Israels Army...
Gunner13
Active member
Sherman 105: How do you know we haven't? After visiting with the Army Center for Lessons Learned (CALL) and using their database for years, I can assure you we take learning very seriously - and it doesn't really matter who did the learning, we know we can profit from it. Not that we always pay attention to the important lessons, but we do listen/observe and report back.
Plus, our situation in Iraq is somewhat different for that or the IDF as we only what to get Iraq back on its feet and then back off. Even if that takes several years, it's different from having a bunch of @#$%^&* terrorists right on your doorstep trying to destroy you every day.
Plus, our situation in Iraq is somewhat different for that or the IDF as we only what to get Iraq back on its feet and then back off. Even if that takes several years, it's different from having a bunch of @#$%^&* terrorists right on your doorstep trying to destroy you every day.
GuyontheRight
Active member
I disagree. The image the Isreali govt. projectects to Palastinians in your military is not one of hope for them. In truth I beleive it to influence more young men into orginizations like Hamas. Im not saying I dont support what you guys do, because I do, but I think politically, and it's not a stradegy the United States is willing to undertake. We still have "friends" if you will in the Middle East.
Israel
I never said we have the best gov. in the world. All i said is that we have the best army in the world. Id like to refrase that- In my opinion as far as a combination of Anti-Terror and Massive armored and aerial conflicts, per size-the Israeli army is the most cohisive,capable,efficiant unit in the world.
As to lessons learned- now that i think of their was some talk about the americans asking for info and knowledge,dont get me wrong I think the US military is a learning organization. And i apriciate your efforts in Iraq.
I never said we have the best gov. in the world. All i said is that we have the best army in the world. Id like to refrase that- In my opinion as far as a combination of Anti-Terror and Massive armored and aerial conflicts, per size-the Israeli army is the most cohisive,capable,efficiant unit in the world.
As to lessons learned- now that i think of their was some talk about the americans asking for info and knowledge,dont get me wrong I think the US military is a learning organization. And i apriciate your efforts in Iraq.
Gunner13
Active member
I think the best quote I have heard on how we should be operating in Iraq is from the USMC Commanders in southern Iraq: "No Better Friend, No Worse Enemy" (or "Play ball with us, or we will stick the bat up your @#%" if you prefer).
As long as anyone is willing to cooperate and live by the rules, we will help and protect them, but the minute you step over the line, you are toast. As long as we hold true to this and hang in the fight, I think we can convert the vast majority of the population to our side and make this work.
Israel is involved in a life or death struggle with a desperate group of people who have been sold out by almost everyone and who are ruled by morons who only know how to terrorise and can't do things any other way (witness Arafat's refusal to accept Israel's offers' even thought he was to get almost everything he wanted). :evil:
Israel may be guilty of using only military force to achieve their strategic goals, but I can't tell what other tools they are using. Certainly they do not appear to be using other methods, but I can't tell from here for sure.
As long as anyone is willing to cooperate and live by the rules, we will help and protect them, but the minute you step over the line, you are toast. As long as we hold true to this and hang in the fight, I think we can convert the vast majority of the population to our side and make this work.
Israel is involved in a life or death struggle with a desperate group of people who have been sold out by almost everyone and who are ruled by morons who only know how to terrorise and can't do things any other way (witness Arafat's refusal to accept Israel's offers' even thought he was to get almost everything he wanted). :evil:
Israel may be guilty of using only military force to achieve their strategic goals, but I can't tell what other tools they are using. Certainly they do not appear to be using other methods, but I can't tell from here for sure.
GuyontheRight
Active member
I agree, and I support Isreal's war 100%, but as long as the F-ing UN refuses to accept Isreal, theres always gonna be that conflict. And for the love of God could somone please level the Bekka Vally, all the pissed off people in one place, just get it over with :biggun:
This discussion didn't quite fit in the military jokes section...
I won't comment this topic much (even if I have my own opinions on this matter)...
But I have worked for 6 months in South Lebanon so I have learned that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has to sides..
I don't support the Palestinian acts of terror, but I don't support many of the methods Israel uses against the Palestinians either.
(a lot of these methods never reaches the media...)
This is an evil circle.
The more acts of terror the Palestinians conducts, the harder the Israelis responds, and more terrorist acts will follow..
But we must remember that what we call terrorist acts is one of the only way the Palestinians can do "war" against Israel.
I know that many men/women, both Palestinians and Israelis, at our age doesn't support this conflict at all.
So Arafat and Sharon has to realize that violence will not lead anywhere, and they have to get back to the negotiation table, with or without UN's aid!
UNIFIL, United Forces Interim Forces in Lebanon, was created in 1978..
That's 26 years ago. (Interim????)
Violence has led to nothing good down there.
http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/index.html
I won't comment this topic much (even if I have my own opinions on this matter)...
But I have worked for 6 months in South Lebanon so I have learned that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has to sides..
I don't support the Palestinian acts of terror, but I don't support many of the methods Israel uses against the Palestinians either.
(a lot of these methods never reaches the media...)
This is an evil circle.
The more acts of terror the Palestinians conducts, the harder the Israelis responds, and more terrorist acts will follow..
But we must remember that what we call terrorist acts is one of the only way the Palestinians can do "war" against Israel.
I know that many men/women, both Palestinians and Israelis, at our age doesn't support this conflict at all.
So Arafat and Sharon has to realize that violence will not lead anywhere, and they have to get back to the negotiation table, with or without UN's aid!
