build the bomb) with the US controling most of the resources, than the years it took to fight on two front, while the Brits and Soviets used the immense resources very inefficiently.
Cheers.
November 28th, 2011  
Seehund
 
At the time Japan attacked Pearl Harbor & the US entered the second world war, most of Europe was in Nazi control. Though Hitler had not invaded Britain, Russia was in deep trouble and there was no sign of any recovery from the Nazi onslaught.

Similarly in North Africa the Germans were threatening Egypt and the Suez canal. Therefore it might be seen that the Japanese attacks, throughout Southeast Asia, are secondary, though nonetheless terrible in their effect, but they are more recent than the attacks on the nations of Europe.

Therefore the US and Britain agreed that they would make Germany the prioity target:'Beat Germany first'. It is obvious that Britain was a very long way removed geographically from Japan: and although Britain maintains a force in Burma, the hard pressed 'Forgotten 14th', the effect that Britain could bring to the war in the Far East was dwarfed by US resources. Notwithstanding that, is it possible Britain would have been able to mount D Day in 1944 without US participation ? I think it's highly unlikely. I think it remains clear that Britain was desperate, although resolute, and needed the help of a very powerful ally to defeat Germany: As I say Russia at this time was in dire straits too, and would remain so until well into 1943, post Stalingrad.
November 28th, 2011  
lljadw
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by samneanderthal
Roosevelt's military advisors (Marshall, King, etc,) concurred that Japan should be assigned priority since it had forced America into the war and Germany was already fighting the USSR and Britain. Japan had a very small industry and population, compared to Germany and was fighting China and Britzin.
It made a lot more sense to concentrate the American might on Japan in order to defeat it and then concentrate on Italy and then Germany, than for America to fight simultaneously on two large fronts.
Even the huge USSR refused to fight on two fronts along its borders, why should America fight across two great oceans siultaneously.
Moreover, if America dealt with Japan, Britain could concentrate all its forces on Germany and Italy and have the safety of its former and present colonies ensured.

Nevertheless, Roosevelt decided to assign priority to Germany, swayed in great part by Churchill. Moreover, to his generals and admirals dismay, throughout 42 and most of 43 Roosevelt allowed Britain to determine priorities and policies for the western allies in Europe and Africa. Worse of all, Roosevelt fell for Stalin's threat of a separate peace if he did not receive a lot of fuel, equipment, etc, and if the western allies did not open a second front. This threat or rather bluff by Stalin was completely unfounded, since Stalin knew that Hitler wanted the USSR and would not settle for a partial peace. So Stalin had to fight or die.

Furthermore, Roosevelt assigned priority in production and deliveries (airplanes, ships, tanks, etc,) to Britain, then to the US forces in Europe, then to Stalin and finally to the Pacific theater. This put an enormous burden on the American economy and prolonged the war at least a year.

Finally, Roosevelt closed a lot of diplomatic doors by stating early in the war that the US would not settle for anything less than unconditional surrender, thus prolonging the war.

Had Roosevelt assigned military priority to the Pacific, production and delivery priority to the US forces in the Pacific, then to Britain and then to Stalin and limited L-L to 10 Billion dollars for Britain and 6 billion for the USSR, Japan would have collapsed rapidly and all the personnel and equipment in the Pacific could have been used against Germany, rapidly destroying the LW and ensuring a swift victory in Germany.
A lot of crap
November 28th, 2011  
samneanderthal
 
Hi Seehund,
Like I said it was not the US that agreed to Churchill's suggestion of assigning priority to Germany, it was only Roosevelt, who ignored his advisors.
It was also Roosevelt who sent to the Sudan the person who pointed out the danger of helping Stalin (given the fact that the Germans had uncovered the graves of the Polish officers in Katyn and that Stalin was as aggressive and barbaric as Hitler)
November 28th, 2011  
George
 
FDR's military advisors weren't clairvoiant seers of things either. Do you know they wanted to invade & take over Brazil, but FDR overuled them & instead sold Brazil weopans to replace the German ones they had & made Brazil an Ally?
November 28th, 2011  
lljadw
 
Before the war,the military chiefs agreed to the "Germany first" policy(Rainbow 5),all the rest is trolling .
And,till 1943,more men and resources were committed in the fighting against Japan .
November 28th, 2011  
VDKMS
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by samneanderthal
Hi Seehund,
Like I said it was not the US that agreed to Churchill's suggestion of assigning priority to Germany, it was only Roosevelt, who ignored his advisors.
It was also Roosevelt who sent to the Sudan the person who pointed out the danger of helping Stalin (given the fact that the Germans had uncovered the graves of the Polish officers in Katyn and that Stalin was as aggressive and barbaric as Hitler)
Helping Stalin was bad, not helping him was worse. Roosevelt wanted Stalin to attack the Japs therefore he didn't want to upset him. Politics.
 


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