UNIFIL, United Forces Interim Forces in Lebanon, was created in 1978..
That's 26 years ago. (Interim????)
Violence has led to nothing good down there.
http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/index.html
Ok,but...
Israel is incapable of using enything but the IDF because the last serious offer we made(2000, Barak offerd Arafat about 95% of all the territories) was rejected and the Palestinian started somthing that can only be referd to as WAR. I agree that the Israeli Gov is too submerged in political issues with the right winged settelers to get out of the territories. I dont want to get out because of my concern for the Palestinians, but because the IDF is losing sight of its true goals and Israel is loosing what the Israeli people worked on for years and years.
All that considerd anyone that witnest gurilla warefare knows that its almost impossible to defeat, and that harsh tactics might work on the short term and fail on the long. For now Israels finger is blocking the hole in the damm, but the other hand cant reach the toll kit to repair the damm with.... I hope the situation will change so the Israelis and the Palestinians can just live in peace.
Israel is incapable of using enything but the IDF because the last serious offer we made(2000, Barak offerd Arafat about 95% of all the territories) was rejected and the Palestinian started somthing that can only be referd to as WAR. I agree that the Israeli Gov is too submerged in political issues with the right winged settelers to get out of the territories. I dont want to get out because of my concern for the Palestinians, but because the IDF is losing sight of its true goals and Israel is loosing what the Israeli people worked on for years and years.
All that considerd anyone that witnest gurilla warefare knows that its almost impossible to defeat, and that harsh tactics might work on the short term and fail on the long. For now Israels finger is blocking the hole in the damm, but the other hand cant reach the toll kit to repair the damm with.... I hope the situation will change so the Israelis and the Palestinians can just live in peace.
GuyontheRight
Active member
Arafat is the problem. His power is so limited now, hes more a image from the past. Hezbolla, Al Asqua, they have the power now. And of course, the whole Muslim world, as well as every progressive nation in the world, feels they should support the Palastinias. You know what they say. "The closer to God, the Harder It is to share him"
God
Im sorry but as for the "Hezballah" "Hammas" and "Al Aqsa Regiments" the nly thing i want them to do with god is explain them selves....I am more then willing to arrange the mitting(Yes, I know, its a rip of from swartzkoff...but at least i ripped of a good one....)
Why do free nations support terrorisem by people who seek freedom for them selves but terror to their people and other people? Why is "Hammas" less a terror group then Al-Qaeda? "Hezballah" is right now the best equiped and best organized terrorist militia in the world. they have a division(!) size force with tanks APCs long range rockets sitting on the border with Israel....These sons of you know what continue to threat Israel even after the Israeli non-conditional retreat from Lebanon.... If France, Dutchland,Germany and other europian countrys think that they can support the Palestinian cause while not supporting terror,they are wrong because all Palestinian elements are still willing to continue terror. If eaurop thinks pressing Israel to capitulate to terror and get away with it they are wrong, because in a few years Islamic Jihad-incouraged by its victory in Israel-will pop up in eaurop! Please realise-one of the resons that Islamic Jihad is attacking Israel is that they see us as the spearhead of the western world. If the spearhead will breake-they will go after the main body.
Im sorry but as for the "Hezballah" "Hammas" and "Al Aqsa Regiments" the nly thing i want them to do with god is explain them selves....I am more then willing to arrange the mitting(Yes, I know, its a rip of from swartzkoff...but at least i ripped of a good one....)
Why do free nations support terrorisem by people who seek freedom for them selves but terror to their people and other people? Why is "Hammas" less a terror group then Al-Qaeda? "Hezballah" is right now the best equiped and best organized terrorist militia in the world. they have a division(!) size force with tanks APCs long range rockets sitting on the border with Israel....These sons of you know what continue to threat Israel even after the Israeli non-conditional retreat from Lebanon.... If France, Dutchland,Germany and other europian countrys think that they can support the Palestinian cause while not supporting terror,they are wrong because all Palestinian elements are still willing to continue terror. If eaurop thinks pressing Israel to capitulate to terror and get away with it they are wrong, because in a few years Islamic Jihad-incouraged by its victory in Israel-will pop up in eaurop! Please realise-one of the resons that Islamic Jihad is attacking Israel is that they see us as the spearhead of the western world. If the spearhead will breake-they will go after the main body.
GuyontheRight
Active member
I agree, unfortunatly the "cause" of PLO like Terrorist groups such as the formentioned has been adopted as a rallying point for many liberals around the world, most evidently in Europe and the US.
As for "The closer to God, the Harder It is to share him", I belive this quote to be true. The violence in this region is unstoppable, it's zealot against zealot, moderate against moderate. 2000 years of violence can not be stopped just by "giving" parts of a country to others.
As for "The closer to God, the Harder It is to share him", I belive this quote to be true. The violence in this region is unstoppable, it's zealot against zealot, moderate against moderate. 2000 years of violence can not be stopped just by "giving" parts of a country to others.
Lol
Sorry MrmarineJ, but you have obivously never met an Israeli soldier, or else your a bad judge of character. I dont think many nations have taken the crap Israel has. I live with a Israeli Armored Core officer that fought on foot after he was injured by artillery....
Where did you get your info?
Sorry MrmarineJ, but you have obivously never met an Israeli soldier, or else your a bad judge of character. I dont think many nations have taken the crap Israel has. I live with a Israeli Armored Core officer that fought on foot after he was injured by artillery....
Where did you get your info?